TRADE: Ayton/Camara for Nurkic/Allen/Little/Johnson

[Split T]

No…we didn’t have 1st round picks to trade and Jrue is significantly more valuable than Chris.

CP3/Ayton/6 2nds/1 swap vs Jrue/Ayton/1 1st/2 Swaps

Milwaukee offer is a lot better.

[JeremyG]

We could have had one or two 1sts if we hadn’t given in to everything Brooklyn demanded.

[Drewsprocket]

No use drying over spilled milk, been reading scouting reports on Nurkic. When healthy, he is a good to great rebounder and interior defender. On offense, he is a great screener and potentially a good three point shooter. He is going to be virtually unplayable in the playoffs unless facing a similarly large and lumbering center because he can't defend in space. His post ups are frequent but unproductive.

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/2/24/2 ... suf-nurkic

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/4/21/2 ... suf-nurkic

All of this I could live with -- on offense, use him as a screener and a shooter, on defense, use him against big centers like Jokic. Against smaller centers, he is unplayable.

He won’t be unplayable in the playoffs. This isn’t five years ago. Every team has bigs again. Centers are back unless we’re playing against the Warriors. But they’re washed imo.
Suns are far deeper team and more versatile. Nurk is an excellent offensive weapon, good passing big man and getting screen assists. He’s a better fit. I wish I could say I am sad we lost Ayton’s defense, but we lost that already when he quit on the suns.
In the event of injury, Suns are poised to play with center Eubanks or just race out the gates with insane lineups - Beal, Book, KD, Gordon / Little, Bates.

[MightyMoog]

Assuming we don’t make any other trades.

Who do you guys think get the axe?

Pretty safe to assume Ish is one of them.

Who’s the other? Seems odd to be cutting someone you just signed like Metu or Bol. Also seems odd to be cutting one of the new guys like Keon Johnson.

[SunsSince92]

This all boils down to another Sarver/McD failure. They blew our first #1 overall pick.

Yep, this makes it official. Although, their cock up has avoided me the indignity of having to root for cry baby Luka. Silver linings and all that!

[Flagrant Fowl]

[Furlanfufi]

I'm getting convinced that it was a good trade. It seems to indicate we will run like hell, and that makes me happy.

[virtual9mm]

No use drying over spilled milk, been reading scouting reports on Nurkic. When healthy, he is a good to great rebounder and interior defender. On offense, he is a great screener and potentially a good three point shooter. He is going to be virtually unplayable in the playoffs unless facing a similarly large and lumbering center because he can't defend in space. His post ups are frequent but unproductive.

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/2/24/2 ... suf-nurkic

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/4/21/2 ... suf-nurkic

All of this I could live with -- on offense, use him as a screener and a shooter, on defense, use him against big centers like Jokic. Against smaller centers, he is unplayable.

He won’t be unplayable in the playoffs. This isn’t five years ago. Every team has bigs again. Centers are back unless we’re playing against the Warriors. But they’re washed imo.
Suns are far deeper team and more versatile. Nurk is an excellent offensive weapon, good passing big man and getting screen assists. He’s a better fit. I wish I could say I am sad we lost Ayton’s defense, but we lost that already when he quit on the suns.
In the event of injury, Suns are poised to play with center Eubanks or just race out the gates with insane lineups - Beal, Book, KD, Gordon / Little, Bates.

Hope you are right

[ShelC]

I think KBD or Little will be competing to be the 5th starter. Maybe Okogie. Allen will be a good fit off the bench as a combo guard.

We have A LOT of offensive options and versatility. No true PG but even Allen can handle and run some offense for us. I hope we see some creativity with the offense and lineups.

[Flagrant Fowl]

I’m weary of putting Allen on the ball. I seem to recall him being mistake prone when asked to facilitate offense. I think he’s pretty much limited to close out attacks off of the dribble.

[ShelC]

Yea I guess his TO rate was pretty high for his usage but I think he can at least handle the ball in spots if need be. I just don't think we need a true PG heavy offense with so many weapons. We should be moving the ball regularly enough to where it shouldn't be one guy pounding the ball trying to initiate everything.

[Kryptonic]

I'm getting convinced that it was a good trade. It seems to indicate we will run like hell, and that makes me happy.

Yea it was as good as it was going to get given ayton torpedoed his value.

Just curious…. What kinda return would Dallas get for a Luka trade? 5-6 first rounders and 2-3 players?

[Split T]

I’m weary of putting Allen on the ball. I seem to recall him being mistake prone when asked to facilitate offense. I think he’s pretty much limited to close out attacks off of the dribble.

He ended up with the ball on the last possession of Milwaukee’s season and didn’t look good. I agree, I wouldn’t put him on ball. I’d rather Gordon run 2nd unit offense.

[Split T]

Assuming we don’t make any other trades.

Who do you guys think get the axe?

Pretty safe to assume Ish is one of them.

Who’s the other? Seems odd to be cutting someone you just signed like Metu or Bol. Also seems odd to be cutting one of the new guys like Keon Johnson.

Ish is non-guaranteed so he’s definitely one of them. I think Keon Johnson makes the most sense next…I’d like to keep him though. I wonder if we can give him our last 2-way if he clears waivers. It would be nice to have a young, super athletic prospect to develop. The other options are Bol and Metu and I think we’d want to keep their size since we are a bit injury proned at the 5. All the other vet min signings seem more vital and also have player options so you’re paying them double to not play.

I can’t imagine it being Goodwin after we specifically wanted him in the Beal trade, but he’s the only other not fully guaranteed deal.

Still, my money is on Johnson.

[ShelC]

No use drying over spilled milk, been reading scouting reports on Nurkic. When healthy, he is a good to great rebounder and interior defender. On offense, he is a great screener and potentially a good three point shooter. He is going to be virtually unplayable in the playoffs unless facing a similarly large and lumbering center because he can't defend in space. His post ups are frequent but unproductive.

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/2/24/2 ... suf-nurkic

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/4/21/2 ... suf-nurkic

All of this I could live with -- on offense, use him as a screener and a shooter, on defense, use him against big centers like Jokic. Against smaller centers, he is unplayable.

He won’t be unplayable in the playoffs. This isn’t five years ago. Every team has bigs again. Centers are back unless we’re playing against the Warriors. But they’re washed imo.
Suns are far deeper team and more versatile. Nurk is an excellent offensive weapon, good passing big man and getting screen assists. He’s a better fit. I wish I could say I am sad we lost Ayton’s defense, but we lost that already when he quit on the suns.
In the event of injury, Suns are poised to play with center Eubanks or just race out the gates with insane lineups - Beal, Book, KD, Gordon / Little, Bates.

Yea the playoffs are about matchups. DA's been pushed around by the likes of Jokic, Adams, Valancuinas, Zubac. Nurk holds his ground better in those situations. He's just a solid, stronger body. It'll be guarding AD, KAT, maybe Dray on the perimeter he'll have a tougher time with. But that's what adjustments are for.

[Split T]

Had a day to think about it and I think I’ve landed at C+, maybe B- for the trade…I’m tentatively optimistic.

Ayton for Nurkic is a downgrade. Nobody disagrees there. It was always about the other piece. I said before if we could take a downgrade at our 4th best player to add another starter(5th best player), it would be a good trade. We didn’t do that. I don’t think Little or Allen will be our 5th best player(though I can’t say for certain with Little). So we downgraded our 4th best player and added like a 7th and 8th best player.

When it comes down to it, we need to find 8 guys that can play in the playoffs. We know 3 of them(probably 4 with EG). Here’s the options:

Guards: Grayson Allen, Jordan Goodwin, Damion Lee
Wings: Keita Bates-Diop, Yuta Watanabe, Nassir Little, Josh Okogie
Bigs: Jusuf Nurkic, Drew Eubanks, Chimeze Metu, Bol Bol

4 of those guys need to pan out. 1(and probably 2) needs to be a big. But the options kinda cover everything….

Need a shooter? Yuta, Allen, Lee
Need a POA defender? Okogie, Goodwin, Little, Allen
Need a wing defender? KBD, Little
Need a drop big? Nurkic, Eubanks
Need a switchable big? Metu
Stretch big? Bol
Need a roll man? Eubanks

I like our depth. If the 3 main guys stay healthy and play like we expect, I think we’re a top 3 team. Suns, Nuggets, Bucks…that’s my top 3. Boston/LA right there too.

[JNix]

Initial thoughts were I didnt love the trade just because I expected to get a better 2nd piece with Nurkic.

After sitting on the trade though I like it. Did we win the trade "value" wise, no, but we added a decent big and 2 good role players. Not to mention break Aytons contract into 3 contracts that make it easier to make trades later.

End of the day Ayton in Phoenix had run its course (I thought it had run its course 2 years ago) and for those that thought this time would be different, not sure what would make you think that. Ayton is who he has shown us he is. I think hell have good stats in Portland but that the fanbase will grow frustrated. Ayton has always had decent stats, but he doesnt make the winning plays, and in fact usually makes bad plays when we need it the most. Of course there are exceptions to this (Valley oop) but for the most part I think the Suns as a whole had grown tired of him. Guy is more interested in playing 2K than playing in a meaningful NBA game.

The market for Ayton was what it was, not very good. Maybe he should look in the mirror. When not many teams are interested in your services, maybe our the problem.

Good riddance Ayton is gone.

[JeremyG]

No use drying over spilled milk, been reading scouting reports on Nurkic. When healthy, he is a good to great rebounder and interior defender. On offense, he is a great screener and potentially a good three point shooter. He is going to be virtually unplayable in the playoffs unless facing a similarly large and lumbering center because he can't defend in space. His post ups are frequent but unproductive.

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/2/24/2 ... suf-nurkic

https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/4/21/2 ... suf-nurkic

All of this I could live with -- on offense, use him as a screener and a shooter, on defense, use him against big centers like Jokic. Against smaller centers, he is unplayable.

He won’t be unplayable in the playoffs. This isn’t five years ago. Every team has bigs again. Centers are back unless we’re playing against the Warriors. But they’re washed imo.
Suns are far deeper team and more versatile. Nurk is an excellent offensive weapon, good passing big man and getting screen assists. He’s a better fit. I wish I could say I am sad we lost Ayton’s defense, but we lost that already when he quit on the suns.
In the event of injury, Suns are poised to play with center Eubanks or just race out the gates with insane lineups - Beal, Book, KD, Gordon / Little, Bates.

Yea the playoffs are about matchups. DA's been pushed around by the likes of Jokic, Adams, Valancuinas, Zubac.

Yeah I hated how DA was pushed around by Valanciunas while dominating him in the playoffs last year.

[JeremyG]

End of the day Ayton in Phoenix had run its course (I thought it had run its course 2 years ago)

2 years ago? After the Finals run?

Ayton has always had decent stats, but he doesnt make the winning plays, and in fact usually makes bad plays when we need it the most.

That’s pretty hilarious considering the fact that he made the winning play in the last basketball game that we won.

[JNix]

2 years ago would be after the Mavs series. I know you have to respond to every post that says anything negative about Ayton but you're starting to make arguments out of thin air.

One winning play in one game....

I even said there are exceptions. I wish I had the energy to make a highlight reel of very bad play when we needed it but not sure theres enough time to find all those clips.