Phx-Suns.Net

pickle wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 7:28 am

I would jump all over Davion. Why Sacramento would make him available tho is beyond me.

djy2j wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 9:38 am

I know the vibe here on Flex and this guy but thought I would just post it to get the creativity wheels moving again on a Monday.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 12:04 pm

This Payne trade is a good example not to take everything the team/FO says as gospel. Not long ago the coach and FO were talking about how great Cam Payne is and how he's a part of this team going forward. And then they trade him for some 2nd rounders and a trade exception. You shouldn't just take what these people say in interviews and press conferences as if they were testifying under oath or some shit. They say nice things about the guys on the team because that's the right thing to do. But almost anybody can and will be considered for trades if it makes sense to do so.

Specifically, if you point to some quote from Vogel or Jones or Ishbia about how DA is part of our core and they can't wait to work with him in the coming season, and you cite that quote as evidence that he's not going anywhere, well, look at our dear friend Cam Payne. My point is not that DA is definitely being shipped out, just that these quotes are completely hollow and don't mean shit.

"I don't forecast or predict any other moves. [...]

"We're really excited about what we've got. We've got many superstars, we've got a great roster, of course we added Beal, of course we still have Deandre Ayton, and we have other stars, of course Durant and Booker, the superstars. [...]

"I would not anticipate any other significant changes, or really any other changes at all, going forward, but things can happen, and so I can never say never. [...]

"A lot of people call it a superteam with these three superstars, and like I said I think Deandre Ayton is a superstar too, but let's just call it the way everyone wants to talk about that..."

Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 3:33 pm

Guys with a salary that can be obtained using a TPE who might be squeezed out of playing time on their team.

Cedi Osman - $6.7M
Jae'Sean Tate - $6.5M
Rudy Gay - $6.47M
Ricky Rubio - $6.1M (Ishbia/Gilbert issue)
JaVale McGee - $5.73M
Dean Wade - $5.7M (Ishbia/Gilbert issue)
Cole Anthony - $5.5M
Chuma Okeke - $5.2M
Jalen Smith - $5.0M
Aleksej Pokusevski - $5.0M
Payton Pritchard - $4.0M (far less likely since the Smart trade)

There are a handful of guys in the minimum range.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 4:12 pm

Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 3:33 pm

Guys with a salary that can be obtained using a TPE who might be squeezed out of playing time on their team.

Cedi Osman - $6.7M
Jae'Sean Tate - $6.5M
Rudy Gay - $6.47M
Ricky Rubio - $6.1M (Ishbia/Gilbert issue)
JaVale McGee - $5.73M
Dean Wade - $5.7M (Ishbia/Gilbert issue)
Cole Anthony - $5.5M
Chuma Okeke - $5.2M
Jalen Smith - $5.0M
Aleksej Pokusevski - $5.0M
Payton Pritchard - $4.0M (far less likely since the Smart trade)

There are a handful of guys in the minimum range.

You should expand your search to teams near the tax, way apron or 2nd apron.

Tate or Pritchard would be nice, but the bummer is, had we made these moves earlier, we could have had KJ Martin or Obi Toppin for 2 second rounders.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 3:49 pm

Cap wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 1:15 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 10:56 am

Terrible trade is a stretch…Payne hasn’t been very good for the last couple years. It was definitely trying to save money, but his skill set isn’t as important anymore. It seems they like Goodwin better…and I still don’t think they are done, so we’ll see who else is on the roster come training camp. Can’t evaluate individual moves in a vacuum.

We save a little money, get a TPE that might prove valuable down the line, and send Cam somewhere he gets to play in a contract year. Seems like a better option than keeping him on the bench waiting for somebody to get hurt.

We’re not going to win a championship with Payne playing major minutes in the playoffs.

We literally almost did exactly that. He even started two major wins for us in the conference finals.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 9:07 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 8:58 pm

He’ll put up numbers because he has the ball…and especially with CP3 out last year he had to be the only ball handler on the court for awhile. His TS% in those 15 starts was still .518. That’s bad.

He made more sense for us when we had CP3 and we lacked ball handlers in our offense. We don’t really lack that anymore. Yes it would be nice to have someone like Payne as the 5th guard if Booker or Beal got hurt, but I do kinda feel like Saben Lee can fill that role nearly as well and doesn’t cost 26 million.

We also need to wait and see what happens. It very much sounds like we tried to get TJ McConnell for Payne so we may still be trying to acquire a pg. Two names I’ve seen us connected to over the last couple months at one time or another are Payton Pritchard and Davion Mitchell. Both would be acquirable into one of our TPE’s.

That is possible and it would get rid of my salary dumping criticism. But using the TPE on a PG only emphasises my other point--why not keep the fan favorite and some continuity, if you're going to spend the money anyway?

Cap wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 8:14 pm

If we use the TPE on a Payne-like player, then yeah, we might as well have kept Payne. The idea is to hold onto the TPE and see if it gives us an opportunity to pick up someone more valuable. If it doesn’t, then we’ll hang onto the $26M.

BTW, it’s crazy how the cap has gotten these days. We traded a $6.5M salary, and sent IINM $3M cash in the trade, and we’re saving $26M?

Cap wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 8:14 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 9:07 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 8:58 pm

He’ll put up numbers because he has the ball…and especially with CP3 out last year he had to be the only ball handler on the court for awhile. His TS% in those 15 starts was still .518. That’s bad.

He made more sense for us when we had CP3 and we lacked ball handlers in our offense. We don’t really lack that anymore. Yes it would be nice to have someone like Payne as the 5th guard if Booker or Beal got hurt, but I do kinda feel like Saben Lee can fill that role nearly as well and doesn’t cost 26 million.

We also need to wait and see what happens. It very much sounds like we tried to get TJ McConnell for Payne so we may still be trying to acquire a pg. Two names I’ve seen us connected to over the last couple months at one time or another are Payton Pritchard and Davion Mitchell. Both would be acquirable into one of our TPE’s.

That is possible and it would get rid of my salary dumping criticism. But using the TPE on a PG only emphasises my other point--why not keep the fan favorite and some continuity, if you're going to spend the money anyway?

If we use the TPE on a Payne-like player, then yeah, we might as well have kept Payne. The idea is to hold onto the TPE and see if it gives us an opportunity to pick up someone more valuable. If it doesn’t, then we’ll hang onto the $26M.

BTW, it’s crazy how the cap has gotten these days. We traded a $6.5M salary, and sent IINM $3M cash in the trade, and we’re saving $26M?

Cap wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 17, 2023 7:50 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 3:49 pm

Cap wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 1:15 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 16, 2023 10:56 am

Terrible trade is a stretch…Payne hasn’t been very good for the last couple years. It was definitely trying to save money, but his skill set isn’t as important anymore. It seems they like Goodwin better…and I still don’t think they are done, so we’ll see who else is on the roster come training camp. Can’t evaluate individual moves in a vacuum.

We save a little money, get a TPE that might prove valuable down the line, and send Cam somewhere he gets to play in a contract year. Seems like a better option than keeping him on the bench waiting for somebody to get hurt.

We’re not going to win a championship with Payne playing major minutes in the playoffs.

We literally almost did exactly that. He even started two major wins for us in the conference finals.

I meant with this team. If Payne is playing major minutes in the playoffs, it means Booker or Beal is out.