Phx-Suns.Net

Indy wrote:

Split T wrote:

ShelC wrote:

Split T wrote:

ShelC wrote:He should be dominating SL.

Why? Should Bender be dominating too? Maybe you're looking at Chriss wrong. He's not a creator, he's a finisher. He needs someone to get him the ball. My guess is he'd look a lot better playing with a PG like Ulis. Good thing he'll have one when the real games start.

Bender barely played last year so he gets a pass. But he's still shown more than Chriss IMO. If Chriss is just a finisher, fine. But that's still not enough. He needs to rebound, get better in traffic, get better defensively. I can find 100 guys who can finish with a dunk.

What exactly has he shown more than Chriss? Chriss has out rebounded Bender. He's out scored Bender. They've shot the same percentage. Is it the 1 more assist? This is my point, this board is filled with criticisms of Chriss, admittedly they are mostly fair, but Bender gets a pass? Neither has played well, I think we just like the idea of Bender more.

You can find 100 guys that can dunk and I can find 100 that shot 28% from 3.

Bender is getting more of a pass here because:
1) He didn't play almost 2000 minutes in the league last year.
2) He doesn't bitch and moan and give up on plays if he doesn't get a call.
3) He is white.

Very interesting.

When I called Len a BWS - I was chastised for such a rude comment.

While

3) He is white

Goes unnoticed. Different strokes for different folks. Some things never change.

Perhaps another reason we're being harder on Chriss is that he kinda reminds us of Markieff. Bender, at worst, reminds us of Skita or Zarko. Unsurprisingly, we have stronger negative feelings about the guys who are censored around here.

carey wrote:

In2ition wrote:Have you guys seen John Collins this summer?

Yes. I tried to tell you guys. Best pick & roll finisher in the draft.

Who? No, can't say I've seen him yet. Who he play for?

JustWinBaby wrote:

Indy wrote:

Split T wrote:

ShelC wrote:

Split T wrote:
Why? Should Bender be dominating too? Maybe you're looking at Chriss wrong. He's not a creator, he's a finisher. He needs someone to get him the ball. My guess is he'd look a lot better playing with a PG like Ulis. Good thing he'll have one when the real games start.

Bender barely played last year so he gets a pass. But he's still shown more than Chriss IMO. If Chriss is just a finisher, fine. But that's still not enough. He needs to rebound, get better in traffic, get better defensively. I can find 100 guys who can finish with a dunk.

What exactly has he shown more than Chriss? Chriss has out rebounded Bender. He's out scored Bender. They've shot the same percentage. Is it the 1 more assist? This is my point, this board is filled with criticisms of Chriss, admittedly they are mostly fair, but Bender gets a pass? Neither has played well, I think we just like the idea of Bender more.

You can find 100 guys that can dunk and I can find 100 that shot 28% from 3.

Bender is getting more of a pass here because:
1) He didn't play almost 2000 minutes in the league last year.
2) He doesn't bitch and moan and give up on plays if he doesn't get a call.
3) He is white.

Very interesting.

When I called Len a BWS - I was chastised for such a rude comment.

While

3) He is white

Goes unnoticed. Different strokes for different folks. Some things never change.

Not to me it didn't. And for the record, I disagree. It doesn't have anything to do with it. It's his good attitude, improved play from a year ago, and lack of experience thus far. The kid is only 19 years old.

Cap wrote:Perhaps another reason we're being harder on Chriss is that he kinda reminds us of M******f. Bender, at worst, reminds us of Skita or Zarko. Unsurprisingly, we have stronger negative feelings about the guys who are censored around here.

If Chriss had a better attitude on the court, I'd be much more forgiving. But the entitlement behavior doesn't do anything for me. He's acting like a rotten little kid. I hope it doesn't rub off on Jackson. I didn't like the extra long stare down after his block yesterday.

Superbone wrote:

carey wrote:

In2ition wrote:Have you guys seen John Collins this summer?

Yes. I tried to tell you guys. Best pick & roll finisher in the draft.

Who? No, can't say I've seen him yet. Who he play for?

Atlanta took him at #19 I believe.

Superbone wrote:

Cap wrote:Perhaps another reason we're being harder on Chriss is that he kinda reminds us of M******f. Bender, at worst, reminds us of Skita or Zarko. Unsurprisingly, we have stronger negative feelings about the guys who are censored around here.

If Chriss had a better attitude on the court, I'd be much more forgiving. But the entitlement behavior doesn't do anything for me. He's acting like a rotten little kid. I hope it doesn't rub off on Jackson. I didn't like the extra long stare down after his block yesterday.

I don't care about the stare down stuff. I'd probably prefer him not to do it but it doesn't bother me much. I hate when Chriss gets pouty and stops playing. That's when he looks like a toddler. Hopefully that's a maturity think that he grows out of.

As far as the Markieff comparisons, they end on the court. The real issues with Markieff were off the court and Chriss seems to be just fine off the court.

Superbone wrote:

Cap wrote:Perhaps another reason we're being harder on Chriss is that he kinda reminds us of M******f. Bender, at worst, reminds us of Skita or Zarko. Unsurprisingly, we have stronger negative feelings about the guys who are censored around here.

If Chriss had a better attitude on the court, I'd be much more forgiving. But the entitlement behavior doesn't do anything for me. He's acting like a rotten little kid. I hope it doesn't rub off on Jackson. I didn't like the extra long stare down after his block yesterday.

That has nothing to do w/Chriss, Jackson has his own attitude. His is different than Chriss' though, it's more of a fire, like Gary Payton had, than a pouty baby like Boogie Cousins.

Superbone wrote:

JustWinBaby wrote:

Indy wrote:

Split T wrote:

ShelC wrote:
Bender barely played last year so he gets a pass. But he's still shown more than Chriss IMO. If Chriss is just a finisher, fine. But that's still not enough. He needs to rebound, get better in traffic, get better defensively. I can find 100 guys who can finish with a dunk.

What exactly has he shown more than Chriss? Chriss has out rebounded Bender. He's out scored Bender. They've shot the same percentage. Is it the 1 more assist? This is my point, this board is filled with criticisms of Chriss, admittedly they are mostly fair, but Bender gets a pass? Neither has played well, I think we just like the idea of Bender more.

You can find 100 guys that can dunk and I can find 100 that shot 28% from 3.

Bender is getting more of a pass here because:
1) He didn't play almost 2000 minutes in the league last year.
2) He doesn't bitch and moan and give up on plays if he doesn't get a call.
3) He is white.

Very interesting.

When I called Len a BWS - I was chastised for such a rude comment.

While

3) He is white

Goes unnoticed. Different strokes for different folks. Some things never change.

Not to me it didn't. And for the record, I disagree. It doesn't have anything to do with it. It's his good attitude, improved play from a year ago, and lack of experience thus far. The kid is only 19 years old.

It is hard for us white guys to know if our whiteness adversely affects our views of others. Even if you don't think you think any differently of others, you can't know.

Indy wrote:

Superbone wrote:

JustWinBaby wrote:

Indy wrote:

Split T wrote:...I think we just like the idea of Bender more.

You can find 100 guys that can dunk and I can find 100 that shot 28% from 3.

3) He is white.

Very interesting.

When I called Len a BWS - I was chastised for such a rude comment.

While

3) He is white

Goes unnoticed. Different strokes for different folks. Some things never change.

Not to me it didn't. And for the record, I disagree. It doesn't have anything to do with it. It's his good attitude, improved play from a year ago, and lack of experience thus far. The kid is only 19 years old.

It is hard for us white guys to know if our whiteness adversely affects our views of others. Even if you don't think you think any differently of others, you can't know.

Same to you, buddy! Yeah, I agree with that. There is no way to truly know. But I can try to imagine. If you were to exchange Bender and Chriss' bodies for the last two years, I'd like to think I'd feel the same way about both players in this imagined universe.

The assertion that race plays into a player evaluation here is crazy. I've never gotten the sense that's been the case on this site. Chriss' play has been lacking, and that's being kind. Bender's been getting a pass because again, he's younger, barely played last year, and has at least shown some effort and ability offensively and defensively. Plus, the bar was lower for Bender anyways. Chriss' was a start most of last season, he should be that much better than the rest of the players out there. JJ as a rook has been our most impressive player. I don't know how anyone can watch these games and say Chriss' play has been stellar, or even average. It just hasn't been.

ShelC wrote:The assertion that race plays into a player evaluation here is crazy. I've never gotten the sense that's been the case on this site. Chriss' play has been lacking, and that's being kind. Bender's been getting a pass because again, he's younger, barely played last year, and has at least shown some effort and ability offensively and defensively. Plus, the bar was lower for Bender anyways. Chriss' was a start most of last season, he should be that much better than the rest of the players out there. JJ as a rook has been our most impressive player. I don't know how anyone can watch these games and say Chriss' play has been stellar, or even average. It just hasn't been.

I am not saying we are all blatant racists. I am saying that you can't see your own blind spots. Pretty sure that is why they are called blind spots, and not "I can see clearly spots." Even if you try to do it, you can't objectively observe things from a different vantage point than you actually have.

And to be clear, I wasn't saying that everyone here is a white guy, just that many of us are, and we see things with a certain lens. In group/out group stuff. It affects how you think even if it isn't noticed.