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And just his game as well. Sure 20 years ago he would have been a 4, but 4’s today need to be able to dribble on the perimeter, attack a close out, etc. Right now he’s a catch and shoot guy/catch and dunk guy. To his credit, he can hit shots off movement which is very nice. There are some skills there he can develop. So I won’t say he’s always gonna be a 5. I think it will always be his best position, but he can develop into a guy that can spend a good amount of time at the 4

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:36 am

And just his game as well. Sure 20 years ago he would have been a 4, but 4’s today need to be able to dribble on the perimeter, attack a close out, etc. Right now he’s a catch and shoot guy/catch and dunk guy. To his credit, he can hit shots off movement which is very nice. There are some skills there he can develop. So I won’t say he’s always gonna be a 5. I think it will always be his best position, but he can develop into a guy that can spend a good amount of time at the 4

Why wouldn't we play him as a 4? I get that some teams would be a bad matchup for him if they have a super-athletic 4, but in those cases, we could always just start Cam or play Cam more minutes at the 4. Why not have Smith be groomed as a 4/5 who would often play next to Ayton but then could also slide over to the 5 in a small lineup?

I don't think I need my 4 to be able to create and dribble on the perimeter. If he can hit 3s, that's all I need from him.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:30 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:36 am

And just his game as well. Sure 20 years ago he would have been a 4, but 4’s today need to be able to dribble on the perimeter, attack a close out, etc. Right now he’s a catch and shoot guy/catch and dunk guy. To his credit, he can hit shots off movement which is very nice. There are some skills there he can develop. So I won’t say he’s always gonna be a 5. I think it will always be his best position, but he can develop into a guy that can spend a good amount of time at the 4

Why wouldn't we play him as a 4? I get that some teams would be a bad matchup for him if they have a super-athletic 4, but in those cases, we could always just start Cam or play Cam more minutes at the 4. Why not have Smith be groomed as a 4/5 who would often play next to Ayton but then could also slide over to the 5 in a small lineup?

I don't think I need my 4 to be able to create and dribble on the perimeter. If he can hit 3s, that's all I need from him.

I would counter that Monty needs his 4 to create and dribble on the perimeter. I’m all for developing him as someone who can eventually play the 4, but I don’t think he can right now. Especially now that we have 4 other guys who are better fits at the 4(Crowder, Saric, Cam, Bridges)

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:30 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:36 am

And just his game as well. Sure 20 years ago he would have been a 4, but 4’s today need to be able to dribble on the perimeter, attack a close out, etc. Right now he’s a catch and shoot guy/catch and dunk guy. To his credit, he can hit shots off movement which is very nice. There are some skills there he can develop. So I won’t say he’s always gonna be a 5. I think it will always be his best position, but he can develop into a guy that can spend a good amount of time at the 4

Why wouldn't we play him as a 4? I get that some teams would be a bad matchup for him if they have a super-athletic 4, but in those cases, we could always just start Cam or play Cam more minutes at the 4. Why not have Smith be groomed as a 4/5 who would often play next to Ayton but then could also slide over to the 5 in a small lineup?

I don't think I need my 4 to be able to create and dribble on the perimeter. If he can hit 3s, that's all I need from him.

Here are the strictly PF or PF/C that played a lot (over 2000 minutes) last year:

Robert Covington
Harrison Barnes
Tobias Harris
PJ Tucker
Bam
Tatum
Sabonis
AD
Siakam
Brandon Ingram
Julius Randal
Aaron Gordon
Dorian Finney Smith
Giannis just missed the cut at just over 1900 minutes)

There are not many slow-footed guys on there.

Ayton has spoken multiple times about wanting to be a 4–could he be the PF with Smith taking Center?

jonh wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:37 pm

Ayton has spoken multiple times about wanting to be a 4–could he be the PF with Smith taking Center?

Ayton defends the perimeter better than Jalen, but I don’t want him out there full time. I think he’s got higher potential defending the rim than Jalen.

Digging in some more on Ty-Shon Alexander who I really like. Hope we get a chance to watch him develop.

https://hashtagbasketball.com/nba-draft ... -alexander

Can’t think of a better person to mentor him than Jevon Carter. Teach him your ways Jevon!

Why couldn't we trade down from 10 for Boston's 14 and 26 (or 30) and pick up Smith with the 14...?

Based on the rest of the offseason, I think a big part of the reason they didn't make a deal like that is because the FO didn't want to carry two rookies that they didn't rate as highly as Jalen Smith. Maybe they had intel someone before 14 liked him? Maybe they liked Smith so much more than guys who they projected available in the mid-round?

It seems like they were trying to trade back and add a good vet on a short contract but couldn't find the deal.

Smith was mocked in the mid-late teens and any one of Boston, Houston, OKC, Dallas, or Detroit could've taken him.

I think New Orleans was a risk to take him, but probably were focused on Lewis. I think Boston would have been a risk at 14, but if we traded back with them they were gonna take Haliburton. Bill Simmons thinks Boston would have given us 14, 26, and 30. That does seem like a big missed opportunity.

We could have drafted Smith at 14, Bane at 26, and traded 30 for a future pick like Boston did. At that point, you just sign one of Moore and Galloway. Or sign both and waive Nader. Think everyone would have been ok with that, and you replenish the pick you lost in the CP3 trade.

I don't think Jones was looking to add as many rooks, even older ones. We have rotational NBA guards in Moore and Gallo who we know can play and play a certain way in terms of fitting in Monty's style. We're arguably as deep as any team in the league right now 1-3.

ShelC wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:31 am

I don't think Jones was looking to add as many rooks, even older ones. We have rotational NBA guards in Moore and Gallo who we know can play and play a certain way in terms of fitting in Monty's style. We're arguably as deep as any team in the league right now 1-3.

You guys got your Gallo afterall. Just not the one you thought.

I just think this is another missed opportunity to win on the margins. We seem to lose every one of those transactions. I'll get off my gripe train and try to be more positive moving forward.

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:00 am

I think New Orleans was a risk to take him, but probably were focused on Lewis. I think Boston would have been a risk at 14, but if we traded back with them they were gonna take Haliburton. Bill Simmons thinks Boston would have given us 14, 26, and 30. That does seem like a big missed opportunity.

We could have drafted Smith at 14, Bane at 26, and traded 30 for a future pick like Boston did. At that point, you just sign one of Moore and Galloway. Or sign both and waive Nader. Think everyone would have been ok with that, and you replenish the pick you lost in the CP3 trade.

That would have bee smart and better long term. But that's not how Jones operates.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 25, 2020 10:42 am

ShelC wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:31 am

I don't think Jones was looking to add as many rooks, even older ones. We have rotational NBA guards in Moore and Gallo who we know can play and play a certain way in terms of fitting in Monty's style. We're arguably as deep as any team in the league right now 1-3.

You guys got your Gallo afterall. Just not the one you thought.

I don't like the Crowder signing, but I'll definitely take him over Gallinari.

INFORMER wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 26, 2020 10:23 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:00 am

I think New Orleans was a risk to take him, but probably were focused on Lewis. I think Boston would have been a risk at 14, but if we traded back with them they were gonna take Haliburton. Bill Simmons thinks Boston would have given us 14, 26, and 30. That does seem like a big missed opportunity.

We could have drafted Smith at 14, Bane at 26, and traded 30 for a future pick like Boston did. At that point, you just sign one of Moore and Galloway. Or sign both and waive Nader. Think everyone would have been ok with that, and you replenish the pick you lost in the CP3 trade.

That would have bee smart and better long term. But that's not how Jones operates.

Jones has been GM for 2 years, he had to clean the mess left by McD, reinstall a culture, I hope he has long term plans. But I can understand it wasn't his immediate priority. Plus most GM don't go long term until they've secured the job.

Strike while the iron is hot. CP3 and Crowder are win now pieces for a team ready for a push - while Book, Mikal, Cam, DA, Smith are the future core (as of now). Jones didn't add a bunch of 30+ year olds around Book in a half-hearted attempt just to make the playoffs now while mortgaging the future (see: Knicks/Melo 2013). So this is less "fool's gold" and more taking advantage of a good opportunity. Jones turned the team around in 2 seasons no matter how low the bar was. Didn't take a 4-5 yr plan of tanking, waiting for projects to develop or saving capspace to throw at stars.