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Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:40 am
by Indy
I will say this--Cam doesn't look like a stretch at 11 right now.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:43 am
by specialsauce
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
Forget stats. Watch them. You still would?
To me Cam is oozing with modern potential. He does everything well that this game is tailored to now. My opinion is partly based on his play in the bubble though. I thought he showed great improvement on D and the boards there.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:22 am
by Indy
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:43 am
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
Forget stats. Watch them. You still would?
To me Cam is oozing with modern potential. He does everything well that this game is tailored to now. My opinion is partly based on his play in the bubble though. I thought he showed great improvement on D and the boards there.
If you are only looking at those 8 games, sure I would probably go with Cam. But that is because I saw a lot more of him (every minute he played) than I did Clarke. But the season on a whole, Clarke played better. Rebounded better. Scored better. Defended better. He's longer and more athletic.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:25 am
by Split T
I still think Clarke is better, but I’m very happy with Cam. At this point there is maybe 2 guys that went after Cam we maybe should have taken(Herro and Clarke) and probably 4 or 5 guys that went ahead of him that shouldn’t have. So I’m fine calling it a good pick.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
by ShelC
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:36 am
by Ring_Wanted
Imagine if your frontcourt was so potent that Cam is backing up a better PF and SF.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:29 pm
by Indy
Ring_Wanted wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:36 am
Imagine if your frontcourt was so potent that Cam is backing up a better PF and SF.
I agree that we need a better 4 to be a top 4 team in the West.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:30 pm
by Indy
ShelC wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:03 pm
by Superbone
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:30 pm
ShelC wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker.
No he doesn't. Let's give him an equal sample size and frequency before making such crazy claims.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:12 pm
by Indy
Superbone wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:03 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:30 pm
ShelC wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:21 am
After seeing Cams development this year, you guys would still rather have Clarke?
I think it’s a no brainer that Cam is better for this team and has an easier path to becoming a long-time starter in this league.
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker.
No he doesn't. Let's give him an equal sample size and frequency before making such crazy claims.
He does. Why is it a crazy claim? It isn't a knock on Booker. You can say Booker takes tougher 3s, or the defense focuses on him. But that doesn't change the percentage. You don't get more points for taking harder shots. It is saying that he can keep people honest from 3, and still take advantage of his size and length and rebounding and defense.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:39 pm
by O_Gardino
If Cam stays healthy and continues to grow as a defender, he'll have a terrific career. I'm over my jealousy about passing on Clarke.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:41 pm
by Indy
O_Gardino wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:39 pm
If Cam stays healthy and continues to grow as a defender, he'll have a terrific career. I'm over my jealousy about passing on Clarke.
I hope he continues to surprise us (and the league) and make it a no question conversation over the next few years.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:45 pm
by Superbone
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:12 pm
Superbone wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:03 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:30 pm
ShelC wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:36 am
From a stats perspective, the only thing Cam Johnson is better at so far is 3P%. Clarke beats him in everything else, and they played a similar number of games with a similar number of minutes, and started a similar number of games. Yes, I would rather have Clarke right now. I hope that changes soon.
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker.
No he doesn't. Let's give him an equal sample size and frequency before making such crazy claims.
He does. Why is it a crazy claim? It isn't a knock on Booker. You can say Booker takes tougher 3s, or the defense focuses on him. But that doesn't change the percentage. You don't get more points for taking harder shots. It is saying that he can keep people honest from 3, and still take advantage of his size and length and rebounding and defense.
Because you're making a definitive statement after Clarke's first season. I would have been fine with it if you said Clarke shot a better percentage this year than Booker did (for his career? this season? What were you even comparing?) But to say simply, "Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker" is crazy talk.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:51 pm
by Indy
Superbone wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:45 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:12 pm
Superbone wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:03 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:30 pm
ShelC wrote: ↑Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:26 am
I think Cam's shooting, now and in the future, makes things very tough for defenses in trying to guard Book and Ayton. He's a knockdown shooter and if his dribble drive game improves, he's that much more dangerous. But that shooting ability combined with his size is a huge advantage to have.
Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker.
No he doesn't. Let's give him an equal sample size and frequency before making such crazy claims.
He does. Why is it a crazy claim? It isn't a knock on Booker. You can say Booker takes tougher 3s, or the defense focuses on him. But that doesn't change the percentage. You don't get more points for taking harder shots. It is saying that he can keep people honest from 3, and still take advantage of his size and length and rebounding and defense.
Because you're making a definitive statement after Clarke's first season. I would have been fine with it if you said Clarke shot a better percentage this year than Booker did (for his career? this season? What were you even comparing?) But to say simply, "Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker" is crazy talk.
It is definitive. Clarke makes more of his 3 point shots than Booker. Is that better? I am not sure how that is different than Clarke shoots better from 3 than Booker. And yeah, that could change, like any stats with any active player.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:52 pm
by O_Gardino
Brandon Clarke makes a 3 pointer almost every other game. 0.4 3PM per game.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:53 pm
by Indy
Doesn't change the percentages. And at no point did I say I would want him taking it over Booker. Someone said Clarke couldn't keep the defense honest with his 3, and I used facts to disagree.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:55 pm
by Superbone
Indy, I'll tell you the biggest mistake you're making is not following Shel's rules for this thread!
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:57 pm
by Indy
Where did I say something bad about this team!?! Saying that Clarke is doing well, and Cam is beating all expectations is a positive thing.
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:57 pm
by ShelC
Re: Your 2019-2020 Phoenix Suns
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:01 pm
by Indy
