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One kind of depressing Ayton thing, is that I don't know if he got better at anything this year. Did he develop any additional skills? Enhance any others? His D is worse and his offense is basically the same.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:56 pm

One kind of depressing Ayton thing, is that I don't know if he got better at anything this year. Did he develop any additional skills? Enhance any others? His D is worse and his offense is basically the same.

His paycheck was enhanced.

Slightly increased free throw rate and assist rate.

Split T wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 10, 2023 5:23 pm

Slightly increased free throw rate and assist rate.

That's something!

I’m more talking about skills than numbers. Is he a better shooter than last year? Ball-handler? More fluid post moves? Counter-moves? We only get 1 dribble-drive every 4 games. The hook shot he had last year (and I think he was more accurate with it). Same with the bunnies.

Development curves are different for every player, but it’s a little frustrating that he appears to have plateaued at his age.

He did seem to be playing more aggressively the last few weeks. But overall he took some major steps back this year. I’ve been ok with him the last month and a half though and especially since KD arrived.

In the last 17 games, since he returned from his last injury, he’s:

19.8 points, 10.9 rebounds, 1.5 assists, and 1.0 blocks. He’s shooting 62% from the field and 80% from the ft line. He’s got a .643 TS%

The Spurs took down the Nuggets tonight.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:56 pm

One kind of depressing Ayton thing, is that I don't know if he got better at anything this year. Did he develop any additional skills? Enhance any others? His D is worse and his offense is basically the same.

I think his hands are better; he bobbles passes less than before. And I do think he refines his post/interior moves a bit each year. But yeah, he didn't "make a leap" or anything. And his defense seems a bit worse than before, which is unfortunate since that's what we need from him the most now.

Joker getting lit up

Great article, even if it’s coming from a Sixers(Embiid) slant. Brings up the same issue I have with advanced stats in basketball. They are all biased.

I watched that Jokic "bad defense" clip. In some of the segments, yes, Jokic doesn't do an excellent defensive job. But in a lot of the clips, there's a smaller perimeter player who's blown by his man and Jokic is now providing help defense. And Jokic provides "meh" help defense, doesn't strongly jump up into the way of the smaller player, lets the player get his shot off and score. I think cherry-picking these kinds of highlights is kind of BS. Jokic shouldn't necessarily commit hard to all of these plays. In many cases the smaller player is whizzing by at high speed; if Jokic jumped out strongly on all of these, he'd inevitably smack the smaller guy on a lot of these plays, and he'd just get called for a defensive foul. Part of defense is knowing when you've already lost the play and not committing unnecessary fouls on guys who already have you beat. That's what I see in a lot of these plays.

I haven't spent much time crunching MVP numbers so I don't know if I would choose Jokic over Embiid or Giannis this season, but the MVP case for Jokic has never been that he was a lock-down defensive player. He's an average, passable defensive player, and an absolutely phenomenal offensive player. He's had his team at #1 in the West for most of the whole year, and they look like Finals favorites if not title favorites. He makes everybody on that team better, and he puts up insane numbers every night.

Except a lot of people try to claim that Jokic is in fact a great defensive player. He’s better offensively than Embiid and Giannis but he’s significantly worse defensively. The question is whether his lead on offense makes up for the lack of defense.

Also it’s not cherry picking, those are all from the same game. I don’t know how you can watch that and think it’s some sort of fake news or misleading video. Ya it’s not capturing the times he played well, but those were all clips from the same game against maybe the worst team in the nba. He clearly had a bad defensive game.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:56 pm

One kind of depressing Ayton thing, is that I don't know if he got better at anything this year. Did he develop any additional skills? Enhance any others? His D is worse and his offense is basically the same.

He’s added a 2-3 dribble spin move in the paint. Or at least I don’t recall him using it nearly as much in previous seasons.

Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:43 pm

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 10, 2023 4:56 pm

One kind of depressing Ayton thing, is that I don't know if he got better at anything this year. Did he develop any additional skills? Enhance any others? His D is worse and his offense is basically the same.

He’s added a 2-3 dribble spin move in the paint. Or at least I don’t recall him using it nearly as much in previous seasons.

Thank you. We found something.

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:18 pm

Except a lot of people try to claim that Jokic is in fact a great defensive player. He’s better offensively than Embiid and Giannis but he’s significantly worse defensively. The question is whether his lead on offense makes up for the lack of defense.

Also it’s not cherry picking, those are all from the same game. I don’t know how you can watch that and think it’s some sort of fake news or misleading video. Ya it’s not capturing the times he played well, but those were all clips from the same game against maybe the worst team in the nba. He clearly had a bad defensive game.

Great? Perhaps not. But the Nuggets give up significantly fewer points per possession with him on the floor than on the bench. Is that just coincidence?

Cap wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 7:08 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:18 pm

Except a lot of people try to claim that Jokic is in fact a great defensive player. He’s better offensively than Embiid and Giannis but he’s significantly worse defensively. The question is whether his lead on offense makes up for the lack of defense.

Also it’s not cherry picking, those are all from the same game. I don’t know how you can watch that and think it’s some sort of fake news or misleading video. Ya it’s not capturing the times he played well, but those were all clips from the same game against maybe the worst team in the nba. He clearly had a bad defensive game.

Great? Perhaps not. But the Nuggets give up significantly fewer points per possession with him on the floor than on the bench. Is that just coincidence?

On/off numbers are not great… Greatly influenced by other players and especially the bench behind him. Maybe they shouldn’t have signed DeAndre Jordan. And those defensive numbers flip in the playoffs. Denver is significantly worse defensively with Jokic on the court…coincidence?

I’m watching Nuggets-Nets, I’ll tell you if Jokic is good at D

The nuggets announcers are idiots though. The guy just called Jokic, Nurkic

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:46 pm

Cap wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 7:08 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:18 pm

Except a lot of people try to claim that Jokic is in fact a great defensive player. He’s better offensively than Embiid and Giannis but he’s significantly worse defensively. The question is whether his lead on offense makes up for the lack of defense.

Also it’s not cherry picking, those are all from the same game. I don’t know how you can watch that and think it’s some sort of fake news or misleading video. Ya it’s not capturing the times he played well, but those were all clips from the same game against maybe the worst team in the nba. He clearly had a bad defensive game.

Great? Perhaps not. But the Nuggets give up significantly fewer points per possession with him on the floor than on the bench. Is that just coincidence?

On/off numbers are not great… Greatly influenced by other players and especially the bench behind him. Maybe they shouldn’t have signed DeAndre Jordan. And those defensive numbers flip in the playoffs. Denver is significantly worse defensively with Jokic on the court…coincidence?

It's not like MPJ or Murray are helping in anyway either.