Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

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EDC
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by EDC »

JCSunsfan wrote:
EDC wrote:
JCSunsfan wrote: Watson was on the radio talking about young players and their development. He said that a lot of coaches like to control and limit the development of young players. They limit their minutes and roles, bring them along slowly, pull them quickly for mistakes. Its because the coach wants to be in control. Watson said his philosophy is different. He believes that his responsibility is not NOT limit young players. Provide guidance and help, but then get out of the way and give them every opportunity to succeed.
He did a stellar job of limiting Bender for most of the season. We would be in a better place right now if he would have also given minutes to Bender like he did for Chriss.

Not to mention these comments directly contradict the "we don't want our young guys to hit at the same time."

Watson is good at saying the right thing at the right time. Regardless if it is true or not. You just have to take everything he says with a grain of salt.
So, why do you think he preferred Chriss over Bender? Think that the fact that the PF position was wide open, while the sf position that Bender is best suited for had PJ and TJ ahead of him. While I get having a gripe about playing PJ ahead of the young guys, TJ is a young player that deserves time just like Bender.

Or, do you think Bender should play pf ahead of Chriss, or center ahead of Tyson, Len, and Sauce?
You make it sound like PJ had never played power forward for us before. Why put Chriss ahead of all those guys you listed? I will tell you why because he was a lottery pick and needs time to get better. You make it sound like it was one or the other. It could have been both but Watson didn't want to make it both. Which means he didn't follow that philosophy he went on about.

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Mori Chu
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Mori Chu »

You might say that Watson's coaching skills are a bit ... elementary.

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carey
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by carey »

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:You might say that Watson's coaching skills are a bit ... elementary.
9/10 would read again.
Go Suns!

Og Snus!

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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Split T »

Chriss was better than bender from the get go. I would have liked to see bender get more minutes, but he didn't deserve them over chriss

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In2ition
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by In2ition »

Split T wrote:Chriss was better than bender from the get go. I would have liked to see bender get more minutes, but he didn't deserve them over chriss
Idk, there were quite a few times where Bender was outplaying Chriss on both sides of the ball early in the season and it led to extended benching of Bender and more opportunities for Chriss.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Split T »

In2ition wrote:
Split T wrote:Chriss was better than bender from the get go. I would have liked to see bender get more minutes, but he didn't deserve them over chriss
Idk, there were quite a few times where Bender was outplaying Chriss on both sides of the ball early in the season and it led to extended benching of Bender and more opportunities for Chriss.
I don't remember these times. Chriss had his struggles defensively, but he's always been a better offensive player.

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Cap
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Cap »

Split T wrote:
In2ition wrote:
Split T wrote:Chriss was better than bender from the get go. I would have liked to see bender get more minutes, but he didn't deserve them over chriss
Idk, there were quite a few times where Bender was outplaying Chriss on both sides of the ball early in the season and it led to extended benching of Bender and more opportunities for Chriss.
I don't remember these times. Chriss had his struggles defensively, but he's always been a better offensive player.
Bender's ball handling, passing, moving without the ball, decision making, and so on all look pretty good. His offense just has one glaring flaw, which is that he can't throw the ball into the ocean. It's surprising and disappointing, because I thought shooting was supposed to be one of his stronger skills when we drafted him. If he can just improve his shooting, he'll be a terrific offensive role player.

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JustWinBaby
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by JustWinBaby »

Superbone wrote:
JustWinBaby wrote:Way to lower expectations for your boy.
Sorry, I can't take you seriously. He's our coach whether you like it or not. Grow up.
Youngster, I have been following basketball way before you were born. You are the one that should not be taken seriously. Your support of this guy is quite unbelievable.

He is our coach and I wish him well but the facts are that he has accomplished nothing as our head coach other than the players seem to like him. These are the same players that do not pass the ball, play defense or win games. I would like him too, if I were them as well. I expect that they would not like Greg Popovich very much.

What are your expectations? What decade should we expect our team to be at least a 500 team again? How many years does Watson need to be a head coach for us to expect a 500 team?

I would be expecting at least a 500 record form any head coach coaching this team next year. Why should I not expect the same from Watson? I do not think talent is the issue any more. Injuries could change everything.
I wanted Monty as our coach since D'Antoni left town. Nice choice James Jones.

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3rdside
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by 3rdside »

Cap wrote:
Split T wrote:
In2ition wrote:
Split T wrote:Chriss was better than bender from the get go. I would have liked to see bender get more minutes, but he didn't deserve them over chriss
Idk, there were quite a few times where Bender was outplaying Chriss on both sides of the ball early in the season and it led to extended benching of Bender and more opportunities for Chriss.
I don't remember these times. Chriss had his struggles defensively, but he's always been a better offensive player.
Bender's ball handling, passing, moving without the ball, decision making, and so on all look pretty good. His offense just has one glaring flaw, which is that he can't throw the ball into the ocean. It's surprising and disappointing, because I thought shooting was supposed to be one of his stronger skills when we drafted him. If he can just improve his shooting, he'll be a terrific offensive role player.
Don't know if you missed this from an earlier post -

Bender was shooting .321% on 3pt shots and .475% on 2pt shots pre injury - not great but not awful either - which is pretty different to his end of season numbers meaning he shot a relatively large number of times post injury.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Until around half the reg season, Chriss was a brutal liability on both sides of the court. Bender was weak, but his fundamentals and defensive focus were better for the team during that stretch, yet he barely played (in part because Tucker was still getting high minutes). Hard to see justification for such a lost season by our #4.

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Mori Chu
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Mori Chu »

It doesn't have to be about who is better between Chriss and Bender. Of course we want both of them to succeed. I just want to see lots of minutes for both of them next year.

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Superbone
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Superbone »

JustWinBaby wrote:
Superbone wrote:
JustWinBaby wrote:Way to lower expectations for your boy.
Sorry, I can't take you seriously. He's our coach whether you like it or not. Grow up.
Youngster, I have been following basketball way before you were born. You are the one that should not be taken seriously. Your support of this guy is quite unbelievable.

He is our coach and I wish him well but the facts are that he has accomplished nothing as our head coach other than the players seem to like him. These are the same players that do not pass the ball, play defense or win games. I would like him too, if I were them as well. I expect that they would not like Greg Popovich very much.

What are your expectations? What decade should we expect our team to be at least a 500 team again? How many years does Watson need to be a head coach for us to expect a 500 team?

I would be expecting at least a 500 record form any head coach coaching this team next year. Why should I not expect the same from Watson? I do not think talent is the issue any more. Injuries could change everything.
First of all, I appreciate the youngster comment, old timer. I haven't heard anything like that for years. I'm just giving him a chance unlike most here. You expect him to be Popovich after 1.3 years of NBA coaching experience. You guys love to slam him every opportunity you get.

And your comments about me defending Watson are rich, Mr. "D'Antoni can do no wrong and I have to defend him every single time somebody makes a slight at him."
"Be Legendary."

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O_Gardino
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by O_Gardino »

Superbone wrote:Ulis was named NBA Western Conference Rookie of the Month.

http://www.nba.com/article/2017/04/14/w ... kies-month
Congrats, Tyler. The award is well deserved and the fans are behind you.
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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carey
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by carey »

https://twitter.com/krishansonRCF/status/853359570177019904

Go Suns!

Og Snus!

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Ring_Wanted »

All the moves. Armani has all the moves except reverse layups. It's actually incredible how advanced his offensive game is.

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Cap
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Cap »

Leads the league in and-1s on isos, by a comfortable margin, and hasn't even started getting superstar calls yet. Wow.

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TOO
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by TOO »

Ring_Wanted wrote:All the moves. Armani has all the moves except reverse layups. It's actually incredible how advanced his offensive game is.
Indeed it is, especially since he was essentially a spot up shooter at UK. How did Cal not utilize him more? I wonder how much he's added to his game since getting drafted.
Jones and Vogel gotta go.

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O_Gardino
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by O_Gardino »

carey wrote:

https://twitter.com/krishansonRCF/status/853359570177019904

HUNG
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by Indy »

JCSunsfan wrote:
JustWinBaby wrote:
Superbone wrote:I expect Thibs to be a much better coach than Watson at this point in their careers. Thibs has many years of experience as an assistant and head coach at this point. I agree that Watson has a lot to learn especially on the strategy side of things. Will he get there in his first head coaching stint with the Suns? I don't know but he seems like the type of person that wants to continue to grow and improve. I'm willing to give him some time with this team to see how/if they can grow together.
I think Watson has had enough time to learn this coaching thing. I expect another upgrade in talent this summer via the young guys who are another year older and the influx of more talent via the draft and maybe free agency.

Gambo said today that he expects 41 wins next year which would be a 17 game improvement. We could have really won several more games if we did not sit key players while obviously tanking.

Assuming no major injuries at this point I think that 41 wins is a reasonable goal. This certainly will be revisited after we complete our summer moves.
Watson was on the radio talking about young players and their development. He said that a lot of coaches like to control and limit the development of young players. They limit their minutes and roles, bring them along slowly, pull them quickly for mistakes. Its because the coach wants to be in control. Watson said his philosophy is different. He believes that his responsibility is not NOT limit young players. Provide guidance and help, but then get out of the way and give them every opportunity to succeed.

I totally agree with him. Watson is the type of coach whose W-L record will never look good, but he will make a huge difference in the overall success of a team.

As far as wins next year. I could see a huge improvement.

Booker will be a year older, and he has really settled into his role.
We will add an impact rookie, no matter where we draft.
Chriss is advancing at an astounding rate. I expect him to have huge positive impact next summer.
There will be some sort of trade that will help.
We can shore up some areas with free agency.
Alan Williams role will increase.
Ulis has established himself in the back up pg role and will have an impact.

Barring injuries, there is nothing there that indicates decline, and a lot that indicates improvement.

I think 35-40 wins, maybe even 41.
How can you be a successful team when you don't win?

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ShelC
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Re: Suns News: Week 25 - The End of '16-'17

Post by ShelC »

Talk to Isiah Thomas when he was running the Knicks.

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