2018 Trade Deadline

Discussion of the league and of our favorite team.
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In2ition
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by In2ition »

Did I see that it's being reported that Kemba Walker is now on the trading block?

For the right deal, I would do that. I think he would be good on the Suns, but they would really need to shore up their front court. If that happens, Kemba should be successful here and help Booker take another step. Of course, the Suns can't give up their future just for short term gain this year that Kemba would give.
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ShelC
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by ShelC »

I LOVE Kemba but I'm not sure I'd put him in the backcourt with Booker. Both would be too ball dominant and ISO-centric. You'd almost need Jackson to take another step and become a ball handler/distributor while those guys played off the ball (similar to how they use Batum). LOVE LOVE LOVE Kemba tho. Imagine if we still had Bledsoe? Maybe they'd make that swap?

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The Bobster
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by The Bobster »

I would be willing to trade Monroe (expiring contract), Chriss (team option for 2019-20), Milwaukee's #1 (or Miami's #1 if they want one this year) and even the Suns 2018 #2 for Walker (signed through 2018-19) and Michael Williams (a contract they reportedly want to dump as it runs through 2019-20).

The Milwaukee/Miami pick looks to be late #1 whenever we get it, M. Williams is nothing special but he would give the Suns some competent minutes until Bender is ready to play more, and Monroe becomes even more expendable when Alan Williams returns to the roster. How willing they'd be to give up on Chriss and how much interest Charlotte would have in him is the real question.
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In2ition
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by In2ition »

ShelC wrote:I LOVE Kemba but I'm not sure I'd put him in the backcourt with Booker. Both would be too ball dominant and ISO-centric. You'd almost need Jackson to take another step and become a ball handler/distributor while those guys played off the ball (similar to how they use Batum). LOVE LOVE LOVE Kemba tho. Imagine if we still had Bledsoe? Maybe they'd make that swap?
I'm not saying that Kemba is as good as a passer as Nash, or that he really needs to be. I just think if he had better options on offense to orchestrate, you would see his assist numbers go up and his ISO's go down. Same for Booker with more gravitation forces on the floor with him. He is such a good shooter and shot creator that it would be foolish to double Booker and leave 3 on 4 with his options being Kemba, Warren, one of the young bigs and possible high draft pick. Teams are already having troubles from time to time with the strategy of doubling Booker with just Warren, occasionally Jackson, intermittent emerging young bigs with range, and another outside threat at guard.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
"Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them." ~ Frederick Douglass

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n4th4n
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by n4th4n »

Woj is reporting that the Hornets are prioritizing getting off of bad contracts. That should make the Monroe expiring look very appealing to them. Speaking of bad contracts... how brutal does that Batum signing look now. They are going to be paying that dude $27 million in 2021. Ugh. Their other egregious include Marvin Williams and Dwight Howard.

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LazarusLong
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by LazarusLong »

The Bobster wrote:I would be willing to trade Monroe (expiring contract), Chriss (team option for 2019-20), Milwaukee's #1 (or Miami's #1 if they want one this year) and even the Suns 2018 #2 for Walker (signed through 2018-19) and Michael Williams (a contract they reportedly want to dump as it runs through 2019-20).

The Milwaukee/Miami pick looks to be late #1 whenever we get it, M. Williams is nothing special but he would give the Suns some competent minutes until Bender is ready to play more, and Monroe becomes even more expendable when Alan Williams returns to the roster. How willing they'd be to give up on Chriss and how much interest Charlotte would have in him is the real question.
Works for me. Williams has a good skill set, but low revving motor. Maybe Chandler could motivate him :P

Seriously, the Suns have the right amount and kinds of assets to make this doable.
Window is open again ... blue skies ahead?

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Split T
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Split T »

Would you include our 2018 #1 pick for Kemba? Landing Kemba probably moves that pick into the late lotto (10-14). I think I'd rather trade for Kemba in the off-season, and keep our 2018 #1. But we wouldn't be able to offer Monroe's expiring as part of a deal in the off-season.

My offer:
1. Monroe
2. One of Chriss or Bender (I'd probably prefer to keep Bender for his shooting)
3. We take Marvin Williams contract
4. Draft picks (I'd offer two of Miami '18, Miami '21, Milwaukee '18)

I'd try to avoid offering our own pick this year as it will be pretty valuable, but definitely less valuable if we have Kemba

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specialsauce
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by specialsauce »

There are two things I wouldn’t trade for Kemba: any of our OWN unprotected first rounders, and Booker.

I would trade any 1 of: Warren, Chriss, Bender, Jackson

in a package deal with one of:

Miami/Mil 2018

Plus

any of our second rounders

And take on a bad contract.

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Split T
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Split T »

You wouldn't trade our future picks? Or just not unprotected? I would offer up a future pick without hesitation. I'd protect it slightly, as I think trading anything unprotected is dumb, but it'd be like top 7 or maybe even just top 3.

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In2ition
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by In2ition »

Ideally, I would allow the season to play out, win the lottery and then trade for Kemba with the Milwaukee and Miami pick and some second rounders along with Chandler and/or Dudley.

I'd have a hard time trading this year's pick or next year's pick(because the rules change offers better chances for the Suns to move into the top 5 if they are good and because it may be interestingly deep while they allow High Schoolers to enter again).
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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Re: Kemba.

I don't love the fit with Booker or the short window it gives us to build a competitive team before his contract is up. Also, adding Walker would sink us even lower in the 2018 lotto, while not giving us a real chance of making the playoffs.

If it costs us basically Chriss and another non premium asset, I'd be really tempted, but that's probably too little.

I also fear Walker would be exposed some in the West, kind of what happens with Teague.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Also, NO to trading any of our own picks unless lottery protected.

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specialsauce
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by specialsauce »

Ring_Wanted wrote:Re: Kemba.

I don't love the fit with Booker or the short window it gives us to build a competitive team before his contract is up. Also, adding Walker would sink us even lower in the 2018 lotto, while not giving us a real chance of making the playoffs.

If it costs us basically Chriss and another non premium asset, I'd be really tempted, but that's probably too little.

I also fear Walker would be exposed some in the West, kind of what happens with Teague.

Your first three paragraphs are the same sentiments people made about Kyrie. Let’s not chicken out because he may leave in 2 years. If we can’t put together a good team that’ll entice him to stay in 2 years then forget it Booker is definitely gone too.

And no, I don’t think Kemba is as good as Kyrie.

And yes, I’m bringing that up again.

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n4th4n
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by n4th4n »

specialsauce wrote:
Ring_Wanted wrote:Re: Kemba.

I don't love the fit with Booker or the short window it gives us to build a competitive team before his contract is up. Also, adding Walker would sink us even lower in the 2018 lotto, while not giving us a real chance of making the playoffs.

If it costs us basically Chriss and another non premium asset, I'd be really tempted, but that's probably too little.

I also fear Walker would be exposed some in the West, kind of what happens with Teague.

Your first three paragraphs are the same sentiments people made about Kyrie. Let’s not chicken out because he may leave in 2 years. If we can’t put together a good team that’ll entice him to stay in 2 years then forget it Booker is definitely gone too.

And no, I don’t think Kemba is as good as Kyrie.

And yes, I’m bringing that up again.
If we trade for Kemba and resign him in two years, we are essentially locked into a team in which Booker and Kemba as our core. They will consume over 50% of our cap. Is that core good enough to be anything other than to finish as a 4 seed for a year or two before Kemba drops off and his contract becomes an albatross? I don't think so. Kemba has been good enough to get his team... 2 more wins than the Suns right now. The Hornets chronically underperform. Plus, I don't want to do anything that makes us better this year. Adding a real difference make through the draft on a cost-controlled contract is exactly what we need if we legitimately want high-level sustained success.

The more I think about it, the more I'd rather be the third team in this trade, using the Monroe expiring to facilitate while extracting assets. We can make big moves after that draft. Kemba is not the player to go all-in on.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Ring_Wanted »

n4th4n wrote:If we trade for Kemba and resign him in two years, we are essentially locked into a team in which Booker and Kemba as our core. They will consume over 50% of our cap. Is that core good enough to be anything other than to finish as a 4 seed for a year or two before Kemba drops off and his contract becomes an albatross? I don't think so. Kemba has been good enough to get his team... 2 more wins than the Suns right now. The Hornets chronically underperform. Plus, I don't want to do anything that makes us better this year. Adding a real difference make through the draft on a cost-controlled contract is exactly what we need if we legitimately want high-level sustained success.

The more I think about it, the more I'd rather be the third team in this trade, using the Monroe expiring to facilitate while extracting assets. We can make big moves after that draft. Kemba is not the player to go all-in on.
This is where I am too. I don't care if people see me as a coward. We still need another premium prospect, ideally at PF/C, before we are ready to pull the trigger on win now moves. Otherwise we are going to be the Blazers.

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Split T
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Split T »

I like kemba, I think he would make a great offensive pairing with booker. He is essentially the B+ version of Kyrie. I do have reservations about the trade killing our picks value as I think there is a drop off at 9/10 in this draft and adding kemba puts us at like 12 most likely. I'd be way more in favor of this trade in the offseason after we land a top 6 pick. We'll see what happens, but my guess is we pursue him and I won't be surprised if kemba is on our team by the deadline.

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O_Gardino
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by O_Gardino »

Oh my god, if we pass up Kyrie to get Kemba, I might have to tune out for the season.
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n4th4n
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by n4th4n »

Hows about we help move Kemba to NY and take Frank back in exchange.

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Split T
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Split T »

Well the difference is we could possibly get Kemba for a lot less than what Cleveland wanted for Kyrie. The trade could be Monroe/Chriss/Milwaukee pick and a few 2nd rounders for Kemba and Marvin. That's essentially Bledsoe/Chriss and a couple 2nd's. So the difference is we switch Jackson for Chriss and we don't move our 2018 1st.

If Charlotte insists on our 2018 1st, then we should definitely say no.

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Cap
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Re: 2018 Trade Deadline

Post by Cap »

n4th4n wrote:Hows about we help move Kemba to NY and take Frank back in exchange.
That would be cool.

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