Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Discussion of the league and of our favorite team.

Who is your first choice if we land #1

Doncic
35
57%
Ayton
25
41%
Bagley
0
No votes
JJJ
0
No votes
Young
0
No votes
Bamba
0
No votes
Other
1
2%
 
Total votes: 61

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In2ition
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by In2ition »

Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:48 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:38 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:34 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:29 pm
Don't get me wrong, I love Doncic and players like that. I think he would do wonders for this Suns team. In fact I think of Doncic as a combo of Magic and Bird. Whereas LeBron was Magic and MJ. And I believe the Suns will win with him.

I guess I think you are not going to beat the Warriors at their own game. I think you'll have to flip the script on them and punish them and create a team in a different way. GS doesn't have a player that will be able to eliminate Ayton, and will be forced to try to put their 7th or 8th best player on the court to try to match up with him. This hurts them, and then slows the game down a little if Ayton keeps going to the line while hitting freethrows.
doesn't that go both ways? and maybe he shooting will get way better, but taking 1 3P a game, and only making 34% at the college distance isn't a great indicator that he will be able to shoot 3s in the NBA. That will limit his ability to pull good defenders away from the rim, or even honor him on PnR.
I find his numbers from 3 pt a bonus, but I wouldn't expect him to come into the NBA and launch 5 3s a game or just hang out on the perimeter because of the promise of a decent %. Wouldn't that limit his effectiveness? You put him into good positions to succeed and the team to succeed.
Limiting him to any one type of scoring would limit his effectiveness, no matter what that type is. Just because he develops a three-point shot into an important part of his arsenal doesn’t mean he’s going to spend all his time just hanging out on the perimeter. But if the defense is giving him the shot and he can hit it, he should put himself in a position to take it.
I agree that becoming a 3 level scorer helps, as it keeps the defense from sagging when the player is outside the 3 pt line.
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Superbone
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Superbone »

AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:12 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 10:58 am

How many rings in the last 10 years has come with a dominant center?
Would you consider Gasol, Bynum or Duncan dominate centers?

Honestly, I think this has more to do with many other reasons like not having good coaching of post positions, just not having great centers prospects for more than 10 years, and decent post players not being able to shoot freethrows, which limits their effectiveness at the end of the game [r punishing defenders by putting them in foul trouble. I will agree that some of the rule changes has limited the effectiveness of the traditional center, but how many athletes with this size have shown up in the NBA in the past 15 years? Combine that with the skill set he has, it's been far too long, imo.
His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Not everybody, AIG. Look around the internet. I'd say the majority of Suns fans (by a good margin) think Ayton should be the pick over Doncic.
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In2ition
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by In2ition »

KAT, Ayton, or Doncic? If all equal the #1 pick
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
"Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them." ~ Frederick Douglass

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Cap
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Cap »

Superbone wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:29 pm
AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:12 pm

Would you consider Gasol, Bynum or Duncan dominate centers?

Honestly, I think this has more to do with many other reasons like not having good coaching of post positions, just not having great centers prospects for more than 10 years, and decent post players not being able to shoot freethrows, which limits their effectiveness at the end of the game [r punishing defenders by putting them in foul trouble. I will agree that some of the rule changes has limited the effectiveness of the traditional center, but how many athletes with this size have shown up in the NBA in the past 15 years? Combine that with the skill set he has, it's been far too long, imo.
His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Not everybody, AIG. Look around the internet. I'd say the majority of Suns fans (by a good margin) think Ayton should be the pick over Doncic.
For the record, I’m not against Ayton. I’m undecided.

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Vladimir_Taltos
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Vladimir_Taltos »

We need a good big and a good distributor...one of the two has yo be excellent. I am not overly committed to any particular person. My angst is I want to see vision and gamesmanship from team management that gets the most net value out of our picks and assests...trade down, up, trade for players, I don't care how we get there. Our assets to me are our 3 picks, maybe 2 future firsts, and TJ or Jackson. Prefer TJ, but I'm open with the right paybacks. Get it done.

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Indy
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Indy »

In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:31 pm
KAT, Ayton, or Doncic? If all equal the #1 pick
I think I would take KAT. But the less years worries me a bit. That is the only thing making it not 100% for me.

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Indy
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Indy »

AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:12 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 10:58 am

How many rings in the last 10 years has come with a dominant center?
Would you consider Gasol, Bynum or Duncan dominate centers?

Honestly, I think this has more to do with many other reasons like not having good coaching of post positions, just not having great centers prospects for more than 10 years, and decent post players not being able to shoot freethrows, which limits their effectiveness at the end of the game [r punishing defenders by putting them in foul trouble. I will agree that some of the rule changes has limited the effectiveness of the traditional center, but how many athletes with this size have shown up in the NBA in the past 15 years? Combine that with the skill set he has, it's been far too long, imo.
His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Crowded at the SF? And our only needs are C and PG? We need everything besides a starting 2. Nothing we have looks to be a great fit around Booker. They are all, "well, if he just adds [insert huge hole in his game], he can be a key part of a great team."

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AmareIsGod
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by AmareIsGod »

Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:50 pm
AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:12 pm

Would you consider Gasol, Bynum or Duncan dominate centers?

Honestly, I think this has more to do with many other reasons like not having good coaching of post positions, just not having great centers prospects for more than 10 years, and decent post players not being able to shoot freethrows, which limits their effectiveness at the end of the game [r punishing defenders by putting them in foul trouble. I will agree that some of the rule changes has limited the effectiveness of the traditional center, but how many athletes with this size have shown up in the NBA in the past 15 years? Combine that with the skill set he has, it's been far too long, imo.
His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Crowded at the SF? And our only needs are C and PG? We need everything besides a starting 2. Nothing we have looks to be a great fit around Booker. They are all, "well, if he just adds [insert huge hole in his game], he can be a key part of a great team."
Did we not draft JJ last season, the 2nd best player from a performance perspective last season as a rookie? What position does he play? Who's the guy he's pushed out of the starting lineup? TJ. Both SF's. Do you draft Doncic and run him out there at PG with Booker at SG and JJ at SF? We need a PG and a big. How you can say only SG is covered when SF is definitely our 2nd strongest area is being obtuse.
What is smallball? I play basketball. I'm not a regular big man. I can switch from the center to the guards. The game is evolving. I'd be dominAyton if the WNBA would let me in. - Ayton

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Indy
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Indy »

AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 2:15 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:50 pm
AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm


His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Crowded at the SF? And our only needs are C and PG? We need everything besides a starting 2. Nothing we have looks to be a great fit around Booker. They are all, "well, if he just adds [insert huge hole in his game], he can be a key part of a great team."
Did we not draft JJ last season, the 2nd best player from a performance perspective last season as a rookie? What position does he play? Who's the guy he's pushed out of the starting lineup? TJ. Both SF's. Do you draft Doncic and run him out there at PG with Booker at SG and JJ at SF? We need a PG and a big. How you can say only SG is covered when SF is definitely our 2nd strongest area is being obtuse.
I think you would be surprised if comparing the two guys and who was more effective on the floor. And neither give us what we need from the 3 on offense if we want to be a top 8 team in the West.

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Flagrant Fowl
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Flagrant Fowl »

Positions are mostly insignificant in today's NBA. I'm taking the skilled 6'8" guy almost every time.
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Mori Chu
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Mori Chu »

AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 2:15 pm
Did we not draft JJ last season, the 2nd best player from a performance perspective last season as a rookie? What position does he play? Who's the guy he's pushed out of the starting lineup? TJ. Both SF's. Do you draft Doncic and run him out there at PG with Booker at SG and JJ at SF? We need a PG and a big. How you can say only SG is covered when SF is definitely our 2nd strongest area is being obtuse.
Yes, you start Doncic at PG, Booker at SG, and JJ at SF. That's a pretty nice 1-3 combination. All can score, all can pass, 2/3 can shoot, 2/3 can defend above average, 2/3 can rebound above average.

I acknowledge that it still leaves us with needs in the frontcourt, but you address those by internal development (Bender, Chriss, Warren), mixed with FA signings or trades (Jordan, Capela), mixed with possibly other draft picks.

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JustWinBaby
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by JustWinBaby »

AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 2:15 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:50 pm
AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:59 pm
JCSunsfan wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:41 pm
Cap wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:26 pm


His size may be overrated. He stands 7’1”, but his standing reach is “only” 9’3”, and wingspan 7’5”. Compare this to Rudy Gobert at 9’9” and 7’9”. Or Mo Bamba at 9’7.5” and 7’10”.
Those numbers don't make sense to me. Do they measure standing reach on tip toe and some people have longer feet than others?
It also disregards his 44" vertical that launches his "overrated" size. People will do all they can to sell themselves on a narrative.

Doncic didn't play PG in Euro League. He's not playing PG here. You draft him and he joins a crowded SF position. You still need a PG and a big. You draft Ayton and you just need a PG. Not sure why everyone thinks Doncic solves all of our problems but Ayton is just a liability.
Crowded at the SF? And our only needs are C and PG? We need everything besides a starting 2. Nothing we have looks to be a great fit around Booker. They are all, "well, if he just adds [insert huge hole in his game], he can be a key part of a great team."
Did we not draft JJ last season, the 2nd best player from a performance perspective last season as a rookie? What position does he play? Who's the guy he's pushed out of the starting lineup? TJ. Both SF's. Do you draft Doncic and run him out there at PG with Booker at SG and JJ at SF? We need a PG and a big. How you can say only SG is covered when SF is definitely our 2nd strongest area is being obtuse.
Let's put it this way. If Lebron or Ben Simmons were in this draft along with Ayton, whom would you take? Even with our current roster. Would you pass on Lebron due to having Booker and Jackson? Would you pass on Simmons?

I think INFO put it the best way for me. This team is in need of an engine to get it going. A lot of us think that Doncic could be that engine and I do not think that Booker, Jackson or Ayton are capable of that job. That is not to discount any of their abilities, they all are or are going to be fantastic players. Just as Ayton is a rare prospect, so is Doncic. Who is more important to our future and our current biggest need?

In a perfect world we get them both, we need them both.
I wanted Monty as our coach since D'Antoni left town. Nice choice James Jones.

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Split T
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Split T »

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 5:09 pm
AmareIsGod wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 2:15 pm
Did we not draft JJ last season, the 2nd best player from a performance perspective last season as a rookie? What position does he play? Who's the guy he's pushed out of the starting lineup? TJ. Both SF's. Do you draft Doncic and run him out there at PG with Booker at SG and JJ at SF? We need a PG and a big. How you can say only SG is covered when SF is definitely our 2nd strongest area is being obtuse.
Yes, you start Doncic at PG, Booker at SG, and JJ at SF. That's a pretty nice 1-3 combination. All can score, all can pass, 2/3 can shoot, 2/3 can defend above average, 2/3 can rebound above average.

I acknowledge that it still leaves us with needs in the frontcourt, but you address those by internal development (Bender, Chriss, Warren), mixed with FA signings or trades (Jordan, Capela), mixed with possibly other draft picks.
I think saying Doncic can defend at an above average level is quite a stretch at this point

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TOO
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by TOO »

Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:48 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:31 pm
KAT, Ayton, or Doncic? If all equal the #1 pick
I think I would take KAT. But the less years worries me a bit. That is the only thing making it not 100% for me.
KAT and Booker would be incredible offensively, we'd shore up some rebounding, yeah the money stinks, but it will all catch up that way eventually. We'd still stink defensively, but we'd also have 2 of the absolutely top best under the age of 25, throw Jackson in there, maybe we pursue a trade for a PG and I think we're rolling.
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by O_Gardino »

In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 12:29 pm
Don't get me wrong, I love Doncic and players like that. I think he would do wonders for this Suns team. In fact I think of Doncic as a combo of Magic and Bird. Whereas LeBron was Magic and MJ. And I believe the Suns will win with him.

I guess I think you are not going to beat the Warriors at their own game. I think you'll have to flip the script on them and punish them and create a team in a different way. GS doesn't have a player that will be able to eliminate Ayton, and will be forced to try to put their 7th or 8th best player on the court to try to match up with him. This hurts them, and then slows the game down a little if Ayton keeps going to the line while hitting freethrows.
That's a great description of Doncic.

Obviously, I'm on the other side of the argument, but I do think Ayton has the tools to be a really good player.
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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In2ition
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by In2ition »

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 5:52 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:48 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:31 pm
KAT, Ayton, or Doncic? If all equal the #1 pick
I think I would take KAT. But the less years worries me a bit. That is the only thing making it not 100% for me.
KAT and Booker would be incredible offensively, we'd shore up some rebounding, yeah the money stinks, but it will all catch up that way eventually. We'd still stink defensively, but we'd also have 2 of the absolutely top best under the age of 25, throw Jackson in there, maybe we pursue a trade for a PG and I think we're rolling.
I pretty much know where this forum will land, but if you do a #1 for KAT trade, would you consider trading for Lonzo, as Magic says everyone is available?

Then you could have a Ball, Booker, Jackson, Chriss, KAT starting lineup. Or even pull a FA like George for 3/4. I just don't know what it would take to trade for Lonzo. His defense, passing, rebounding, and promise of an outside shot would be tempting with that crew.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by O_Gardino »

Flagrant Fowl wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 4:00 pm
Positions are mostly insignificant in today's NBA. I'm taking the skilled 6'8" guy almost every time.
What if there is a skilled 7'1" guy?
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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In2ition
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by In2ition »

Or how about trading up for Porter jr. if Doncic is #1? This way you continue the switching everything 1-5 6'7" or taller lineup.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Indy »

In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 6:00 pm
TheOriginalOriginal wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 5:52 pm
Indy wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:48 pm
In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:31 pm
KAT, Ayton, or Doncic? If all equal the #1 pick
I think I would take KAT. But the less years worries me a bit. That is the only thing making it not 100% for me.
KAT and Booker would be incredible offensively, we'd shore up some rebounding, yeah the money stinks, but it will all catch up that way eventually. We'd still stink defensively, but we'd also have 2 of the absolutely top best under the age of 25, throw Jackson in there, maybe we pursue a trade for a PG and I think we're rolling.
I pretty much know where this forum will land, but if you do a #1 for KAT trade, would you consider trading for Lonzo, as Magic says everyone is available?

Then you could have a Ball, Booker, Jackson, Chriss, KAT starting lineup. Or even pull a FA like George for 3/4. I just don't know what it would take to trade for Lonzo. His defense, passing, rebounding, and promise of an outside shot would be tempting with that crew.
I would depending on what they want for him. I hate his management team, but it always depends on the price.

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Re: Who would you pick if we (OGW-willing) landed #1?

Post by Indy »

In2ition wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 6:03 pm
Or how about trading up for Porter jr. if Doncic is #1? This way you continue the switching everything 1-5 6'7" or taller lineup.
I would love to be able to switch everything.

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