All Things Ayton

[Indy]

Lol, my point wasn't to say he's actually a better three-point shooter (right now) than all of those teammates.

It was just in response to how everyone used to say that he doesn't have any offensive weapons, is not developing his offensive game, etc. It does prove that he is capable of adding a three-point shot to his game, and should add value to his already--according to most league execs--max contract value. Hopefully in the eyes of James Jones as well (if Jones is actually making the decision).

At least as late as last offseason, people were arguing Ayton's value was less than that of Rudy Gobert, who is 0-11 from three in his career.

I don't think anyone here was arguing his value is less than Rudy's. Like 99% of the people on this site would take Ayton over Rudy. The argument was that he wasn't worth what Rudy is getting paid (~40M/year).

[JeremyG]

Lol, my point wasn't to say he's actually a better three-point shooter (right now) than all of those teammates.

It was just in response to how everyone used to say that he doesn't have any offensive weapons, is not developing his offensive game, etc. It does prove that he is capable of adding a three-point shot to his game, and should add value to his already--according to most league execs--max contract value. Hopefully in the eyes of James Jones as well (if Jones is actually making the decision).

At least as late as last offseason, people were arguing Ayton's value was less than that of Rudy Gobert, who is 0-11 from three in his career.

I don't think anyone here was arguing his value is less than Rudy's. Like 99% of the people on this site would take Ayton over Rudy. The argument was that he wasn't worth what Rudy is getting paid (~40M/year).

But the market sets Rudy's value. So if Rudy's value hasn't decreased since he signed his contract (and I see no reason to think it has), then technically his contract is his value.

[Split T]

The Jazz outbid themselves for him. Nobody else could even give him the contract he got. I thought it was dumb then and it’s looking especially dumb now that they might be blowing up the team next year.

[Indy]

Lol, my point wasn't to say he's actually a better three-point shooter (right now) than all of those teammates.

It was just in response to how everyone used to say that he doesn't have any offensive weapons, is not developing his offensive game, etc. It does prove that he is capable of adding a three-point shot to his game, and should add value to his already--according to most league execs--max contract value. Hopefully in the eyes of James Jones as well (if Jones is actually making the decision).

At least as late as last offseason, people were arguing Ayton's value was less than that of Rudy Gobert, who is 0-11 from three in his career.

I don't think anyone here was arguing his value is less than Rudy's. Like 99% of the people on this site would take Ayton over Rudy. The argument was that he wasn't worth what Rudy is getting paid (~40M/year).

But the market sets Rudy's value. So if Rudy's value hasn't decreased since he signed his contract (and I see no reason to think it has), then technically his contract is his value.

I get what you are saying, but to Split's point, Rudy's value isn't set by his contract. His value is what the GMs/Owners around the league think he is worth. His current contract is what Utah was willing to pay him. I don't think you could find any other team in the league that would do that if they could.

None of that is saying anything bad about your man, though. He has been really good for us, was fantastic in most of the playoffs last year, and I expect him to be fantastic again.

[Split T]

The playoffs really will determine Ayton’s future. If he can prove he can consistently be the 2nd or 3rd most impactful player game to game, then give him the max. If there’s multiple games where he’s the 4th most impactful or less…I think the suns front office will stand strong on not giving him a max deal.

I’m gonna wait till after the playoffs to finalize my opinion, but there was a lot of things he did this year that gave me encouragement that he might still turn into the player we’d need him to be on a max deal. His 2022 regular season was much better than 2021 regular season…so if we see a jump again in the playoffs, he should be absolutely fantastic this postseason.

[Shabazz]

Ayton's come a long way on a few fronts this season. The first is the jumper, which is MUCH more reliable all the way out to 3. I used to cringe when he'd settle for his middies, but now he's pretty automatic. The second is that hook shot of his, which is near unstoppable. His post game last season was pretty basic and usually resulted in turn-and-face jumpers or turnaround jumpers. He's much more comfortable now taking 2 dribbles to the middle of the key and going to the hook. He's also much better at reading the defense off the short-roll and either shooting a floater or kicking it out to the 3-point line.

I still think he's too conservative when it comes to attacking off the dribble from the top of the key. He busts it out like once every 6-7 games and I don't know why he doesn't do it more often. If he can unlock that and add it to the hook and the more reliable jumper (which should open up his dribble-drive opportunities), he'd be a pretty well-rounded offensive center (and worth the max, IMO).

[SunsRIt]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

[Shabazz]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

[Flagrant Fowl]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

[Split T]

I’m pretty sure Ayton will get a max, question is how that happens…I see 3 options

1. We decide he’s worth it and give it to him
2. We don’t think he’s worth it so we S&T him somewhere that does
3. He signs a match offer sheet(fwiw I’m almost positive we’d match this and trade him later) I also think this is by far the least likely of the scenarios.

[Cap]

The playoffs really will determine Ayton’s future. If he can prove he can consistently be the 2nd or 3rd most impactful player game to game, then give him the max. If there’s multiple games where he’s the 4th most impactful or less…I think the suns front office will stand strong on not giving him a max deal.

What if he’s terrific, but 4th most impactful because Paul, Booker and Bridges are playing like gods?

[Shabazz]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

It's dangerous because another team can give him a 3 year max with an out after 2. Then you don't even get to maximize the back-end of the deal.

[Cap]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

It's dangerous because another team can give him a 3 year max with an out after 2. Then you don't even get to maximize the back-end of the deal.

We’d still be able to outbid any other team when he becomes a UFA in 2024.

[Split T]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

It's dangerous because another team can give him a 3 year max with an out after 2. Then you don't even get to maximize the back-end of the deal.

Match it and trade him later if need be

[Split T]

The playoffs really will determine Ayton’s future. If he can prove he can consistently be the 2nd or 3rd most impactful player game to game, then give him the max. If there’s multiple games where he’s the 4th most impactful or less…I think the suns front office will stand strong on not giving him a max deal.

What if he’s terrific, but 4th most impactful because Paul, Booker and Bridges are playing like gods?

Then you can make an exception…or maybe you don’t need to because Bridges is better and cheaper.

[Superbone]

Good to see you, Cap!

[Shabazz]

An offer sheet max is less than the Suns can offer. That’s where we see this going. He will get the max that another team can offer and we will match. That will determine his worth.

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

It's dangerous because another team can give him a 3 year max with an out after 2. Then you don't even get to maximize the back-end of the deal.

We’d still be able to outbid any other team when he becomes a UFA in 2024.

I’d rather he not be a UFA with an axe to grind against the Suns after his age 25 season. If he keeps improving he’s going to get silly money from someone and the difference in what the Suns can pay may not be that compelling. Players in that situation (like Gordon Hayward) have left money on the table to leave.

[Cap]

It's a dangerous approach.

But he's right. I expect the Suns will match a max offer sheet from another team. Then it will be up to Ayton to decide if he wants to play meaningful basketball with Hall of Fame teammates in Phoenix.

If you're saying its a dangerous approach to sign Ayton to a max contract, then I agree.

It's dangerous because another team can give him a 3 year max with an out after 2. Then you don't even get to maximize the back-end of the deal.

We’d still be able to outbid any other team when he becomes a UFA in 2024.

I’d rather he not be a UFA with an axe to grind against the Suns after his age 25 season. If he keeps improving he’s going to get silly money from someone and the difference in what the Suns can pay may not be that compelling. Players in that situation (like Gordon Hayward) have left money on the table to leave.

Would he still have an axe to grind, two years after a Suns decision that didn’t really cost him anything?

[JeremyG]

Suns' Deandre Ayton on New Contract: 'I Put That in God’s Hands and My Agent’s Hands'

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/100 ... ents-hands

[Indy]

I kind of wish he would put it in his hands and go out and outplay everyone else on this team, or at least outplay inferior talent on the other team.