Getting paid for 7 years with one franchise is pretty good.
Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
"Be Legendary."
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
#notank
#sarverout
#sarverout
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan
- Aztec Sunsfan
- Posts: 1880
- Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:56 pm
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
Nobody puts a gun on the guy’s head to stay here so long. All this time he got to collect a GM paycheck, pretty sure he had a great parking spot and awesome business cards reading “Phoenix Suns General Manager”.
I have worked under people on Sarver’s mold, as many more people have. And you either fight for stablish yourself and work trough these conditions, or develop a street cred big enough to leave under your own terms to pursue another job (Steve Kerr did it wonderfully to Sarver). You can’t claim the accolades when results are going great and ask for a pass when they’re not. Even if it’s true that your boss was a key factor on both scenarios. If you take a position, it’s with both the good and the bad, and proceed to make it better. This kid had no previous direct experience for the job, so he would never be a candidate for a position in an ideal situation. Opportunities are like this, you grab them full of imperfections, because the perfect situations usually are self resolved with already planned solutions.
I never used hashtags against the guy, I think he tried his best, and I respect it, but he obviously spent many time fixing his own mistakes and actually never developed an identity for the team, just a big collection of assets that never fulfilled the promise to became on a big Star. Many kept waiting on this to happen, many gave up on it. Sarver has the right to demand results, even if he is a big obstacle on the way, his GM is not collecting his check and using that parking spot for free. You said you can deliver, yo either do it or pay the price, but you don’t cry big bad wolf. Once again, Steve Kerr is a very good example.
I have worked under people on Sarver’s mold, as many more people have. And you either fight for stablish yourself and work trough these conditions, or develop a street cred big enough to leave under your own terms to pursue another job (Steve Kerr did it wonderfully to Sarver). You can’t claim the accolades when results are going great and ask for a pass when they’re not. Even if it’s true that your boss was a key factor on both scenarios. If you take a position, it’s with both the good and the bad, and proceed to make it better. This kid had no previous direct experience for the job, so he would never be a candidate for a position in an ideal situation. Opportunities are like this, you grab them full of imperfections, because the perfect situations usually are self resolved with already planned solutions.
I never used hashtags against the guy, I think he tried his best, and I respect it, but he obviously spent many time fixing his own mistakes and actually never developed an identity for the team, just a big collection of assets that never fulfilled the promise to became on a big Star. Many kept waiting on this to happen, many gave up on it. Sarver has the right to demand results, even if he is a big obstacle on the way, his GM is not collecting his check and using that parking spot for free. You said you can deliver, yo either do it or pay the price, but you don’t cry big bad wolf. Once again, Steve Kerr is a very good example.
Last edited by Aztec Sunsfan on Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:56 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
Sorry, have to disagree.
1) IT signing was basically stepping on a rake. We already had two great PGs and it made zero sense to get a third.
2) Earl Watson. He and Terry Porter probably share the trophy for worst Suns coach ever.
3) Absurd attempts to sign Lebron and Carmelo. Couldnt even get a meeting with Lebron. After the Aldridge failure, he should have realized we werent going to be able to sign a superstar and we would need to trade for talent.
4) Morrii, Bledsoe, Dragic disasters. How many times can we recall a player publicly stating he didnt want to be here BEFORE McDonough?
5) Kyrie Ivring: Should have been a Sun
1) IT signing was basically stepping on a rake. We already had two great PGs and it made zero sense to get a third.
2) Earl Watson. He and Terry Porter probably share the trophy for worst Suns coach ever.
3) Absurd attempts to sign Lebron and Carmelo. Couldnt even get a meeting with Lebron. After the Aldridge failure, he should have realized we werent going to be able to sign a superstar and we would need to trade for talent.
4) Morrii, Bledsoe, Dragic disasters. How many times can we recall a player publicly stating he didnt want to be here BEFORE McDonough?
5) Kyrie Ivring: Should have been a Sun
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
No, I'm out this year. No time. You kids have fun!
#gardinoout
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
I think this is not really fair. I'm not a huge McD fan, but ...da_suns_fan wrote: ↑Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:59 pmSorry, have to disagree.
1) IT signing was basically stepping on a rake. We already had two great PGs and it made zero sense to get a third.
2) Earl Watson. He and Terry Porter probably share the trophy for worst Suns coach ever.
3) Absurd attempts to sign Lebron and Carmelo. Couldnt even get a meeting with Lebron. After the Aldridge failure, he should have realized we werent going to be able to sign a superstar and we would need to trade for talent.
4) Morrii, Bledsoe, Dragic disasters. How many times can we recall a player publicly stating he didnt want to be here BEFORE McDonough?
5) Kyrie Ivring: Should have been a Sun
1. IT was signed when Bledsoe was holding out, and we more or less got IT for free IIRC. We did trade him for a late first rounder only to watch him blow up in Boston, but look what he became after Boston... I think the Celtics has a mature franchise with a top 3 coach who had the ability to maximize his talents. Had we hung on to IT I don't think he averages 29 ppg ever in his career.
2. Can't imagine McD had a lot of say in this decision.
3. You have to try... there's an argument for not bothering in order to not be embarrassed, but I can also see Sarver all over this attempt.
4. You could plug in Sarver before McDonough just as easily here...
5. Rookies are like new cars, they start devaluing as soon as they leave the lot... or whatever it is that they say. At the time I definitely didn't want to send Bledsoe and Josh for a possible 2 year rental of Irving, who could've forced his way out anyway -- it's not like the culture in Phoenix was so wonderful at the time. At least now we have a protected first rounder and the possibility that Josh could develop into a useful rotational piece, rather than another "I don't wanna be here" tweet.
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
This bummed me out at the time and it bums me out even more now. We weren't willing to send Bledsoe (mediocre starting PG with injury and attitude problems), Josh Jackson (deeply flawed rookie who cannot shoot), and a middling 1st round pick (Miami's) for an All-NBA player who had won games for the Cavs in the Finals. Some said that Kyrie wouldn't want to play here, but Irving had 2 years left on his contract, which was plenty of time to audition him and convince him to stay. We weren't willing to give up those mediocre assets for an all-star PG? What kind of crap is that? There are probably STILL people on this site who would say they still wouldn't make that deal, and that stuns me. Do you not want this team to be good?pickle wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:02 pm5. Rookies are like new cars, they start devaluing as soon as they leave the lot... or whatever it is that they say. At the time I definitely didn't want to send Bledsoe and Josh for a possible 2 year rental of Irving, who could've forced his way out anyway -- it's not like the culture in Phoenix was so wonderful at the time. At least now we have a protected first rounder and the possibility that Josh could develop into a useful rotational piece, rather than another "I don't wanna be here" tweet.
I recognize that Kyrie got hurt last year and missed significant time. But you didn't know that at the time, and I see no reason to believe that he won't have a long and healthy career. I don't think it changes the overall assessment of the proposed trade.
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
You do realize we wouldn't have Ayton right now had we done the trade.Marty [Mori Chu] wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:22 pmThis bummed me out at the time and it bums me out even more now. We weren't willing to send Bledsoe (mediocre starting PG with injury and attitude problems), Josh Jackson (deeply flawed rookie who cannot shoot), and a middling 1st round pick (Miami's) for an All-NBA player who had won games for the Cavs in the Finals. Some said that Kyrie wouldn't want to play here, but Irving had 2 years left on his contract, which was plenty of time to audition him and convince him to stay. We weren't willing to give up those mediocre assets for an all-star PG? What kind of crap is that? There are probably STILL people on this site who would say they still wouldn't make that deal, and that stuns me. Do you not want this team to be good?pickle wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:02 pm5. Rookies are like new cars, they start devaluing as soon as they leave the lot... or whatever it is that they say. At the time I definitely didn't want to send Bledsoe and Josh for a possible 2 year rental of Irving, who could've forced his way out anyway -- it's not like the culture in Phoenix was so wonderful at the time. At least now we have a protected first rounder and the possibility that Josh could develop into a useful rotational piece, rather than another "I don't wanna be here" tweet.
I recognize that Kyrie got hurt last year and missed significant time. But you didn't know that at the time, and I see no reason to believe that he won't have a long and healthy career. I don't think it changes the overall assessment of the proposed trade.
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
I still wouldn't have done that trade, because Kyrie has demonstrated a clear goal of getting out of shitty situations, and we are the very definition of a shitty situation. Not overly worried about injuries, but honestly, Kyrie minus LeBron was a disaster in terms of team success, and Stevens is a basketball savant so I don't really attribute last year's success in Boston to Kyrie being there. So while I would've liked to have extracted more value out of Bledsoe then we ended up with, no I didn't at the time think that Josh was a deeply flawed rookie as I do now (if we already knew this at the time we should've just drafted Isaac or Lauri), and even if I did, at least Josh wanted to be here, while Kyrle very clearly didn't.
If Kyrie expressed an open mind about moving to any situation to prove himself, I might've been more tempted. He wasn't, so I didn't want more "starting pg wants out of town" drama. So yeah, I didn't want to trade for him then, nor do I want to do it in hindsight.
If Kyrie expressed an open mind about moving to any situation to prove himself, I might've been more tempted. He wasn't, so I didn't want more "starting pg wants out of town" drama. So yeah, I didn't want to trade for him then, nor do I want to do it in hindsight.
Re: Ryan McDonough Appreciation Thread
True. We might have had to settle for Luca.Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 4:13 pmYou do realize we wouldn't have Ayton right now had we done the trade.Marty [Mori Chu] wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:22 pmThis bummed me out at the time and it bums me out even more now. We weren't willing to send Bledsoe (mediocre starting PG with injury and attitude problems), Josh Jackson (deeply flawed rookie who cannot shoot), and a middling 1st round pick (Miami's) for an All-NBA player who had won games for the Cavs in the Finals. Some said that Kyrie wouldn't want to play here, but Irving had 2 years left on his contract, which was plenty of time to audition him and convince him to stay. We weren't willing to give up those mediocre assets for an all-star PG? What kind of crap is that? There are probably STILL people on this site who would say they still wouldn't make that deal, and that stuns me. Do you not want this team to be good?pickle wrote: ↑Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:02 pm5. Rookies are like new cars, they start devaluing as soon as they leave the lot... or whatever it is that they say. At the time I definitely didn't want to send Bledsoe and Josh for a possible 2 year rental of Irving, who could've forced his way out anyway -- it's not like the culture in Phoenix was so wonderful at the time. At least now we have a protected first rounder and the possibility that Josh could develop into a useful rotational piece, rather than another "I don't wanna be here" tweet.
I recognize that Kyrie got hurt last year and missed significant time. But you didn't know that at the time, and I see no reason to believe that he won't have a long and healthy career. I don't think it changes the overall assessment of the proposed trade.