2019 NBA Draft Lottery

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Wormwood
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Wormwood » Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am

Drewsprocket wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 7:05 pm
Wormwood wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 8:36 am
Realistically, the Suns only have a chance at obtaining either:

a. A guy who isn't really a PG via the draft (White, Colbert)

b. A guy who was injured who is a PG (Garland)

c. A third tier PG via free agency (Tyus Jones, McConnell) (<-- Probably the most likely)

d. Trade for a superfluous, older second-tier PG like Conley with a bad contract (e.g. Johnson + Warren for Conley or Teague).
Conley would be a total upgrade. Hes a top PG in the league with 21 and 6 while making multiple players better. Think what this would do for Ayton, Bridges, Booker- including Melton and Okobo. Opens up the floor and gives you a general.
You have to get better over time, nobodys going from 19 wins to winning a freaking championship.
Yes, he's one of the best on the market. But, James Jones said we're not going for people over 30 (he's 31), and his numbers are starting to slip.

He has a ~$33M contract that runs for another 2 years. Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done. It's only for 2 years while we're trying to get better. It also alleviates our log-jam at SG/SF. It would also increase our cap room enough this year that we could sign a decent PF.

Memphis gets a pseudo-back up PH for Ja, a 20 ppg scorer at a reasonable price to play next to Ja who's still in his prime, a reclamation project, and a first.

But... James Jones says he's not interested.

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ShelC
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by ShelC » Thu May 16, 2019 4:25 am

Jones is dumb if he has a shot at Conley and passes because of his age. If Sarver doesn't want to pay the contract, that's a different story. But Conley checks all the boxes.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Ring_Wanted » Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am

Wormwood wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am
Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done.
MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.

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Indy
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Indy » Thu May 16, 2019 5:11 am

In2ition wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 3:49 pm
Wormwood wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 3:15 pm
In2ition wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 8:49 am
Wormwood wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 8:36 am
Realistically, the Suns only have a chance at obtaining either:

a. A guy who isn't really a PG via the draft (White, Colbert)

b. A guy who was injured who is a PG (Garland)

c. A third tier PG via free agency (Tyus Jones, McConnell) (<-- Probably the most likely)

d. Trade for a superfluous, older second-tier PG like Conley with a bad contract (e.g. Johnson + Warren for Conley or Teague).
I could be missing a few, but here is a decent list.

UFAs at pg - Collison, Rozier(Yuk), Rubio, Rose
RFAs at pg - DLo, Satoransky, Tyus Jones, McConnell
Possibly on trade market - Lonzo, Conley, Dinwiddie, Lowry, VanVleet
Possibly available at 32 - Carson Edwards(killer, shooter, strong, reminds me of Lowry a little), Jalen Lecque(might be a better athlete than Ja), Arturs Zagars(draft and stash, great shooter, super crafty and shifty guard with Nash, Curry, Young type of feel for the game with quick release, finishes like Kyrie around the basket, but better more willing passer)

I'm telling you guys, next year's PGs in the draft will be all-time good with talent and depth. It's bad value to waste it on a PG at 6 this year.
Interesting list but...

Too old: Conley, Rubio, Rose, Lowry

Not a PG: Satoransky

No way their team will let them go: VanFleet, DLo, Lonzo

No way we want them: Rozier

Out of our price range: DLo, Dinwiddie (e.g. cost will vastly exceed our cap space)

What's that leave? The two guys I mentioned: Jones and McConnell.
Satoransky is a pg/sg, and played pg pretty well in Washington with Beal, but...whatever.

Dinwiddie would be a trade and obviously we have enough salary to make that happen. DLo might end up having to be the same thing or they will have to dump salary to make it happen. Not out of the realm of possibility

There is always Elfrid Payton and Rajon Rondo. I also forgot to add those, plus Brogdan added to RFA, haha.
This. I get that he is billed as a PG/SG, but he played nearly 2000 minutes last season at point, shot 40% from 3, had over a 3:1 A/T ratio, and was a plus defender.

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Indy
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Indy » Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am

Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am
Wormwood wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am
Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done.
MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.
So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?

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Split T
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Split T » Thu May 16, 2019 6:40 am

ShelC wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:25 am
Jones is dumb if he has a shot at Conley and passes because of his age. If Sarver doesn't want to pay the contract, that's a different story. But Conley checks all the boxes.
He doesn’t check the prime matches up with our core box.

I think Conley is good, I’d welcome him on the team, but I wouldn’t move #6 for him. He’s a stop gap pg for us. We’d need to find a new one in 2 years. Just go sign Collison.

Now if it’s warren/Tyler/Mil pick? Sure, I could get behind that. Then draft Garland and let Conley teach him how to play point.

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Split T
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Split T » Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am

Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am
Wormwood wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am
Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done.
MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.
So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?
You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.

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Indy
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Indy » Thu May 16, 2019 7:04 am

Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am
Wormwood wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am
Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done.
MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.
So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?
You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.
I was curious if you were seeing him as a starter or not over Oubre.

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O_Gardino
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by O_Gardino » Thu May 16, 2019 7:51 am

Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:40 am
ShelC wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:25 am
Jones is dumb if he has a shot at Conley and passes because of his age. If Sarver doesn't want to pay the contract, that's a different story. But Conley checks all the boxes.
He doesn’t check the prime matches up with our core box.

I think Conley is good, I’d welcome him on the team, but I wouldn’t move #6 for him. He’s a stop gap pg for us. We’d need to find a new one in 2 years. Just go sign Collison.

Now if it’s warren/Tyler/Mil pick? Sure, I could get behind that. Then draft Garland and let Conley teach him how to play point.
Sure, that's the message we've heard over the last several years from the Suns. I think it's a mistake to try to build your whole 8 man core in the same age bracket.
SELL THE TEAM
#notank
#sarverout

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Split T
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Split T » Thu May 16, 2019 8:06 am

Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:04 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am
Wormwood wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:22 am
Warren, JJ, Johnson, plus Milwaukee's 1st for Conley might get it done.
MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.
So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?
You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.
I was curious if you were seeing him as a starter or not over Oubre.
Sorry I should have let RW answer...it’s his idea...I think I would probably start Dedmon...or just change it depending on matchup

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Split T
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Split T » Thu May 16, 2019 8:08 am

O_Gardino wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:51 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:40 am
ShelC wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:25 am
Jones is dumb if he has a shot at Conley and passes because of his age. If Sarver doesn't want to pay the contract, that's a different story. But Conley checks all the boxes.
He doesn’t check the prime matches up with our core box.

I think Conley is good, I’d welcome him on the team, but I wouldn’t move #6 for him. He’s a stop gap pg for us. We’d need to find a new one in 2 years. Just go sign Collison.

Now if it’s warren/Tyler/Mil pick? Sure, I could get behind that. Then draft Garland and let Conley teach him how to play point.
Sure, that's the message we've heard over the last several years from the Suns. I think it's a mistake to try to build your whole 8 man core in the same age bracket.
I don’t think it’s necessarily about being in the same age bracket. It’s that Conley only has a couple years left. He’s going to start dropping off and we’d just have to replace him soon. Jrue isn’t in the same age bracket, but he’d be fine because he’s 4 years younger.

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SDC
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by SDC » Thu May 16, 2019 8:52 am


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iLLmatic
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by iLLmatic » Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am

SDC wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:52 am
I miss Alvin.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Ring_Wanted » Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am

Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:06 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:04 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am

MEM loves Conley and they are in no hurry to dump him. Cap space is mostly useless to them as they are not a destination and Jackson is a bust so the only value would be Warren and a iffy pick. I wouldn't even listen if you don't put #6 on the table.

If we keep Oubre and the pick, renounce to everything else and stretch Meth, we'll be looking at 21M in cap space. Not perfect but you should be able to build a complete roster and improve. Collison and Dedmon and I'd be a happy man.

Should look to dump Jackson asap, but I doub't he'd have a market given his salary, unless we add some draft asset.
So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?
You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.
I was curious if you were seeing him as a starter or not over Oubre.
Sorry I should have let RW answer...it’s his idea...I think I would probably start Dedmon...or just change it depending on matchup
Split T is right, Indy. I'd start Dedmon alongside Ayton and have them switch the 4/5 on offense/defense. Oubre would come off the bench, Bridges starts at 3.

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SDC
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by SDC » Thu May 16, 2019 9:03 am

the bald guy is david griffin

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SDC
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by SDC » Thu May 16, 2019 9:07 am

is that Kevin o Bomber in the background? KOC!

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Indy
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Indy » Thu May 16, 2019 9:12 am

Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:06 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:04 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:13 am


So Dedmon is your back up center and Oubre is your starting 4?
You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.
I was curious if you were seeing him as a starter or not over Oubre.
Sorry I should have let RW answer...it’s his idea...I think I would probably start Dedmon...or just change it depending on matchup
Split T is right, Indy. I'd start Dedmon alongside Ayton and have them switch the 4/5 on offense/defense. Oubre would come off the bench, Bridges starts at 3.
Thanks guys--I was just curious how Oubre would be sold on re-signing here only to come off the bench. And do we want to pay our 6th man 15M/year? That is what we think it will take to keep him, right?

All that said, I agree that Dedmon would be a good target. Is he going to command more than 12M/3 years?

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Superbone
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Superbone » Thu May 16, 2019 9:23 am

O_Gardino wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:51 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:40 am
ShelC wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 4:25 am
Jones is dumb if he has a shot at Conley and passes because of his age. If Sarver doesn't want to pay the contract, that's a different story. But Conley checks all the boxes.
He doesn’t check the prime matches up with our core box.

I think Conley is good, I’d welcome him on the team, but I wouldn’t move #6 for him. He’s a stop gap pg for us. We’d need to find a new one in 2 years. Just go sign Collison.

Now if it’s warren/Tyler/Mil pick? Sure, I could get behind that. Then draft Garland and let Conley teach him how to play point.
Sure, that's the message we've heard over the last several years from the Suns. I think it's a mistake to try to build your whole 8 man core in the same age bracket.
My understanding is that now they are looking for veterans in their prime in the 25-29 range.
Wormwood/Superbone 2019/2020 season bet: Suns win < 30 games, Wormwood wins, else 'Bone wins. 1 month avatar shame starting July 1st of winner's choosing.

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Superbone
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Superbone » Thu May 16, 2019 9:26 am

Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 9:12 am
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:06 am
Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 7:04 am
Split T wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:41 am


You could have Dedmon defend the 5 and play the 4 on offense.
I was curious if you were seeing him as a starter or not over Oubre.
Sorry I should have let RW answer...it’s his idea...I think I would probably start Dedmon...or just change it depending on matchup
Split T is right, Indy. I'd start Dedmon alongside Ayton and have them switch the 4/5 on offense/defense. Oubre would come off the bench, Bridges starts at 3.
Thanks guys--I was just curious how Oubre would be sold on re-signing here only to come off the bench. And do we want to pay our 6th man 15M/year? That is what we think it will take to keep him, right?

All that said, I agree that Dedmon would be a good target. Is he going to command more than 12M/3 years?
It might work but Oubre would be the starting 3 and Bridges would be coming off the bench. If they retain Oubre, he's starting.
Wormwood/Superbone 2019/2020 season bet: Suns win < 30 games, Wormwood wins, else 'Bone wins. 1 month avatar shame starting July 1st of winner's choosing.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: 2019 NBA Draft Lottery

Post by Ring_Wanted » Thu May 16, 2019 9:32 am

Indy wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 9:12 am
Thanks guys--I was just curious how Oubre would be sold on re-signing here only to come off the bench. And do we want to pay our 6th man 15M/year? That is what we think it will take to keep him, right?

All that said, I agree that Dedmon would be a good target. Is he going to command more than 12M/3 years?
Oubre's situation makes me unconfortable, but you are sending a very poor message if you let him go as he brought positive things to the table. His chemistry and intensity in particular was a very nice sight.

Still, I see him as a very replaceable player and I am scared to give him those 15M. If he took 10M per, I'd say go for it (dumping Jackson would help regardless of the final figure).

As for Dedmon, his last deal was a two year 12M total. If you give him 4/40 (player option) at 12:01 I believe he takes it, because a lot of money is going to be blocked until be big dominoes start to fall. Same with Collison. But I am not holding my breath that Jones and the new FO pull a blitzkrieg move like that. More probably, they'll mess around wasting time trying to get interviews with big FAs, only to be left looking at scraps.

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