Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Discussion of the league and of our favorite team.

How many wins?

< 20
0
No votes
20-24
1
2%
25-29
9
17%
30-34
11
21%
35-39
21
40%
40-44
5
10%
45-50
4
8%
> 50
1
2%
 
Total votes: 52

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Superbone
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Superbone »

I'm not on here saying the Suns will win 48 games and make the playoffs. But I do think they'll be competitive and start making strides toward the playoffs (30 - 40 wins). I'd like to think the following season that they will have a good shot at the playoffs. Nobody could say that either of these things "likely won't happen."
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Indy
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Indy »

Superbone wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 1:21 pm
I'm not on here saying the Suns will win 48 games and make the playoffs. But I do think they'll be competitive and start making strides toward the playoffs (30 - 40 wins). I'd like to think the following season that they will have a good shot at the playoffs. Nobody could say that either of these things "likely won't happen."
Yes, you can say it is extremely unlikely for the Suns to win 40 games next year. That is a true statement of fact.

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Indy
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Indy »

Superbone wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 12:56 pm
Indy wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:03 am
Superbone wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 11:21 am
Nodack wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:37 pm
I am always optimistic. It makes me a happier person. Expecting the worst all the time is just depressing. If things go bad, I still get paid the same.
About my fandom and hobbies, I’m totally an optimist too. Real life is hard enough, to also translate it to the things that are supposed to bring joy to it. As you said, it’s depressing to never have hope on something going right, not even before it unfolds.
Preach it, brothers!
Being optimistic about the Suns is saying you are hoping/expecting something good to happen that likely won't. How does that make you a happier person? It seems it would be disappointing to have your high hopes get crushed every year. Is it the 1 out of 10 years where we over achieve that keeps you going the next 9 years like potato farmers? (this is a serious questions from me, not trying to be a dick (but it does come easy) :wink: )
There's your problem (bolded) right there. That is not a fact. That is an unknown. There will be some good and there will be some not so good (aka bad). Why decide ahead of time that it will be all bad. It's just like the people you like to hang out with. It's no fun hanging with a Debbie Downer. It's a lot more fun hanging with somebody that has a positive outlook on life.
1) I guess I will just repeat it because I missed this post the first time. It is a statement of fact to say that optimism is expecting something better than a likely outcome. You are expecting something to happen that is unlikely. It is in the definition. I think Vegas has the odds at 29.5 games this year. If you are expecting above that, you are optimistic. Expecting below that, pessimistic.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/optimism

Definition of optimism
2: an inclination to put the most favorable construction upon actions and events or to anticipate the best possible outcome

Definition of pessimism
1: an inclination to emphasize adverse aspects, conditions, and possibilities or to expect the worst possible outcome



2) I guess I don't see expecting the Suns to win slightly more than the going odds is being a Debbie Downer or that expecting them to win 40 games makes life more fun.

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In2ition
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by In2ition »

Indy wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:03 am
Superbone wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 11:21 am
Nodack wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:37 pm
I am always optimistic. It makes me a happier person. Expecting the worst all the time is just depressing. If things go bad, I still get paid the same.
About my fandom and hobbies, I’m totally an optimist too. Real life is hard enough, to also translate it to the things that are supposed to bring joy to it. As you said, it’s depressing to never have hope on something going right, not even before it unfolds.
Preach it, brothers!
Being optimistic about the Suns is saying you are hoping/expecting something good to happen that likely won't. How does that make you a happier person? It seems it would be disappointing to have your high hopes get crushed every year. Is it the 1 out of 10 years where we over achieve that keeps you going the next 9 years like potato farmers? (this is a serious questions from me, not trying to be a dick (but it does come easy) :wink: )
I feel happier people make the world a better place. I don't think it's that hard for me to be optimistic. Whether the Suns win or lose from nighg to night isn't going to change this. So, if they lose 63 games, it sucks, but I look for the glimmers of hope. From night to night they were horrible and maybe one of the dumbest teams I've ever seen. I still think some of the negative guys really really weighed down this team last year.

I don't think of it like the divorced kid, where broken promises from the dad spiral me into becoming a delinquent as I got super excited and then crying in my room after it didn't happen. Is that a real thing? Screw it, one team is going to win and one is going to lose. No need to cut myself over it. And I have no control over how they play, but I stay a die hard fan anyway.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
"Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them." ~ Frederick Douglass

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In2ition
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by In2ition »

Indy wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:16 pm
Superbone wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 1:21 pm
I'm not on here saying the Suns will win 48 games and make the playoffs. But I do think they'll be competitive and start making strides toward the playoffs (30 - 40 wins). I'd like to think the following season that they will have a good shot at the playoffs. Nobody could say that either of these things "likely won't happen."
Yes, you can say it is extremely unlikely for the Suns to win 40 games next year. That is a true statement of fact.
Pelton's analytics model says 38 wins, 538 says 35, so 40 is not that far out of an outlier.
"When we all think alike, nobody is thinking" - Walter Lippmann
"Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them." ~ Frederick Douglass

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Aztec Sunsfan
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Aztec Sunsfan »

Indy wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:03 am
Superbone wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 11:21 am
Nodack wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:37 pm
I am always optimistic. It makes me a happier person. Expecting the worst all the time is just depressing. If things go bad, I still get paid the same.
About my fandom and hobbies, I’m totally an optimist too. Real life is hard enough, to also translate it to the things that are supposed to bring joy to it. As you said, it’s depressing to never have hope on something going right, not even before it unfolds.
Preach it, brothers!
Being optimistic about the Suns is saying you are hoping/expecting something good to happen that likely won't. How does that make you a happier person? It seems it would be disappointing to have your high hopes get crushed every year. Is it the 1 out of 10 years where we over achieve that keeps you going the next 9 years like potato farmers? (this is a serious questions from me, not trying to be a dick (but it does come easy) :wink: )
Fair question.

If someone is venting, undermining people’s hopes or expectations, ranting and expecting the worst 365 days of the year, versus someone else accepting how things are gradually unfolding until some milestone is highly unlikely (to keep it balanced, let’s say, not playoffs by january, instead of “mathematically eliminated”), then yeah, the second person is a happier person just by the effect of having more sunny days (no pun intended). And on top of it, expecting the worst to happen is as much or even more unlikely as the good stuff, with the difference that your gut lives a more loose day to day. Some people are expecting Booker to demand a trade like since two years ago, and even if he ultimately does it, the optimist would suffer less accumulated pain that the person feeling that despair after every bad loss.

And as I said, is not the same to take an optimist, even a happy trigger approach to your hobbies than, to say, your pension funds portfolio, so yeah, I choose optimism where the costs have not my direct future involved, and suck some free joy while the raid last.

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Aztec Sunsfan
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Aztec Sunsfan »

Superbone wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 12:56 pm
Indy wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:03 am
Superbone wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 11:21 am
Nodack wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:37 pm
I am always optimistic. It makes me a happier person. Expecting the worst all the time is just depressing. If things go bad, I still get paid the same.
About my fandom and hobbies, I’m totally an optimist too. Real life is hard enough, to also translate it to the things that are supposed to bring joy to it. As you said, it’s depressing to never have hope on something going right, not even before it unfolds.
Preach it, brothers!
Being optimistic about the Suns is saying you are hoping/expecting something good to happen that likely won't. How does that make you a happier person? It seems it would be disappointing to have your high hopes get crushed every year. Is it the 1 out of 10 years where we over achieve that keeps you going the next 9 years like potato farmers? (this is a serious questions from me, not trying to be a dick (but it does come easy) :wink: )
There's your problem (bolded) right there. That is not a fact. That is an unknown. There will be some good and there will be some not so good (aka bad). Why decide ahead of time that it will be all bad. It's just like the people you like to hang out with. It's no fun hanging with a Debbie Downer. It's a lot more fun hanging with somebody that has a positive outlook on life.
Dr House was a genius and a amazing source to learn from, but he made people feels so miserable and had this absolute obsession on being right and or, the ultimate the last saying, than most people eventually run away from him. A Debbie Downer is a poors man’s Dr House, so yeah, most people eventually also will grow tired of them.

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pickle
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by pickle »

I think we are getting into human psyche discussions here rather than pure fandom things. To that end, I just want to offer up the possibility that while it looks like some people are constantly setting low expectations (pessimistic) and others are setting high expectations (optimistic), everyone has a different threshold for pain/anguish/disappointment and it's pretty hard to tell others they are doing it right or wrong. Those of us who are always upbeat feel less pain when we are disappointed, while those of us who are always setting low bars for the team might feel a disproportionate amount of anxiety and anguish when their final expectations are not met so we always expect less of the team.

I'm aware that Debbie Downers bring a more depressing perspective to the party and it isn't always pleasant, but at least we are all here for one reason, to wish success on the team we all cheer for. If this team really did win 40 games next year, I'd say 99.99% of this board and all other Suns fans around the world will be ecstatic, no matter if they were upbeat or not during the season.

While I'm setting my expectations at 30, I'd certainly love to see 41 wins! I'm sick of this team picking up moderately high draft picks year after year only for the player development system to fail them and for the fans to have to pin their hopes on next summer's lottery... oops... there I go Debbie Downing again...

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Superbone
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Superbone »

Nothing wrong with that post, pickle.
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Indy
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Indy »

good posts guys

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ShelC
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by ShelC »

My gut tells me on paper this is at least a 40 win team. But with this being the first year the roster is together with a new coach, there are going to be some bumps. Just tough to say. But I'm actually very optimistic about the makeup of the roster (maybe more than most), all things being equal.

I went with 30-34 wins just to manage my own expectations.

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Vladimir_Taltos
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Vladimir_Taltos »

Going homer...and think all you nattering naybobs of negativism are going to eat your negativity! :D 46!

VT

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Nodack
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Nodack »

That's some serious optimism! I hope you are right.

And yes being optimistic does make me a happier person Indy. I play a tank game World Of Tanks and feel when teams stick together they win at a much higher rate than splitting up in the beginning. When I play and lose a bunch of games in a row due to people splitting up in the beginning I start to get pessimistic and start making snide remarks and getting pissed off. I don’t like that guy.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Man you know what just poped in my mind? I hate we waived Kyle Korver. No way I buy 'no room' or 'kids will need playing time'.

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Split T
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Split T »

Ring_Wanted wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:52 am
Man you know what just poped in my mind? I hate we waived Kyle Korver. No way I buy 'no room' or 'kids will need playing time'.
We needed to waive him to clear cap space to sign Rubio. His contract was bigger than Jackson’s if he wasn’t waived.

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SDC
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by SDC »

Last season I predicted the worst outcome for this team. This season under James Jones and Monty they will snatch the 8th seed.

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pickle
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by pickle »

We waived a lot of guys without trying to extract value for them. One thing about the James Jones reign that bothers me a lot.

Phoenix219
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Phoenix219 »

We are a .500 team. 8th seed no one wants to face.

Book(er) it.

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Cap
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by Cap »

pickle wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:21 pm
We waived a lot of guys without trying to extract value for them. One thing about the James Jones reign that bothers me a lot.
How do you know we didn’t try?

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pickle
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Re: Predict 2019-20 Suns # of wins

Post by pickle »

I don't see why we had to waive those guys in the first place. Chandler and Rivers come to mind last year. I get that we needed to address the Korver situation to clear space, but those two last year we weren't in a rush, were we?

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