Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

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Shabazz
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Shabazz » Mon May 11, 2020 5:32 pm

Superbone wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:16 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:07 pm
I really wonder how many bad front office decisions trace back to Sarver. It’s worth noting when evaluating McD’s tenure.

We know he also shot down the #16 and the MIL pick for SGA in favor of the Mikal trade. I’m almost certain he was the loudest voice in the room on Ayton over Doncic.

He’s really the worst thing that ever happened to this franchise.
I'm a little confused by that exchange. Were the Celtics interested in Jackson? I wonder what the chances of them picking him would have been had he worked out for them? If the Celtics didn't take Tatum, is there a chance they wouldn't have taken Jackson and we would have taken Jackson anyway even if Tatum was available?
I think what Watson is implying is that they could have told Tatum to pull the “don’t work out for the Cs” trick instead of Jackson, but Sarver preferred Jackson. You can’t really do that with 2 players.

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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Split T » Mon May 11, 2020 5:34 pm

Superbone wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:16 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:07 pm
I really wonder how many bad front office decisions trace back to Sarver. It’s worth noting when evaluating McD’s tenure.

We know he also shot down the #16 and the MIL pick for SGA in favor of the Mikal trade. I’m almost certain he was the loudest voice in the room on Ayton over Doncic.

He’s really the worst thing that ever happened to this franchise.
I'm a little confused by that exchange. Were the Celtics interested in Jackson? I wonder what the chances of them picking him would have been had he worked out for them? If the Celtics didn't take Tatum, is there a chance they wouldn't have taken Jackson and we would have taken Jackson anyway even if Tatum was available?

And DO we know that Sarver is responsible for Bridges over SGA? I've heard the rumor but have never seen it substantiated with facts. If Sarver did overrule McD on all this then yeah, we can't really blame him other than him not being strong enough to stand up to Sarver if that was even a possibility.
I took it as Watson wanted Tatum, McD wanted Jackson, Sarver sided with McD and they focused on preventing Jackson from visiting Boston. But who really knows.

As for the Bridges/SGA stuff, there are just a few comments when pieced together make it seem like Sarver is responsible. On draft night, Gambo reported Charlotte had taken SGA for us, then later back tracked. McD also said that he had a trade lined up for a pg, but that he was overruled. Or something similar to that.
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Superbone
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Superbone » Mon May 11, 2020 5:50 pm

Shabazz wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:31 pm
Superbone wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:16 pm


And DO we know that Sarver is responsible for Bridges over SGA?
Yes. That was reported as fact by The Athletic.

The caveat is that there are definitely sour grapes with Watson.

However, Sarver has been at best meddling, at worst calling the shots on our draft days since he bought the team. There is no doubt he plays a big role. He obviously has the right to have a say in who he brings in to the organization he owns, but he clearly has no aptitude for the basketball scouting part of it.
OK, thanks. Very disappointing. I love Bridges but SGA was exactly what we needed. Fox would have been much preferable to Jackson too, obviously.
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Mori Chu
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Mori Chu » Mon May 11, 2020 7:16 pm

I love how many former Suns players, staff, etc. are happy to openly shit on our owner. Everybody around the league hates Sarver. How many good coaches, GMs, and players have we lost because of our toxic owner?

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Superbone
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Superbone » Mon May 11, 2020 7:25 pm

Mori Chu wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 7:16 pm
I love how many former Suns players, staff, etc. are happy to openly shit on our owner. Everybody around the league hates Sarver. How many good coaches, GMs, and players have we lost because of our toxic owner?
He needs to learn to keep his f'n hands out of it! Leave it to the GD basketball experts!
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Shabazz
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Shabazz » Mon May 11, 2020 8:07 pm

Here’s the link to something that pulls from Bob Young’s The Athletic piece on SGA/Mikal.

https://clutchpoints.com/suns-rumors-ro ... ander/amp/

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Shabazz
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Shabazz » Mon May 11, 2020 8:24 pm

This article just dropped with a lot more info on Watson’s comments today.
https://theathletic.com/1807946/2020/05 ... ics-draft/

Here’s a snippet:

As much as the combination made sense to Watson, he said Sarver saw the situation differently. He remembers Sarver saying of the Suns, “We do not need another Devin Booker.” The owner believed Tatum’s skills might too closely shadow Booker’s. Watson realized the wings would actually accentuate each other, especially with the NBA veering more toward versatility, interchangeability and skill. Tatum’s pre-draft workout for the Suns, in Los Angeles, only solidified Watson’s belief in the pairing’s potential. Beginning with the shooting demonstration, it was, as Watson said, “a crazy workout.”

“I’ve never seen anything like it,” Watson said. “I could see it quick like I saw it in Devin Booker quick, when people questioned it. I could see it quick. And (during the shooting drill) the owner stopped him. I don’t know how many more he could have made, but the owner stopped the drill. And you don’t stop that drill. You just don’t. You just sit there and you admire it and you stay out of the way. So the owner stops the drill and says, ‘That’s nice. What else can you do?’ I’m like, ‘What? What? The workout should be over. This is our guy.’”

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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Split T » Mon May 11, 2020 8:47 pm

Shabazz wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 8:07 pm
Here’s the link to something that pulls from Bob Young’s The Athletic piece on SGA/Mikal.

https://clutchpoints.com/suns-rumors-ro ... ander/amp/
The timing there still seems strange. We supposedly tried to trade up for Bridges earlier, at least that’s what McD said on draft night. Philly told us they were taking Bridges to keep. We then had the false tweet from Gambo saying we had traded up for SGA. Then later a false tweet saying we were taking Divencenzo. Then we took Zhaire Smith and traded for Bridges.

That definitely supports the theory that our front office was not in sync. Gambo seemed to be getting his info from the McD side.

A possible explanation. We wanted to move up. Bridges or SGA were the targets. Sarver/Jones preferred Bridges, so our initial attempts were for him. When Philly took Bridges, McD set up a trade for SGA. In the meantime Sarver or Jones kept discussions going with Philly, who had to have let us know they still might move Bridges if Smith was on the board at our pick. So Sarver/Jones vetó the SGA trade in hoping we can still get Bridges. Smith is still on the board, Philly knows we covet Bridges, so they play hardball and demand the Miami pick instead of Milwaukee pick. McD says no, and plans to take Divencenzo. Again, he gets overruled and we give up the Miami pick.

That’s how I’m looking at it at least. Fits with the Gambo tweets and the Bob young story.
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Superbone
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Superbone » Mon May 11, 2020 9:25 pm

The owner stops a drill?! Oh, boy.
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ShelC
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by ShelC » Tue May 12, 2020 3:09 am

Earl Watson can suck a dick. He's trying to save his rep from his time here. Sarver's an ass, which we all know. But Watson isn't exactly Gregg Popovich or his wannabe-daddy John Wooden. If he was so scary talented, he'd coaching somewhere else.

“I could see it quick like I saw it in Devin Booker quick, when people questioned it. I could see it quick." FOH. He must've seen with Chriss too. All of a sudden he's a great evaluator of talent.

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Indy » Tue May 12, 2020 5:44 am

Mori Chu wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 7:16 pm
I love how many former Suns players, staff, etc. are happy to openly shit on our owner. Everybody around the league hates Sarver. How many good coaches, GMs, and players have we lost because of our toxic owner?
Gentry continues to say nice things and says that he always treated him respectfully and was a good partner.

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Mori Chu
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Mori Chu » Tue May 12, 2020 8:23 am

I don't see the point of these revisionist history articles about Tatum vs Josh Jackson. Our FO got Jackson to cancel a workout with Boston, and we took him. Boston happily took Tatum. For anybody at the Suns to now say that they wanted Tatum all along smells like BS to me. And even if it's true, I don't see the point in relitigating it now. I'm sure in any draft, there are plenty of teams that have minor disagreement in their FO about whom to draft. They don't all see fit to air their dirty laundry and criticize what the FO ultimately chose to do.

Bottom line is that we didn't have any opportunity to draft Tatum anyway since Boston picked before us. So saying that we wanted him rings pretty hollow now.

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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by In2ition » Tue May 12, 2020 8:36 am

Mori Chu wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 8:23 am
I don't see the point of these revisionist history articles about Tatum vs Josh Jackson. Our FO got Jackson to cancel a workout with Boston, and we took him. Boston happily took Tatum. For anybody at the Suns to now say that they wanted Tatum all along smells like BS to me. And even if it's true, I don't see the point in relitigating it now. I'm sure in any draft, there are plenty of teams that have minor disagreement in their FO about whom to draft. They don't all see fit to air their dirty laundry and criticize what the FO ultimately chose to do.

Bottom line is that we didn't have any opportunity to draft Tatum anyway since Boston picked before us. So saying that we wanted him rings pretty hollow now.
I agree.
"30 wins would be an extremely disappointing season" yeah, I said it and I mean it.

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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by In2ition » Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 am

"30 wins would be an extremely disappointing season" yeah, I said it and I mean it.

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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Split T » Tue May 12, 2020 10:16 am

In2ition wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 am
Well then why the crap did we draft Jackson and act so giddy about pulling a fast one on Boston?
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Indy
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Indy » Tue May 12, 2020 10:25 am

spin

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ShelC
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by ShelC » Tue May 12, 2020 10:54 am

Yup. And meanwhile, we still passed on Fox.

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In2ition
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by In2ition » Tue May 12, 2020 11:15 am

Passed on a lot of guys. Fox, Isaac, Markkanen, Zach Collins, Luke Kennard, Mitchell, Bam, John Collins, Allen, Anunoby, Kuzma, Derrick White all in the 1st round. Then in the 2nd round we picked Davon Reed and passed on Jordan Bell, Thomas Bryant, Dillon Brooks & Monte Morris.
"30 wins would be an extremely disappointing season" yeah, I said it and I mean it.

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Split T
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by Split T » Tue May 12, 2020 11:17 am

In2ition wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 11:15 am
Passed on a lot of guys. Fox, Isaac, Markkanen, Zach Collins, Luke Kennard, Mitchell, Bam, John Collins, Allen, Anunoby, Kuzma, Derrick White all in the 1st round. Then in the 2nd round we picked Davon Reed and passed on Jordan Bell, Thomas Bryant, Dillon Brooks & Monte Morris.
Monte Morris in the 2nd round hurts....he’d have been a great solution to our backup pg issues.
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ShelC
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Re: Suns News: Week 20 3/9-3/15

Post by ShelC » Tue May 12, 2020 11:43 am

Fox was the one. We'd have the best backcourt the league.

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