Grade the Suns' Offseason

Discussion of the league and of our favorite team.

What grade would you give James Jones & Co. for their offseason work.

A+
0
No votes
A
7
22%
A-
6
19%
B+
9
28%
B
5
16%
B-
3
9%
C
2
6%
D
0
No votes
(IN)F!
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 32

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INFORMER
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by INFORMER »

Ring_Wanted wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 4:58 am
- Dario on MLE money is not an overpay either, but I am not high on him. Nice bubble but I doubt he'll keep it up over a full season.
I think Jones put us in the position to need Saric after deciding to operate over the cap and paying a high price for CP3.

My stance after the bubble is that you can't bring Saric back based on 10 games; it's bad money. There was a reason he was out of the rotation in January. But now he is back on a 3-year deal at a good amount of money.

His deal isn't terrible; it's just not good either. I loved the deal that brought him here, but I don't think it paid off like it should. But he is here, and I can only hope he has figured something out and we see a continuation of his bubble play.
Trendon Watford. Please and thank you.

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INFORMER
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by INFORMER »

ShelC wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 5:20 am
This fascination with Wood is beyond me.
Young. Athletic. Good shooter. Skilled scorer. Solid rebounder. Blocks shots.
Trendon Watford. Please and thank you.

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Nodack
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Nodack »

I hated Saric for most of the year. He put it together like the whole team did in the bubble. I hope they bottled some of that Disney water and brought it back home. I sure hope Saric can continue what he had going there. Is it possible that guys get adjusted to their teams after a season and just figure out how to play their part in the system? Or maybe it was the end of the season and he wanted a new contract so he brought it. Maybe he comes out that guy or maybe he comes out the slow lumbering layup missing sloth we saw for much of the season. I guess we will have to wait. To be honest, I expect the sloth that starts playing better towards the end.

“My dad says you don’t even try until the playoffs.”

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INFORMER
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by INFORMER »

Nodack wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:20 pm
Carter is sort of more a 2 guard but he did alright as a PG
He wasn't good as a point guard. That was one of the main reasons why Rubio's on/off court team impact was so outstanding. We would take a point guard off the court without sending one back out. Carter's came in the bubble came when he played off the ball.

Sure, he played hard all season, but it wasn't helping us win, because playing hard wasn't enough to make him a net positive.
Nodack wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:20 pm
If CP3 goes down we will obviously loose an important piece and nobody on the bench or brought in on a ten day is going to compare to.
What kind of attitude is that? Definitely not one supported by Suns history. The 94-95 Suns survived a barrage of injuries to Barkley, KJ, and Manning to still win 59 games.

The 1999-2000 Suns team survived Jason Kidd's injury (and he was the team, the essentially) to still make the playoffs and be in a position to win their first round series against the Spurs.

We all know what happened in 05-06.
Nodack wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:20 pm
Nothing is ever perfect.
It's not about perfection; no one is asking that. It's about building with sensibility.
Trendon Watford. Please and thank you.

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Nodack
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Nodack »

I think they are building as sensibly as they can.
Nodack wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:20 pm
If CP3 goes down we will obviously loose an important piece and nobody on the bench or brought in on a ten day is going to compare to.
What kind of attitude is that? Definitely not one supported by Suns history. The 94-95 Suns survived a barrage of injuries to Barkley, KJ, and Manning to still win 59 games.
I didn’t look at it as an attitude. I looked at it as fact. I didn’t say they couldn’t compete without CP3. I said who ever they bring in to replace him from our bench won’t be as good as CP3. Maybe I’m wrong. I said if he goes down players will have to step it up. Seems like a good attitude to me.

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INFORMER
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by INFORMER »

Nodack wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:56 pm
I said who ever they bring in to replace him from our bench won’t be as good as CP3.
In the context of discussing the need for depth, making statement seems like you're just saying doesn't matter what or who we have behindhim because they won't be as good. I think it does matter.

If all you meant was that we won't have a backup as good as CP3, and there is nothing to interpret beyond that, then I am a little confused why that would even need to be stated. I can't think of an all-star who is backed up by an equally talented all-star. And I would assume anyone would know that is not what I am asking for.
Trendon Watford. Please and thank you.

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Nodack
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Nodack »

My point was that they will have to deal with whatever get’s throw at them like all teams do. More depth at PG would be great.

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ShelC
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by ShelC »

INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:24 pm
ShelC wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 5:20 am
This fascination with Wood is beyond me.
Young. Athletic. Good shooter. Skilled scorer. Solid rebounder. Blocks shots.
Sounds like our draft pick.

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virtual9mm
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by virtual9mm »

INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:08 pm
virtual9mm wrote:
Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:27 pm
They got good value for Oubre (OKC flipped him for a late-mid first rounder) and given the sour grapes I'm hearing -- I say good riddance.
People are spinning and exaggerating his comments to feel better about trading him. He has sour grapes because he is a young guy that loved being here and didn't want to be traded. I don't blame him. I appreciate how much he loved Phoenix, how he bonded with his teammates, and how much he improved while being here.
TBH I would have been on Oubre's side had he handled not playing in the Bubble better.

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virtual9mm
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by virtual9mm »

INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:23 pm
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 4:58 am
- Dario on MLE money is not an overpay either, but I am not high on him. Nice bubble but I doubt he'll keep it up over a full season.
I think Jones put us in the position to need Saric after deciding to operate over the cap and paying a high price for CP3.

My stance after the bubble is that you can't bring Saric back based on 10 games; it's bad money. There was a reason he was out of the rotation in January. But now he is back on a 3-year deal at a good amount of money.

His deal isn't terrible; it's just not good either. I loved the deal that brought him here, but I don't think it paid off like it should. But he is here, and I can only hope he has figured something out and we see a continuation of his bubble play.
Saric was also playing a different role in the Bubble. More of a Point Center. Exactly how the fans from Philly were telling us how to use him instead of using him as a spot-up shooter. So, I don't see why he'd play too much worse although he does also have a track record of playing better towards the end of seasons than the beginning.

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specialsauce
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by specialsauce »

virtual9mm wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:38 am
INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:08 pm
virtual9mm wrote:
Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:27 pm
They got good value for Oubre (OKC flipped him for a late-mid first rounder) and given the sour grapes I'm hearing -- I say good riddance.
People are spinning and exaggerating his comments to feel better about trading him. He has sour grapes because he is a young guy that loved being here and didn't want to be traded. I don't blame him. I appreciate how much he loved Phoenix, how he bonded with his teammates, and how much he improved while being here.
TBH I would have been on Oubre's side had he handled not playing in the Bubble better.
If he handled it better he wouldn’t be Kelly Oubre. Weird emo all in his “spiritual warfare.” I knew from a family friend of one of the players that he wasn’t going to play. And that it had nothing to do with his physical health.

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INFORMER
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by INFORMER »

ShelC wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:53 am
INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:24 pm
ShelC wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 5:20 am
This fascination with Wood is beyond me.
Young. Athletic. Good shooter. Skilled scorer. Solid rebounder. Blocks shots.
Sounds like our draft pick.
Definitely some similarities. Isn't the scorer Wood is. But I think Smith has the potential to be a better rebounder.
Trendon Watford. Please and thank you.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Ring_Wanted »

INFORMER wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:23 pm
Ring_Wanted wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 4:58 am
- Dario on MLE money is not an overpay either, but I am not high on him. Nice bubble but I doubt he'll keep it up over a full season.
I think Jones put us in the position to need Saric after deciding to operate over the cap and paying a high price for CP3.

My stance after the bubble is that you can't bring Saric back based on 10 games; it's bad money. There was a reason he was out of the rotation in January. But now he is back on a 3-year deal at a good amount of money.

His deal isn't terrible; it's just not good either. I loved the deal that brought him here, but I don't think it paid off like it should. But he is here, and I can only hope he has figured something out and we see a continuation of his bubble play.
I didn't like the trade for Saric-#11, but I agree on the rest, specially on how Jones 'forced' himself to bring Saric back. There were better ways to maximize the opportunities available this offseason (even after you get confirmation that Paul wants to come here) and I feel PHX went only 3/4 of the way.

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O_Gardino
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by O_Gardino »

Dunno if this belongs in this thread, but here's a video.

This guy breaks down the numbers and some film on how Chris Paul made DeAndre Jordan and Steven Adams better. Then he extrapolates to Phoenix and Ayton. Basically, Ayton should shoot 65% or better with Paul. One point the video doesn't make is that CP3 might see a big increase in scoring if defenses consider Ayton a bigger threat.

The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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Mori Chu
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Mori Chu »

I think CP3 is going to be great for Ayton. Rubio also worked well with Ayton, but CP3 is on another level when it comes to running the P&R with bigs and finding them on the break.

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O_Gardino
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by O_Gardino »

We saw a lot of cases last year where Ayton was crowded by defenders because they knew the pass was co\ming. Go ahead, Ricky, take the shot. If you do that with CP3, he doesn't miss. Historically, teams crowd CP3 and dare the roll man to beat them.
The league needs heroes, villains... and clowns. -- Aztec Sunsfan

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Indy
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Indy »

O_Gardino wrote:
Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:45 am
We saw a lot of cases last year where Ayton was crowded by defenders because they knew the pass was co\ming. Go ahead, Ricky, take the shot. If you do that with CP3, he doesn't miss. Historically, teams crowd CP3 and dare the roll man to beat them.
That is why I am expecting big things from Ayton this year. Book too.

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ShelC
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by ShelC »

I think Smith and Jones are better in the PnR than Ayton. Not saying they'll get minutes or touches because of it, just that they're better in that particular situation.

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Split T
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by Split T »

Ayton needs to learn quick, he can have a fantastic season if he does.

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jonh
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Re: Grade the Suns' Offseason

Post by jonh »

[media][/media]
Nodack wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:34 pm

“My dad says you don’t even try until the playoffs.”
The hell I don't! Tell your old man to drag Walton and Lanier up and down the court for 48 minutes!

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