Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

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Shabazz
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Shabazz » Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:56 pm

Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:21 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:44 pm
I’m totally fine not giving Ayton any extension this summer. We’re under no obligation to do that and it’ll hopefully light a fire under him.
OK, so let's say it does light a fire under him and he plays like we all know he can. And he gets a contract offer you don't want to match. Then what?
If he consistently plays next season like we all know he can then I’m fine max-ing him. That’s what I think of his potential. But he’s got a long way between here and there.

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Indy
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Indy » Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:01 pm

Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:56 pm
Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:21 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:44 pm
I’m totally fine not giving Ayton any extension this summer. We’re under no obligation to do that and it’ll hopefully light a fire under him.
OK, so let's say it does light a fire under him and he plays like we all know he can. And he gets a contract offer you don't want to match. Then what?
If he consistently plays next season like we all know he can then I’m fine max-ing him. That’s what I think of his potential. But he’s got a long way between here and there.
So no worries about a contract year ayton being just in contract years?

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Shabazz
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Shabazz » Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:09 pm

Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:01 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:56 pm
Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:21 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:44 pm
I’m totally fine not giving Ayton any extension this summer. We’re under no obligation to do that and it’ll hopefully light a fire under him.
OK, so let's say it does light a fire under him and he plays like we all know he can. And he gets a contract offer you don't want to match. Then what?
If he consistently plays next season like we all know he can then I’m fine max-ing him. That’s what I think of his potential. But he’s got a long way between here and there.
So no worries about a contract year ayton being just in contract years?
Of course that’s a concern. But if he’s a two way force, then you sign him and hope the infrastructure we have in place doesn’t let his regress (again).

Also, we can trade him between now and then.

We just don’t have to extend him this summer. The reason you’d extend someone is if you can get them on a discount or if they’re a superstar and you want to max them out.

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pickle
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by pickle » Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:34 pm

Right. So I think as much as we are all collectively frustrated with Ayton, he's still the best option we've got against opposing teams' starters and he still has room to grow. His defense is quite useful, if not indispensable, to our success, and I'm hoping for growth from him to offset any declines from CP3. I'd move him in the right deal and might have been okay with several other players at the 5 spot for the Suns, but he also doesn't have glaring holes in his game that makes him totally unplayable in important playoff situations (other than the lack of aggression/passion).

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specialsauce
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by specialsauce » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:19 pm

He’s a sissy with bad hands and contract year won’t change that even if it changes the lazy.

And this defense deal is so overrated he has the worst net rating of any of our rotational players not named Frank if I’m not mistaken. We’re better with him on the bench we don’t need his defense.

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specialsauce
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by specialsauce » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:24 pm

His defensive rating is worse than any Sun except Booker, and the Suns defensive rating is better with him off the court than any other player on the team.

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Indy
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Indy » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:52 pm

Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:09 pm
Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:01 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:56 pm
Indy wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:21 pm
Shabazz wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:44 pm
I’m totally fine not giving Ayton any extension this summer. We’re under no obligation to do that and it’ll hopefully light a fire under him.
OK, so let's say it does light a fire under him and he plays like we all know he can. And he gets a contract offer you don't want to match. Then what?
If he consistently plays next season like we all know he can then I’m fine max-ing him. That’s what I think of his potential. But he’s got a long way between here and there.
So no worries about a contract year ayton being just in contract years?
Of course that’s a concern. But if he’s a two way force, then you sign him and hope the infrastructure we have in place doesn’t let his regress (again).

Also, we can trade him between now and then.

We just don’t have to extend him this summer. The reason you’d extend someone is if you can get them on a discount or if they’re a superstar and you want to max them out.
I think if you don't extend him this summer, you are announcing to him and the league that he isn't highly valued. So any trade partner will know that. That is why I think they either trade him this summer or they will max him. Of the two, I vote for trade.

But it is frustrating because he is a good starting center in the league.

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Flagrant Fowl
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Flagrant Fowl » Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:23 pm

Full disclosure, I'm a nut job. I spend about 30 minutes a day thinking about Ayton trade scenarios.
UOducks4life in a previous life. Valar Morghulis.

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pickle
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by pickle » Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:35 pm

Let's hear some!

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Split T
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Split T » Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:01 pm

Would you guys trade Ayton and change for Vucevic?
Split: I would trade DA for SGA right now(11-24-2020)

Cap: I wouldn’t. Somebody remember to check this post in five years and see which of us looks the fool.

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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Superbone » Mon Mar 15, 2021 12:12 am

Split T wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:01 pm
Would you guys trade Ayton and change for Vucevic?
YES!
Wormwood/Superbone 2019/2020 season bet: Suns win < 30 games, Wormwood wins, else 'Bone wins. 1 month avatar shame starting July 1st of winner's choosing. ACCOMPLISHED! 34 wins in a shortened season! Like it mattered. We rarely see Wormwood anyway!

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Flagrant Fowl
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Flagrant Fowl » Mon Mar 15, 2021 1:03 am

Split T wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:01 pm
Would you guys trade Ayton and change for Vucevic?
Ayton and how many picks?
UOducks4life in a previous life. Valar Morghulis.

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pickle
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by pickle » Mon Mar 15, 2021 2:38 am

No, I wouldn't... Vucevic is one of the worse defensive centers in the league. I know that people are down on Ayton's defense but I still think his presence is reasonably intimidating in the paint. If we had used that pick on someone else, and are now looking for someone to hold down the 5 spot, I'd like to try a few guys for sure, but to give up on Ayton for Vucevic when Booker is already somewhat of a net minus on the less glamorous end of the floor is probably not going to help this team.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Ring_Wanted » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:50 am

pickle wrote:
Mon Mar 15, 2021 2:38 am
No, I wouldn't... Vucevic is one of the worse defensive centers in the league. I know that people are down on Ayton's defense but I still think his presence is reasonably intimidating in the paint. If we had used that pick on someone else, and are now looking for someone to hold down the 5 spot, I'd like to try a few guys for sure, but to give up on Ayton for Vucevic when Booker is already somewhat of a net minus on the less glamorous end of the floor is probably not going to help this team.
Agreed. Ayton for Vuc would create a huge hole on defense and would have a big impact on our depth as well, since Vuc makes 26M so you also need to send out 19.5M to make it work under the CBA (So Ayton plus some combination of Carter-Crowder-Cam-Smith-smaller filler). I am not ready to make a franchise altering move in the middle of a terrific season for Vucevic, given the several quesiton marks it would generate.

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Split T
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Split T » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:06 am

Ya the money makes it tricky. There is no way to do the trade without including one of Cam/Mikal/Jae/Dario for salary purposes...unless you’re doing like a 6 for 1. He’d be easier to trade for in the offseason. His salary goes down and Ayton’s goes up.
Split: I would trade DA for SGA right now(11-24-2020)

Cap: I wouldn’t. Somebody remember to check this post in five years and see which of us looks the fool.

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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by specialsauce » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:24 am

Flagrant Fowl wrote:
Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:23 pm
Full disclosure, I'm a nut job. I spend about 30 minutes a day thinking about Ayton trade scenarios.
I would trade DA for John Collins, and try and lure LMA to be the backup 5 getting 20 mpg if he gets bought out.

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specialsauce
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by specialsauce » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:25 am

Cp/Payne
Book/Payne/Moore
Bridges/Cam
Collins/Crowder/Cam
Saric/LMA

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Split T
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Split T » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:25 am

I’d trade him for Collins as well, but that team gets real expensive next year unless CP3 opts out and signs for less over a longer deal.
Split: I would trade DA for SGA right now(11-24-2020)

Cap: I wouldn’t. Somebody remember to check this post in five years and see which of us looks the fool.

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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by specialsauce » Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:38 am

Split T wrote:
Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:25 am
I’d trade him for Collins as well, but that team gets real expensive next year unless CP3 opts out and signs for less over a longer deal.
I think Collins would be an excellent fit with Booker and I would love the opportunity to pay the man. Booker/Bridges/Collins would be a great core. CP3 would come off the books the following year when we look to resign Bridges.

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Split T
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Re: Game Day: Suns (24-11) @ Blazers (21-14), Thurs 3/11/21

Post by Split T » Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:42 am

Ya, Collins is fantastic offensively. I believe in him more than Ayton for sure and it’s not my money, so I’d love us to be willling to go into the tax next year. I just question whether Sarver would be willing.
Split: I would trade DA for SGA right now(11-24-2020)

Cap: I wouldn’t. Somebody remember to check this post in five years and see which of us looks the fool.

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