Around the League: Week 5 11/23-11/29

[carey]

Week 4 is complete. A week later and I'm still wondering which happens first, a Warriors loss or a 76ers win? Crazy!

ESPN's week 4 power rankings: LINK The Suns are down 1 spot to 19 while the Knicks (the Knicks!) are up to 15.

Just when we were poised to start making Bled-Show part of the daily lexicon, Brandon Knight turned in a couple of dream box scores for fantasy owners in wins over the Lakers and Nuggets to make sure we all know it's a two-headed backcourt in the desert that, at least numbers-wise, is hanging with Curry/Thompson and Lillard/McCollum.

Nationally televised games this week

Monday: New York @ Miami 7:30PM EST NBATv
Tuesday: Boston @ Atlanta 8:00PM EST TNT, Los Angeles Lakers @ Golden State 10:30PM EST TNT
Wednesday: Memphis @ Houston 8:00PM EST NBATv
Thursday: No games. Watch football!
Friday: Miami @ New York 7:30PM EST NBATv, New Orleans @ Los Angeles Clippers 10:30PM NBATv
Saturday: Denver @ Dallas 8:30PM EST NBATv
Sunday: Philadelphia @ Memphis 6:00PM EST NBATv

NBA News

Paul Flannery - Twilight of the Dirk: LINK
Tom Ziller claims 73-9 is absolutely on the table for the Warriors: LINK
Josh Smith cursed out a Clippers assistant coach: LINK
Duke players face steep learning curve for NBA defense: LINK (Isn't that every college player? Idk.)
D.A.'s Morning Tip - Now more than ever, coaches vulnerable when teams fail: LINK

[pickle]

is it me or is there much more reference to fantasy sports in "serious" sports reporting these days? is that a result of commercialization or is that just fantasy becoming a more important part of mainstream culture?

[carey]

is it me or is there much more reference to fantasy sports in "serious" sports reporting these days? is that a result of commercialization or is that just fantasy becoming a more important part of mainstream culture?

It's a result of the insane amount of money the fantasy sports sites spend at ESPN on advertising.

[Mori Chu]

And a lot of reference to sports gambling. Bill Simmons helped to popularize this, among others. Otherwise reputable sports anchors will openly talk about betting lines, over/unders, and other Vegasy stuff.

[Mori Chu]

By the way, I know others have said this here before, but look at the conference standings. The East has 11 teams that are at least .500 (!!!) And the West has only 6. There are a few Western teams that are going to improve, like the Rockets and Pelicans, but it's pretty amazing that you need to be 8-6 to be in the playoffs currently in the East and you only need to be 6-7 to qualify in the West.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/standings

[Ring_Wanted]

Detroit, New York, Indiana, Charlotte and Orlando have ascended or are back to respectability. Only Brooklyn has dropped. Everybody else is who we thought they were, more or less.

In the West, supposedly solid teams are having trouble (LAC, HOU, MEM, NOP), Portland is gone and Utah and Phoenix remain 50% material. Minni is improving and some teams like Denver and the Blazers so far are sucking less than expected (shouldn't last) but that's not enough.

If those struggling west teams get their shit together, by the allstar there should be 1-2 teams with a >.500 record outside the playoffs.

[ShelC]

Knicks were in Miami last night so here's an article on his time in NY. Interesting to see how his career has progressed (or regressed).

http://nypost.com/2015/11/23/amare-stou ... d-carmelo/

I always thought (money aside) he got a raw deal in NY. Was pretty much an afterthought once Melo arrived but never once complained or stopped working. Probably doesn't get enough credit for being a pro and a good leader/person.

[Mori Chu]

Knicks were in Miami last night so here's an article on his time in NY. Interesting to see how his career has progressed (or regressed).

http://nypost.com/2015/11/23/amare-stou ... d-carmelo/

I always thought (money aside) he got a raw deal in NY. Was pretty much an afterthought once Melo arrived but never once complained or stopped working. Probably doesn't get enough credit for being a pro and a good leader/person.

How did he get a raw deal? He got a huge contract, and he was one of the top 2-3 guys on that team. He wasn't exactly the focal point of the team, but I think everybody in New York correctly figured out that he was not a #1 guy. He had that great stretch where he averaged like 28 points for a month under D'Antoni, but that promptly shattered the guy's legs and put him out injured for the following year. It was unsustainable.

[pickle]

that contract couldn't be insured, iirc?

[ShelC]

He put up 25/8/2blocks in 37 minutes in 78 games his first year there and played

The Knicks were playing well and getting on a roll until Melo forced his way over there and they stripped the team down. NY and MSG basically went head over heels for Melo and it became his team, to a lot of other people's detriment. You almost got the feeling like they used Amar'e just to get another star onboard, and then set him aside. Again, he got his money and had his injuries but his years in NY were submarined by Melo. Just my opinion.

[pickle]

2 blocks!? damn.

[Mori Chu]

I get what you're saying Shel, but I think the things Amare was denied were mostly intangible things like being "the man" or being on billboards or whatever. He still got shots up and got paid a ton of money. I totally agree that the team became hyperfocused on Melo the moment he arrived, and that this was not always good for the team or the other players. But I guess I don't feel bad for Amare in that situation because I think he was a somewhat limited player who wasn't cut out to be the top guy on a team anyway. Having him be the #2 guy, still paid very well, but not the focal point of the offense, seems totally fine to me. I don't think he got a raw deal. Plus, he chose to go to the biggest, highest-scrutiny media market, so he shouldn't have been shocked that his game got kind of picked apart and that he was no longer the hot ticket in town once a better offensive player showed up.

[ShelC]

I don't want to get into a whole back and forth over this because it's just not worth it. Look at the numbers...his minutes, shot attempts, and he went with playing off the bench because it was best for the team (ie, Melo).

I think you're looking at the money and the fact he left us and maybe saying "So what, he's an overpaid athlete, he should just deal with it". And that's fair, but at the same time, he was pretty much marginalized once Melo came on board. It wasn't about marketing opportunities or not being the fan favorite or highest selling jersey. He never cared about that. But on the court, he was essentially cast aside.

[The Bobster]

And on the other side of the coin, Amar'e was a horrific defensive player in New York and never the kind of player who could be #1 on a championship team.

Of course Melo isn't either.

But the Knicks have a long history of falling in love with this king of player - Walt Bellamy, Spencer Haywood, Bob McAdoo, Allan Houston, Stephon Marbury, etc., etc.

[LazarusLong]

The problem with Amare and Carmelo together is neither played what I might politely call enthusiastic defense. To make that tandem work, you'd have to have a combo Dennis Rodman/pre-meltdown Larry Sanders big man to play on the same front line to compensate, plus a backcourt that also can play better than normal D.

Re: Bellamy, he was great statistical eye candy, but the paint tandem of he and Willis Reed worked about as well at Patrick Ewing and Bill Cartwright did years later for NY. Knicks did cut their losses in the trade for Dave DeBusschere, which improved ball movement and defense, and paved the way for a championship.

You think about what might have been if Amare's knees had held up longer. But, financially, he's been well rewarded.

[LazarusLong]

"But when it comes to our sport, we're so eager to say, 'Who is better: Oscar or [Michael] Jordan?' or 'Jordan or LeBron or Kobe [Bryant] or these guys?' instead of just accepting greatness. And if you understand the history of the sport, then there is no way you could ever forget Oscar Robertson. This guy, he averaged a triple-double for, like, forever."

LeBron James, about his being compared to Oscar Robertson.

Classy, and wise observation.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14208 ... ts-assists

[Split T]

Outside of defense, the problem with the melo-amare pairing is they neutralize each other on the court. Both have incredible value as finishers of plays but little value as creators. Ideally you'd pair a finisher with a creator. Like Nash-Amare. Melo is a little better at creating for himself and therefore Amare got pushed aside even though he's a better more efficient finisher.

[Superbone]

I don't want to get into a whole back and forth over this because it's just not worth it. Look at the numbers...his minutes, shot attempts, and he went with playing off the bench because it was best for the team (ie, Melo).

I think you're looking at the money and the fact he left us and maybe saying "So what, he's an overpaid athlete, he should just deal with it". And that's fair, but at the same time, he was pretty much marginalized once Melo came on board. It wasn't about marketing opportunities or not being the fan favorite or highest selling jersey. He never cared about that. But on the court, he was essentially cast aside.

Amare has kind of gone out with a whimper after leaving the Suns.

[Indy]

I don't want to get into a whole back and forth over this because it's just not worth it. Look at the numbers...his minutes, shot attempts, and he went with playing off the bench because it was best for the team (ie, Melo).

I think you're looking at the money and the fact he left us and maybe saying "So what, he's an overpaid athlete, he should just deal with it". And that's fair, but at the same time, he was pretty much marginalized once Melo came on board. It wasn't about marketing opportunities or not being the fan favorite or highest selling jersey. He never cared about that. But on the court, he was essentially cast aside.

Amare has kind of gone out with a whimper after leaving the Suns.

I think one could argue his first year in NY was as good as any year he had here (personally).

[carey]

GSW 30 - LAL 11 after the first Q.