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Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 3:00 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
Nodack wrote: ↑Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:18 am
The ads get ridiculous and way over the top. I keep seeing political ads attacking Mark Kelly in our state. They basically call him a Chinese operative. A NASA space shuttle commander a Chinese operative? Sure...
Excuse me? Everyone knows Science = Communist.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:44 am
by 3rdside
I was finding The Lincoln Project a little over the top but after the last few messages I realise that's just how it goes.
This one from them is genius:
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:54 pm
by Superbone
Wait... Jon Voight was serious?
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:58 pm
by Superbone
That was hilarious! But I had no idea about Voight. I just lost a ton of respect. Pretty good actor though.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 10:05 am
by Nodack
A Hollywood actor came out in support of Trump. For that you get a big shiny medal from Trump himself.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:55 am
by Mori Chu
Kanye West made a tweet yesterday declaring that he's running for President. It's always hard to tell whether to take him seriously. Does this help any of the other candidates? Does he pull black supporters away from Biden? Do some Trump voters instead vote for Kanye because he's openly MAGA-aligned? Or do most people just ignore this as a stunt and he gets almost no votes?
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:03 pm
by Superbone
I've been thinking more about what Voight actually said on video:
"President Trump is the greatest president since Abraham Lincoln."
What kind of wacko would think that? What does he think Trump has done to make him better than the other 43 presidents other than Lincoln? Granted, I didn't live through all of them but there is no question in my mind that Trump is the worst ever by a country mile. There is only one other person in the world that I know of that thinks what Voight said is true and I don't think even he really believes it.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:42 pm
by ShelC
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:55 am
Kanye West made a tweet yesterday declaring that he's running for President. It's always hard to tell whether to take him seriously. Does this help any of the other candidates? Does he pull black supporters away from Biden? Do some Trump voters instead vote for Kanye because he's openly MAGA-aligned? Or do most people just ignore this as a stunt and he gets almost no votes?
Probably a stunt since he has an album coming out soon.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 5:52 pm
by Mori Chu
Superbone wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:03 pm
I've been thinking more about what Voight actually said on video:
"President Trump is the greatest president since Abraham Lincoln."
What kind of wacko would think that? What does he think Trump has done to make him better than the other 43 presidents other than Lincoln? Granted, I didn't live through all of them but there is no question in my mind that Trump is the worst ever by a country mile. There is only one other person in the world that I know of that thinks what Voight said is true and I don't think even he really believes it.
I have heard the argument that 1-2 other Presidents could be as bad or worse than Trump. Andrew Johnson did a wretched job of handling the Civil War reconstruction after Lincoln was killed. James Buchanan supported the Confederacy too much in the 1850s and was corrupt and incompetent. George W Bush bungled our responses to 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina, led us into multiple wrongheaded wars in the Middle East, eroded our rights with the Patriot Act, wiretapped and spied on our citizens, and destroyed our economy in 2008.
But I think Trump is the very worst ever. He is the only US President in history who actively does not have the interests of the USA at heart. He has accomplished almost nothing positive in his four years; his proudest accomplishments are monuments to bigotry, xenophobia, and corruption. I think history will remember him as the worst ever.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:44 am
by 3rdside
Superbone wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:03 pm
I've been thinking more about what Voight actually said on video:
"President Trump is the greatest president since Abraham Lincoln."
What kind of wacko would think that? What does he think Trump has done to make him better than the other 43 presidents other than Lincoln? Granted, I didn't live through all of them but there is no question in my mind that Trump is the worst ever by a country mile. There is only one other person in the world that I know of that thinks what Voight said is true and I don't think even he really believes it.
There's probably a few things combined that could give legitimacy to the comment for Trumpers.
It's laughable for those living in reality:
He's an economic genius - look at pre-virus stock market and employment rates
Looks good on paper and it's why he's now saying "the virus is temporary" .. whereas in reality all he did was juice the market with his imbalanced tax cuts that further undermined USA's ability to deal the virus (which magnified USA's structural issues in the process).
And the post-financial crisis doctrine of paying govt debt down in the good times in order to have cash reserves in the bad times was not adhered to (not that he would have done that anyway as spending is a great way to ensure re-election, as short sighted as it is).
He's tough on China
"Nobody's been as tough on China as I have". This is only true in theory - China needs to be stood up to and while Trump has made the right noises, the reality is so far removed from his fiction (see article below) it's hard to believe this idiot is the most powerful man in the world.
Is Donald Trump tough on China?
John Bolton destroys the president’s signature foreign policy boast
United States
Jun 27th 2020 edition
Jun 27th 2020
At two rallies this week President Donald Trump really let China’s Communist Party have it. Fully three times he referred to covid-19 as the “kung flu”. This was a significant escalation of his more tentative (though still shocking at the time) reference to the “Chinese virus” in March. Forewarned by the president’s terrific build-up (“It’s a disease, without question, has more names than any disease in history…”), the unmasked maga crowds loved it. For many others, however, the case for Mr Trump’s fabled toughness on China has rather fallen apart.
The main service of John Bolton’s White House tell-all, “The Room Where It Happened”, is to describe this disintegration in meticulous, largely dispassionate and thus credible detail. Mr Trump’s expressed commitment to pegging back a more assertive China was timely—even if less agenda-setting than often suggested, his former national security adviser writes. It “embodies” a pre-existing bipartisan and cross-government desire for a tougher us posture towards China. Yet the president’s efforts were from the start cynical, contradictory and fundamentally self-defeating.
The administration’s permanent state of chaos—in which “panda-huggers” such as Steve Mnuchin and dragon-slayers like Robert Lighthizer and Peter Navarro vied to influence the daily policy lurches—played a role in that. But the main reason was Mr Trump. In Mr Bolton’s telling, he showed little ambition and none of the patience necessary to address the ways in which China games the economic system. He had no interest in pushing back on Xi Jinping’s growing authoritarianism; he admired it. Herding a million Uighurs in prison-camps was “exactly the right thing to do”, the president allegedly told his Chinese counterpart more than once. (His fawning before Mr Xi—you’re the “greatest leader in Chinese history”—is often toe-curling.) Mr Trump’s sole concern, in Mr Bolton’s telling, was to strike a trade deal that he could spin to his base as a win, however insubstantial its contents. In time this became his explicit negotiating pitch: Mr Bolton describes the president “pleading with Xi to ensure he’d win” re-election by promising to buy more American soyabeans and wheat. It was apparently for this that Mr Trump waged a trade war estimated to have cost 300,000 American jobs before the pandemic struck.
China, which was also suffering badly from the tariffs, must have been amazed that America would settle for so little. And, given Mr Trump’s desperation for the “phase one” trade deal signed in January, there was always going to be a fair chance it would be able to wriggle out of honouring its commitments. Sure enough, China is already undershooting its promise to spend $211bn on American goods and services by the end of the year—such that Mr Navarro declared the deal “over” this week. The president tweeted back that, no, it was “fully intact”. Mr Trump’s coarsening of America’s political culture is often described, in Daniel Patrick Moynihan’s artful phrase, as a case of “defining deviancy down”. He is increasingly defining toughness on China down, too.
The collateral damage from Mr Trump’s trade policy goes beyond America’s hard-hit farmers and factories. Mr Bolton describes the president intervening to block routine law enforcement of Chinese corporate abuses—including the sanctionsbusting of zte, a telecoms firm—for fear it would hurt his prospect of a deal. America’s allies were “discouraged and confused” by such capriciousness. China appears to have been encouraged. It is hard to see any sign—in its assertiveness during the pandemic and otherwise—that Mr Trump has caused it to rethink its economic model or global influence campaign.
Perhaps the best that can be said for Mr Trump’s blundering is that it didn’t produce even worse outcomes. The us-China relationship is in poor shape; yet he has shown it to be more resilient than many feared. It no doubt helped that Mr Trump has little interest in China’s most neuralgic strategic concerns. If he wins a second term, Mr Bolton predicts, he may well “abandon” Taiwan.
Another consolation is that the president’s effort to weaponise China electorally appears to be failing. Surveys suggest Joe Biden enjoys the same seven-point lead on handling China that he has overall. It seems Mr Trump’s ambition to define himself as strong on China and “Beijing Biden” as weak has been overtaken by events. Who cares that he barred travellers from China in February when the European Union is considering banning entrants from virus-ravaged America today? Especially—if Mr Bolton is right—when Mr Trump’s China policy is partly to blame for that tragedy. In a television interview, he alleged: “Trump didn’t wanna hear about [the virus]...He didn’t wanna hear bad things about Xi Jinping...He didn’t wanna hear bad things about the Chinese economy that could affect the ‘fantastic’ trade deal he was working on.”
A third upside, given undimmed bipartisan enthusiasm for confronting China, is that Mr Trump has provided a number of lessons in how not to go about that. And the weaker he looks, the more they are being heeded. Almost every Republican in Congress supported the Uighur human-rights bill that Mr Trump grudgingly signed into law last week. A bipartisan Tibet human-rights bill is in the pipeline. Meanwhile Mr Biden’s campaign, which three months ago was being pushed to sound more strident on China by the protectionist left as well as by the president, is instead starting to sound more thoughtful.
Have you seen her, have you heard?
A senior adviser to the former vice-president on China describes plans to identify and invest in the sources of America’s competitiveness. He cites the country’s economy, alliances and democratic values. It is too early to detect in this the makings of a successful China policy. Mr Biden has got a lot of foreign policy wrong over the decades. But it does have the advantage of sounding serious. “Being wrong” about America’s interests is another thing Mr Trump has defined down.■
He's saving America from the woke left
He's a law and order guy and Antifa are going to destroy this country. It's true that the woke left are slowly destroying the world (probably about as equal threat as the fascist right at the moment I guess, though it seems easier to clamp down on hate than woke-ism), but to say the Democrats
are the woke left is ridiculous but that's Trump's argument and it's believable for the Trumpers
He's racist
Abhorrent for normal people, not for all the insecure white dudes who see 'mexican rapists' taking over USA (and in my dad's case Muslims taking over the world). Trump is the man to stop this with his wall and racist overtures.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 2:49 am
by 3rdside
Anyway, that clip with Jon Voight says it all perfectly.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:30 am
by Nodack
EXCLUSIVE: Donald Trump was a victim of 'child abuse' at the hands of his father, who 'caused him terror that would scar him for life', claims President's niece who describes him as 'Frankenstein without the conscience' in explosive memoir
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -book.html
I preordered this book. According to the book, Trump like a lot of children was F’ed up by his fathers abuse. His mother was incapacitated early in Trumps life and his father who apparently was mean, had no empathy or morals was left to raise him and didn’t give a F about raising kids. Trump like most abused kids turned out just like his father.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 12:52 pm
by Superbone
Nodack wrote: ↑Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:30 am
EXCLUSIVE: Donald Trump was a victim of 'child abuse' at the hands of his father, who 'caused him terror that would scar him for life', claims President's niece who describes him as 'Frankenstein without the conscience' in explosive memoir
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -book.html
I preordered this book. According to the book, Trump like a lot of children was F’ed up by his fathers abuse. His mother was incapacitated early in Trumps life and his father who apparently was mean, had no empathy or morals was left to raise him and didn’t give a F about raising kids. Trump like most abused kids turned out just like his father.
This starts to bring a little sense to his behavior.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 12:53 pm
by Mori Chu
The same book alleges that Donald Trump hired somebody to take his SATs for him, which helped him get into Wharton college. Hmm. It sounds like the author has some family grudges (fights over inheritance and other things), so it may be good to take it with a grain of salt. If the stuff in there is true, it's pretty damning. But nobody seems to care when damning stuff comes out about Trump any more, so, meh?
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 4:56 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
I have no interest in reading any book about Donald Trump. I made up my mind about him nearly 15 years ago.
These kind of stories from his niece and John Bolton are equivalent to gossip tabloids in my mind. There's probably at least a sliver of truth in the stories, but I've long passed the point of reading anything that will change my mind about him.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:26 pm
by Superbone
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Tue Jul 07, 2020 12:53 pm
The same book alleges that Donald Trump hired somebody to take his SATs for him, which helped him get into Wharton college. Hmm. It sounds like the author has some family grudges (fights over inheritance and other things), so it may be good to take it with a grain of salt. If the stuff in there is true, it's pretty damning. But nobody seems to care when damning stuff comes out about Trump any more, so, meh?
Just because there is animosity doesn't mean it isn't all true.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:15 pm
by Nodack
And she was there, not just some author making it up from some hearsay. She grew up around him and is a professional psychologist.
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 9:48 am
by AmareIsGod
Can't make this stuff up.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/randalllan ... n-between/
Kanye West is running for President as a member of the Birthday Party (so it will feel like your birthday when he's elected, according to him).
He will get all of his campaign advice from Kim Kardashian and Elon Musk (speaking of which, fuck Elon Musk. The dude has so many screws loose).
He got Covid-19 in February and is anti-vaccination.
He plans to run the country like Wakanda, a fictional city from Black Panther, the Marvel film.
ON VACCINES
“It’s so many of our children that are being vaccinated and paralyzed… So when they say the way we’re going to fix Covid is with a vaccine, I’m extremely cautious. That’s the mark of the beast. They want to put chips inside of us, they want to do all kinds of things, to make it where we can’t cross the gates of heaven. I'm sorry when I say they, the humans that have the Devil inside them. And the sad thing is that, the saddest thing is that we all won’t make it to heaven, that there’ll be some of us that do not make it. Next question.”
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 9:53 am
by Nodack
We are SO doomed....
Re: Democratic primary watch
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 3:50 pm
by Mori Chu
It sounds like he's just being silly to promote his about-to-release clothing line and album. Presumably he'll withdraw from his "campaign" before Nov.