Mueller/Russia investigation

[Nodack]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/04/us/p ... ering.html
WASHINGTON — Federal prosecutors on Monday accused President Trump’s former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, of attempting to tamper with witnesses in his federal tax and money laundering case.

In court documents, prosecutors working for the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, said that violated the terms of Mr. Manafort’s release while he awaits trial. They asked a federal judge to revise those terms or send him to jail until trial.

Prosecutors said that Mr. Manafort tried to contact witnesses by phone, through an intermediary and through an encrypted messaging program. One witness told the F.B.I. that Mr. Manafort was trying to “suborn perjury,” prosecutors said. Two witnesses provided the texts to the F.B.I., which also searched Mr. Manafort’s cloud-based Apple account, according to court records.

It sounds to me like he was charged with money laundering etc., was out on bail, witness tampered, got caught and now they want him locked up so he can’t keep contacting witnesses trying to get their stories straight.

Trump has been on a tear pardoning everybody. I wouldn’t doubt if Trump tried to pre pardong him.

[Mori Chu]

I thought this article was an excellent summary of where we are at with the Trump/Russia stuff and what could lie ahead.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... usion.html

[Mori Chu]

Today Mueller issued 12 more indictments against Russian agents for hacking and interfering in the US 2016 Presidential election. This is a big one. The indictment also indicates that Wikileaks, Guccifer, and an unnamed GOP Congressman/candidate took information from the Russians. Among many interesting tidbits about these indictments, they reveal that Russians began actively trying to hack Hillary Clinton's email server mere hours after candidate Trump's now famous speech where he asked Russia to please try to find Hillary's "missing" emails. Wow.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/07/ ... dnc-718805

I hope today's news puts to rest any doubt that Russia interfered in our election.

[ShelC]

It won't. I have no faith that any GOP members will do anything about any of this. They've been nothing but complicit in this, covering for Trump to save their own jobs and keep their party in power. They've even taken to talking, tweeting and attacking others just like he doesn. This morning, Trump is saying all of the hacking/leaking happened under Obama and he and the FBI should've done something about it. He and the GOP attack the FBI, Hillary, the DNC while Trump will meet with Putin and say they're friends and Russia is great.

What no one seems to point out is that there haven't been anymore hacks or leaks/dumps by Wikileaks since the election. It's almost like whoever was behind it got what they wanted. And I'd also be willing to bet they have plenty of dirt on Trump and the GOP/RNC they're using as leverage.

For Trump, it goes back to money with Russian billionaires and I also think he's thinking ahead to after his Presidency. He doesn't want to burn bridges with Putin/Russia because of his family's finances and future.

[Nodack]

The GOP knows the Russians tried to influence our election. Our intelligence community has unanimously said the Russians tried to influence our election. Trump is the only one who claims they didn’t while simultaneously blaming Obama for not stoppIng them. Is Trump trying to stop them? No, he isn’t. Why is that? Because he knows Russia was trying help him. What is the GOP as a party doing about it? They are kissing Trumps azz and going with the flow.

Flake and McCain are about the only Republucans standing up to Trump. I think Flake is trying to set himself up for a run for President. I think Trump is eventually going to fall hard and I think Flake wants to be the guy who runs for President as the guy who says I told you so.

200,000 people displaying anti Trump posters and flying a big Trump baby balloon probably didn’t make Trump feel too welcome in the UK. He had to escape to his Scottish golf course that the Russian mafia financed and even there a paraglider protester flew over the grounds causing Trump to run for cover if it’s possible for Trump to run.

Not a fun day for Trump.

[Mori Chu]

I'm reading that they are going to try to impeach/fire Rod Rosenstein on Monday. Certainly the actions of innocent people who have done nothing wrong.

[Mori Chu]

Today's Trump-Putin press conference was ridiculous. I feel like if anybody had any doubt that this guy was totally in our enemy's pocket, this should put that completely to rest. It borders on treasonous. Our country is under attack, and our President does not defend us; in fact, he sides with the attacker over our own government and intelligence.

https://twitter.com/ParkerMolloy/status/1018903157026512896

[In2ition]

Yeah, if you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either. I think it's awfully difficult to think you can get into any one person's brain let alone a whole group of people and know exactly what that trigger is that is going to absolutely flip on a subject.

[Nodack]

Trumps comments are beyond belief and just confirms what anti Trumpers already thought. Even FOX News, who defends Trump 99% of the time is beside themselves.

[Mori Chu]

Yeah, if you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either. I think it's awfully difficult to think you can get into any one person's brain let alone a whole group of people and know exactly what that trigger is that is going to absolutely flip on a subject.

What are you talking about? Have you watched this press conference? Forget collusion for a second. This is a US President who is siding with our enemy over our own federal government and 17 intelligence agencies. He isn't representing us; he isn't defending us. He is sticking up for Russia and defending them despite ample evidence of their interference into our democracy. Are you okay with this?

[Mori Chu]

They've just arrested a Russian national named Maria Butina who has been living in the US for acting as a covert agent against the United States. She has been working with the NRA apparently, building ties with their leadership, among other things. More GOP/Russia stuff.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/pu ... story.html

[In2ition]

Yeah, if you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either. I think it's awfully difficult to think you can get into any one person's brain let alone a whole group of people and know exactly what that trigger is that is going to absolutely flip on a subject.

What are you talking about? Have you watched this press conference? Forget collusion for a second. This is a US President who is siding with our enemy over our own federal government and 17 intelligence agencies. He isn't representing us; he isn't defending us. He is sticking up for Russia and defending them despite ample evidence of their interference into our democracy. Are you okay with this?

I'm commenting on the video you posted. I haven't watched the entire press conference.

I don't condone what he said or him "siding" with the enemy. I just think the entire country is completely fractured at the moment and has been for years and years. I also think that even goes for people everywhere in our country. Trump obviously takes things to the extreme, where if someone inside a federal agency is against him, he acts like the entire agency is against him. Does that make sense? Am I wrong with anything I said?

[Superbone]

Trump's treasonous behavior with Putin is sickening. He's picked his side. They've got to have something on him.

[Mori Chu]

Yeah, if you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either. I think it's awfully difficult to think you can get into any one person's brain let alone a whole group of people and know exactly what that trigger is that is going to absolutely flip on a subject.

What are you talking about? Have you watched this press conference? Forget collusion for a second. This is a US President who is siding with our enemy over our own federal government and 17 intelligence agencies. He isn't representing us; he isn't defending us. He is sticking up for Russia and defending them despite ample evidence of their interference into our democracy. Are you okay with this?

I'm commenting on the video you posted. I haven't watched the entire press conference.

I don't condone what he said or him "siding" with the enemy. I just think the entire country is completely fractured at the moment and has been for years and years. I also think that even goes for people everywhere in our country. Trump obviously takes things to the extreme, where if someone inside a federal agency is against him, he acts like the entire agency is against him. Does that make sense? Am I wrong with anything I said?

I think my problem with what you said is, IMO you are too quick to dismiss the ability for people to change their minds. You said, "If you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either." I generally agree that tribal partisanship is high in the country these days, and that this is tough to overcome. But I don't think it is true that nothing anybody does can change anyone's mind.

Several members of my own family used to support Trump but now do not. This is for a variety of reasons. For some, it was when he supported white nationalists in Charlottesville. For others, it was the Muslim ban. More recently, my mother decided she no longer supports him due to the separation of children from their parents at the border. And still others will break from the President after seeing his concerning recent behavior toward Putin and Russia.

So I don't think it is remotely true that "nothing he says is going to change your mind." Minds are changing every day, perhaps not as many or as quickly as they should be, but it's happening. That's my disagreement with your message.

[In2ition]

Yeah, if you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either. I think it's awfully difficult to think you can get into any one person's brain let alone a whole group of people and know exactly what that trigger is that is going to absolutely flip on a subject.

What are you talking about? Have you watched this press conference? Forget collusion for a second. This is a US President who is siding with our enemy over our own federal government and 17 intelligence agencies. He isn't representing us; he isn't defending us. He is sticking up for Russia and defending them despite ample evidence of their interference into our democracy. Are you okay with this?

I'm commenting on the video you posted. I haven't watched the entire press conference.

I don't condone what he said or him "siding" with the enemy. I just think the entire country is completely fractured at the moment and has been for years and years. I also think that even goes for people everywhere in our country. Trump obviously takes things to the extreme, where if someone inside a federal agency is against him, he acts like the entire agency is against him. Does that make sense? Am I wrong with anything I said?

I think my problem with what you said is, IMO you are too quick to dismiss the ability for people to change their minds. You said, "If you believe that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia, then nothing he says is going to change your mind and if you don't believe it, this isn't going to change your mind either." I generally agree that tribal partisanship is high in the country these days, and that this is tough to overcome. But I don't think it is true that nothing anybody does can change anyone's mind.

Several members of my own family used to support Trump but now do not. This is for a variety of reasons. For some, it was when he supported white nationalists in Charlottesville. For others, it was the Muslim ban. More recently, my mother decided she no longer supports him due to the separation of children from their parents at the border. And still others will break from the President after seeing his concerning recent behavior toward Putin and Russia.

So I don't think it is remotely true that "nothing he says is going to change your mind." Minds are changing every day, perhaps not as many or as quickly as they should be, but it's happening. That's my disagreement with your message.

And if you actually read what I said, I was talking about if you believe that he colluded with Russia. I didn't say that nothing he says will keep you from jumping off his band wagon. So, that's my disagreement with your message and characterization of what I said. Besides, it was general statement, as it could be anything that someone says that triggers a change, you just don't know exactly what it is.

I do have a few questions, the border separation issue, did this just happen, or is it being reported that it started with Trump? Also, is there a reason that they are being separated from their parents? Is this different than if a parent commits a crime and is arrested or a parent is deemed negligent and the child is taken away by CPS? Are they eventually returned to their parent or is this some type of forced permanent separation? What was the exact trigger for your mother?

[Mori Chu]

And if you actually read what I said, I was talking about ...

This is rude and unwarranted. If you want to have a discussion with me, be civil and respectful.

[In2ition]

And if you actually read what I said, I was talking about ...

This is rude and unwarranted. If you want to have a discussion with me, be civil and respectful.

I'm sorry Marty. I shouldn't have started that way. I was a little upset you went on a long rant after a mischaraterization of what I wrote.

[Nodack]

Politics always brings people together.

[Mori Chu]

This is rude and unwarranted. If you want to have a discussion with me, be civil and respectful.

I'm sorry Marty. I shouldn't have started that way. I was a little upset you went on a long rant after a mischaraterization of what I wrote.

Thanks. I'm sorry for misunderstanding what you meant in your message. I do like talking about this stuff with you and the others.

[Mori Chu]

It really feels like this week and the Putin press conference and the associated fallout are a tipping point. Lots of Congressmen and Senators, even GOP ones, are criticizing this behavior strongly. The news today about how the White House is considering turning over some Americans to Russia to be imprisoned is just scandalous.