Midterm Elections

Political discussion here. Any reasonable opinion is welcome, but due to the sensitive nature of the topic area, please be nice and respectful to others. No flaming or trolling, please. And please keep political commentary out of the other board areas and confine it to this area. Thanks!
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In2ition
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by In2ition » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:48 am

Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:26 am
In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:29 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:06 am
In2ition wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:08 pm
What do you suggest that Trump do to ensure that Russia or anyone else can't meddle in election results?
Support the people charged with preventing this. He didn't support the funding they needed/requested, and instead wants to spend 92 million on a parade for himself.
I was referring to specific policies to prevent it. Supporting the people charged with preventing this didn't work so well this past election and it's been a reported problem for a long time before. Whether it's eliminating voter intimidation, security of voting machines, or prevention of voter fraud by voters attempting to vote early and often or unregistered voters voting.
Are you saying that you think the outcome of the previous election is in doubt due to hacking?

None of the items you listed has widespread impacts on election outcomes.

Voter intimidation works well to suppress votes of minorities, but is very hard to do from afar/from another country. Voting machines can certainly be hacked, but when you have paper ballots as back up, it doesn't pose nearly as much of a threat. And the entire commission set up to find evidence of wide-spread voter fraud found nothing.

What could greatly impact federal elections is eliminating people from voter rolls/changing their info in key jurisdictions and preventing "vote by email" which is allowed in many states. These are where we need to ensure those rolls are locked down, and just kill the email vote altogether. I am not sure if there is a less secure form of communication than email.
No, I wasn't saying it was in doubt due to hacking.

Yeah, voting by email doesn't sound like a good idea at all.

Why would voter intimidation only work on minorities? Seems like a tactic that could be done on anyone, regardless of race.
"Our Suns are DEAD!!!"

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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:45 am

In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:48 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:26 am
In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:29 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:06 am
In2ition wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:08 pm
What do you suggest that Trump do to ensure that Russia or anyone else can't meddle in election results?
Support the people charged with preventing this. He didn't support the funding they needed/requested, and instead wants to spend 92 million on a parade for himself.
I was referring to specific policies to prevent it. Supporting the people charged with preventing this didn't work so well this past election and it's been a reported problem for a long time before. Whether it's eliminating voter intimidation, security of voting machines, or prevention of voter fraud by voters attempting to vote early and often or unregistered voters voting.
Are you saying that you think the outcome of the previous election is in doubt due to hacking?

None of the items you listed has widespread impacts on election outcomes.

Voter intimidation works well to suppress votes of minorities, but is very hard to do from afar/from another country. Voting machines can certainly be hacked, but when you have paper ballots as back up, it doesn't pose nearly as much of a threat. And the entire commission set up to find evidence of wide-spread voter fraud found nothing.

What could greatly impact federal elections is eliminating people from voter rolls/changing their info in key jurisdictions and preventing "vote by email" which is allowed in many states. These are where we need to ensure those rolls are locked down, and just kill the email vote altogether. I am not sure if there is a less secure form of communication than email.
No, I wasn't saying it was in doubt due to hacking.

Yeah, voting by email doesn't sound like a good idea at all.

Why would voter intimidation only work on minorities? Seems like a tactic that could be done on anyone, regardless of race.
Because when you are in the majority and not oppressed, it is hard to use oppression against you. And either way, it doesn't work from afar.

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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:46 am

In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:48 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:26 am
In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:29 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:06 am
In2ition wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:08 pm
What do you suggest that Trump do to ensure that Russia or anyone else can't meddle in election results?
Support the people charged with preventing this. He didn't support the funding they needed/requested, and instead wants to spend 92 million on a parade for himself.
I was referring to specific policies to prevent it. Supporting the people charged with preventing this didn't work so well this past election and it's been a reported problem for a long time before. Whether it's eliminating voter intimidation, security of voting machines, or prevention of voter fraud by voters attempting to vote early and often or unregistered voters voting.
Are you saying that you think the outcome of the previous election is in doubt due to hacking?

None of the items you listed has widespread impacts on election outcomes.

Voter intimidation works well to suppress votes of minorities, but is very hard to do from afar/from another country. Voting machines can certainly be hacked, but when you have paper ballots as back up, it doesn't pose nearly as much of a threat. And the entire commission set up to find evidence of wide-spread voter fraud found nothing.

What could greatly impact federal elections is eliminating people from voter rolls/changing their info in key jurisdictions and preventing "vote by email" which is allowed in many states. These are where we need to ensure those rolls are locked down, and just kill the email vote altogether. I am not sure if there is a less secure form of communication than email.
No, I wasn't saying it was in doubt due to hacking.

Yeah, voting by email doesn't sound like a good idea at all.

Why would voter intimidation only work on minorities? Seems like a tactic that could be done on anyone, regardless of race.
If it isn't in doubt, then why do you say that what was done in 2016 about hacking our elections didn't work?

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In2ition
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by In2ition » Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:07 pm

Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:46 am
In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:48 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:26 am
In2ition wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:29 am
Indy wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:06 am


Support the people charged with preventing this. He didn't support the funding they needed/requested, and instead wants to spend 92 million on a parade for himself.
I was referring to specific policies to prevent it. Supporting the people charged with preventing this didn't work so well this past election and it's been a reported problem for a long time before. Whether it's eliminating voter intimidation, security of voting machines, or prevention of voter fraud by voters attempting to vote early and often or unregistered voters voting.
Are you saying that you think the outcome of the previous election is in doubt due to hacking?

None of the items you listed has widespread impacts on election outcomes.

Voter intimidation works well to suppress votes of minorities, but is very hard to do from afar/from another country. Voting machines can certainly be hacked, but when you have paper ballots as back up, it doesn't pose nearly as much of a threat. And the entire commission set up to find evidence of wide-spread voter fraud found nothing.

What could greatly impact federal elections is eliminating people from voter rolls/changing their info in key jurisdictions and preventing "vote by email" which is allowed in many states. These are where we need to ensure those rolls are locked down, and just kill the email vote altogether. I am not sure if there is a less secure form of communication than email.
No, I wasn't saying it was in doubt due to hacking.

Yeah, voting by email doesn't sound like a good idea at all.

Why would voter intimidation only work on minorities? Seems like a tactic that could be done on anyone, regardless of race.
If it isn't in doubt, then why do you say that what was done in 2016 about hacking our elections didn't work?
I'm sorry Indy, maybe I misspoke somewhere, but I don't remember talking about hacking.
"Our Suns are DEAD!!!"

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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:12 pm

We were talking about foreign governments swaying elections in the US. If you weren't talking about hacking, did you just mean publishing lies across social media? Sorry, I clearly made assumptions and probably better to clear that up so we can continue the discussions.

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Marty [Mori Chu]
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Marty [Mori Chu] » Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:02 pm

In2ition wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:08 pm
What do you suggest that Trump do to ensure that Russia or anyone else can't meddle in election results?
There was a $380m budget devoted to stopping election tampering and securing voting systems. Trump cut this budget to literally $0. That's a specific example of a policy he changed that makes election tampering and hacking easier and hurts our chances for free and fair elections.

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:19 pm

I want to know where we go from here as a country. Trump was elected in part because people are sick of Washington politics. They don’t trust the establishment wanted different leadership that isn’t owned by lobbyists. Trump made things infinitely worse. Now nobody trusts anything or anybody. We are a rudderless country destroying itself from within even without the help of Russia.

I am watching election commercials now and they are brutal. Local ones around here are basically calling apposing candidates ISIS members. It’s a no hold barred slanderfest. Lying is not only excepted but expected now.

I don’t know where we go as a country from here. I am dating myself but I grew up with John Wayne. Honor and integrity. He was a role model. Always doing the right thing. I had an uncle I worked for growing up who was my John Wayne and he always did the right thing.

A narcissistic serial lying racist sexual predator ego maniac draft dodging traitor con man is the American role model of today. I am getting off what I wanted to say again. The question is where do we go from here? How do we right this ship? The government isn’t run for the benefit of the people anymore. It is for sale to the highest bidder and 85% of them are on the take. Lobbying destroys our democracy. Corporations aren’t people, they are businesses run by people. Partisanship is out of control. Get rid of Trump and it doesn’t magically fix anything. This is much bigger than Trump. Trump is just a bad chapter in a long book.

How do we fix this?

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In2ition
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by In2ition » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:46 pm

Nodack wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:19 pm

How do we fix this?
We clearly need better candidates. Ones with integrity, and we also need a non-partisan media to cover them.

All sides are trying to run gotcha and agenda driven coverage, and it needs to stop. If you're not reading the news you're uninformed and if you are, you're misinformed.

Instead of honest discussions, we are as a country jumping to conclusions and accusing each other of being some version of the worst things possible.

And if you disagree with any of this you're blindly the "worst". ;)
"Our Suns are DEAD!!!"

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:19 am

Money corrupts even the best candidates. The system is broken and it’s not going to be fixed. You are right, it is gotcha coverage on all sides. The liberal media is at war with the Conservatives and the Conservative media is at war with Liberals. There are no honest discussions in Washington. I don’t think there ever will be.

It’s all BS.

Trump was going to be the guy to fix all of that. Instead he poured gas on everything and lit a match. I think things will ultimately have to get a lot worse before anybody is willing to really do anything. Until millions of Americans march on Washington demanding real change to the system we will be stuck in this infinite loop of half of America being at war with the other half.

No lobbyists! Lobbyists own our politicians. Corporations aren’t people! Religion should have no place in politics! No selling access to the President by friends!

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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:14 pm

Nodack wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:19 am
Money corrupts even the best candidates. The system is broken and it’s not going to be fixed. You are right, it is gotcha coverage on all sides. The liberal media is at war with the Conservatives and the Conservative media is at war with Liberals. There are no honest discussions in Washington. I don’t think there ever will be.

It’s all BS.

Trump was going to be the guy to fix all of that. Instead he poured gas on everything and lit a match. I think things will ultimately have to get a lot worse before anybody is willing to really do anything. Until millions of Americans march on Washington demanding real change to the system we will be stuck in this infinite loop of half of America being at war with the other half.

No lobbyists! Lobbyists own our politicians. Corporations aren’t people! Religion should have no place in politics! No selling access to the President by friends!
This is what kills democracy. The Citizen United decision could be the worst SC decision in my lifetime. Our elected leaders are bought and sold by companies with too much to gain/lose by what the citizens of this country want/need.

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Marty [Mori Chu]
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Marty [Mori Chu] » Tue Aug 21, 2018 5:31 pm

Indy wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:14 pm
This is what kills democracy. The Citizen United decision could be the worst SC decision in my lifetime. Our elected leaders are bought and sold by companies with too much to gain/lose by what the citizens of this country want/need.
This is so right. Citizens United was a travesty. It is having a corrupting influence on our politics that will be felt for decades. Reverting it would be a huge step forward for the country, but it's going to be hard to get our elected officials to ban bribing themselves.

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:25 pm

Until millions of Americans march on Washington demanding it it will never happen.

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Flagrant Fowl
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Flagrant Fowl » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:16 pm

Every discussion about how we can fix most issues in our government eventually comes back to Citizens United.
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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:07 am

Flagrant Fowl wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:16 pm
Every discussion about how we can fix most issues in our government eventually comes back to Citizens United.
Money corrupting politics started forever ago, but CU cemented the ability for money to equal speech, and for entities other than people to be "citizens" in our country.

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:36 am

Thank you Supreme Court.

http://endcitizensunited.org

Study: Most Americans want to kill ‘Citizens United’ with constitutional amendment
The odds of such a change happening? Next to nothing.
https://www.publicintegrity.org/2018/05 ... -amendment

https://movetoamend.org

Spending by so-called “outside” groups — super PACs, nonprofits, unions and political organizations — soared to more than $1.6 billion in 2016 from $286 million in 2006, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

“The same dark money channels that are protected by the big special interests who use them to such effect are also fully available to Vladimir Putin,” Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse, D-R.I., said during an informal hearing he called earlier this summer. “If the channel is dark enough to hide the hand of Charles and David Koch, it is dark enough to hide the hand of Vladimir Putin.”

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Marty [Mori Chu]
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Marty [Mori Chu] » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:56 pm

Doesn't Liz Warren have a proposal right now to fix a lot of this? I really like her. She fights against financial corruption and corporations screwing the common people.

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Indy
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Indy » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:41 pm

Is she on the list of politicians that vowed to not take money from corporations? I didn't think she signed that yet.

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Wed Oct 03, 2018 10:11 pm

I stumbled across this Pew site where you can pick any news site and it shows the details of where they stand in the political spectrum.

http://www.journalism.org/interactives/ ... /fox-news/

The site is really telling. Those news sites are a lot more diversified than I expected. FOX and CNN are watched by a lot of people and their viewers don't fall into the hard left or hard right category near as much as I thought. Both sites definitely lean their respective ways but, a lot of people are right in the middle where I am. Some sites don't have near the viewership I thought they did. Sites like Drudge, Breitbart, Guardian, Politico have a lot smaller piece of the pie than I expected.

Trump can call CNN fake all he wants but that hasn't stopped it from having a lot of viewers and claiming the top spot in trust according to PEW.

Republicans have almost no trust in PBS and NPR, a lot less than even CNN or even MSNBC. I never would have figured. I guess it's part of the government and cannot be trusted.

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Marty [Mori Chu]
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Marty [Mori Chu] » Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:15 am

It's a shame, because the PBS News Hour is about as calm and impartial a take on the news of the day as you will ever find. I seriously challenge anybody to watch 1-2 episodes of that and point me to the liberal bias.

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Nodack
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Re: Midterm Elections

Post by Nodack » Thu Oct 04, 2018 2:23 pm


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