Game of Thrones Season 8

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Mon May 13, 2019 1:08 pm

The bigger the show, the more critics it gets. I have loved the show. I think the visuals, the acting and the writing have been great. Sure I can pick it apart if I want to but, why? You can do that to any show if you want. They have told a great story that has captivated audiences for years and it has to come to an end... or does it?


Jon hasn’t made a single smart decision? He makes a lot of self sacrificing decisions for the good of the people which has earned him the respect of his people and people that weren’t his people. He is stupid brave. He is one guy who knew the Night King was the real threat and made that his priority, which was smartest thing anyone did. He took a LOT of risks that maybe weren’t smart but, they ended up being the difference. He always does what he thinks is right for the good of the people above his self interests which makes him a better leader than 99% of the rest who are always out for their own self interests. He is the one who should sit on the throne. He is a Targaryen and a Stark and the rightful heir to the throne. Since he is the most obvious choice that of course won’t happen.

Daenerys went over to the dark side. She felt betrayed by those closest to her. Everybody loves Jon and not her and he is the rightful heir and the word is out. “If they ring the bells that means they surrender.” She took out the fleet and all the defenses without killing innocents and then landed her dragon on a wall and waited for the bell. Everybody was waiting for the bell to ring. Finally the bell rings and what does she do? She says F it. I’m going to kill them all anyway because I hate them all.

Jon is in big trouble? He is still the same guy he was. I think he has changed his mind about Daenerys as has everyone else at this point. Who will they follow? She still has the Unsullied and the Drathaki but Jon will have everyone else if he makes a stand against her.

It sure seems fitting that Cercei and Jaime have been crushed together under the weight of the Iron Throne. We didn’t see them die though.

The Hound and the Mountain fought it out and the Mountain took a sword through the gut and it didn’t seem to bother him. He took a dagger through the eye into his brain and it didn’t seem to bother him. Clegane said F it and tackled him over the edge falling to their deaths hundreds of feet below and into the fiery rubble, which you would think would finish the job.

The show ends next week but...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/05/entertai ... index.html

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Mon May 13, 2019 1:38 pm

Nodack wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 1:08 pm


Jon hasn’t made a single smart decision? He makes a lot of self sacrificing decisions for the good of the people which has earned him the respect of his people and people that weren’t his people. He is stupid brave. He is one guy who knew the Night King was the real threat and made that his priority, which was smartest thing anyone did. He took a LOT of risks that maybe weren’t smart but, they ended up being the difference. He always does what he thinks is right for the good of the people above his self interests which makes him a better leader than 99% of the rest who are always out for their own self interests. He is the one who should sit on the throne. He is a Targaryen and a Stark and the rightful heir to the throne. Since he is the most obvious choice that of course won’t happen.
a) the decisions he made north of the wall didn't earn him respect from his people--they literally stabbed him multiple times through his heart because they were so pissed at what he did. He only earned their respect when he was resurrected from the dead and they figured they didn't have much of a choice.

Was it the right thing to do? Maybe. It didn't seem to make a difference at all with the battle against the Night King. Bran knew where he would, when he would be there, and even gave Arya the knife with which to kill him. Jon was busy trying to go straight up against a Wight Dragon at that time. That can't be a smart decision.

b) There is no such thing as a rightful heir to the throne. Everyone that sits on that throne has done so by killing someone else to take it, then claim they are rightfully there so their offspring can take it.

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Mon May 13, 2019 3:49 pm

a) They had a choice. He never threatened anyone and has never wanted to be a leader. Not everyone stabbed him. They assassinated him using a little boy as bait. He had lots of friends who stood by him. Those enemies in the north came to save him in his time of need and manned the walls afterwards. All the houses in the North named Jon their king out of respect. They were pissed when he bent the knee. What would be the outcome if Jon never went to Dragonstone, made Daenerys an ally and brought back all the dragon stone to make weapons? The Seven Kingdoms would have destroyed each other and the Night King would have cleaned up the mess. Everybody in the Seven Kingdoms owes their life to Jon Snow.

Jon wasn’t trying to go against a wight dragon. He was trying to get to Bran and the wight dragon was blocking his path. One would almost think that it was doing it on purpose...

a) That depends on who you talk to. After watching the show from beginning to end it sure seemed like a lot of people of the Seven Kingdoms thought it was important. Bronn had your opinion. “Kill a hundred people and they make you a lord. Kill a thousand and they make you a king.” Eddard Stark thought it was important and lost his head over it.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Mon May 13, 2019 7:57 pm

Nobody was happy with him when he brought the north folk back with him. Many didn't kill him, that is true. But really nobody said, "wow, Jon brought our enemies with him, i respect him more now!"

No dragon glass was used to kill the night king, so not sure about that. It was the same blade that was going to be used to kill Bran back in season 1. It was just a knife. And it didn't even take and army to get to the night king. He walked right up to Bran and Arya jumped out of no where and stabbed him. Bran knew he would be there and just waited for it to happen. No Jon. No Danny.


that last part doesn't depend on who you talk to. Just because Ned believed that Jaime's kid didn't have a right to be king doesn't mean anything. He was happy to have his bestie Robert Barratheon become king after the last Targaryon was murdered because he was bad/crazy. That isn't how inheritance works. Even if they felt the mad king shouldn't be king because he wasn't serving his people well, then it should have gone to his oldest son, right?

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ShelC
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by ShelC » Tue May 14, 2019 3:28 am

The dagger was Valryian steel iinm, which kills White Walkers.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Tue May 14, 2019 5:04 am

ShelC wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 3:28 am
The dagger was Valryian steel iinm, which kills White Walkers.
yes, but lots of people have that, and you didn't need to mine dragon glass for it.

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ShelC
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by ShelC » Tue May 14, 2019 5:33 am

It was a rare steel..."Since the destruction of Valyria, the majority of the surviving Valyrian steel weapons serve as heirlooms in the various noble Houses of Westeros....Skilled smiths can reforge Valyrian steel weapons by melting down existing ones, but it's a difficult process. Two smaller Valyrian steel swords can be made out of a larger greatsword, or a large greatsword made by melting down multiple smaller swords, but the amount of Valyrian steel in the world is finite and extremely rare."

https://gameofthrones.fandom.com/wiki/Valyrian_steel

There was an opening to an episode in either Seasons 3 or 4 that shows them melting down and reforging a new Valyrian steel sword that Tywin gives to Jaime. Dragon glass for the masses because there was so much in abundance.

Edit: Sorry, didn't mean to nerd out. It's been a slow morning. :geek:

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Tue May 14, 2019 7:18 am

ShelC wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 5:33 am
Edit: Sorry, didn't mean to nerd out. It's been a slow morning. :geek:
:lol:

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Tue May 14, 2019 11:23 am

Nobody was happy with him when he brought the north folk back with him. Many didn't kill him, that is true. But really nobody said, "wow, Jon brought our enemies with him, i respect him more now!"
They weren’t happy but, they got over it pretty fast when they ended up fighting side by side with the north folk after that in the battle of the bastards. After that all of the houses of the north joined the cause and they all demanded Jon be their king. Then again they weren’t that happy with Jon when he left to get dragon glass and ally with Daenerys. They got over that when they all fought side by side in the battle of Winterfell. Of course now that Daenerys has gone mad and massacred all of Kings Landing that all changes.

The dragon glass wasn’t just for the Night King. It kills all the white walkers. They put it everywhere, on barricades, on the castle walls on every weapon.

https://www.cosmopolitan.com/entertainm ... f-thrones/
Wights: These zombie soldiers in the army of the dead are the easiest ones to kill, since there seems to be more options for them. They can be killed by being set on fire or stabbed with either dragonglass or Valyrian steel. But the easiest way to wipe out huge swaths of wights is to kill the White Walker that created them in the first place so they’ll all drop dead (or re-dead) immediately.

White Walkers: Samwell Tarly of all people was the first person in modern history to discover how to kill a White Walker when he stabbed one with dragonglass. Later at the battle of Hardhome, we saw Jon Snow shatter one to pieces with his sword made out of Valyrian steel—the strongest and rarest type of steel in the GoT universe. As far as we know, there are only five characters (Jon, Sam, Jaime, Brienne, and Arya) with Valyrian steel weapons.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Tue May 14, 2019 11:31 am

The dragon glass wasn’t just for the Night King. It kills all the white walkers. They put it everywhere, on barricades, on the castle walls on every weapon.
Yep, I get how special it is when it comes to them. My point was that it didn't matter how many of them you killed with it or how much of it you had. In the end, everything this show has been leading up to for most of a decade was wiped out with a single blow from a blade to one guy. You didn't need to sacrifice 5000 Darthraki and their horses for that. The night king, all by himself, just walked up to Bran and slowly started to pull a sword. We don't even know what he wanted, or why he did what he did. We just know he was bad, and Arya stabbed him and all the other wights died with him. That, and that Bran knew how it was going to end and even set everything into motion. Jon is a lot like Indiana Jones in Raiders. No matter what Indy did, the movie would have still played out the exact same way even if he wasn't there.

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Tue May 14, 2019 1:57 pm

Before he became a White Walker, the Night King was a First Man that was captured by Children of the Forest, Leaf among them. Leaf pressed a dragonglass dagger into his chest, causing his eyes to turn blue and turning him into the first of the White Walkers. The Children of the Forest created the White Walkers to defend themselves when Westeros was invaded by the First Men, who were cutting their sacred trees and slaughtering them.


The night king wasn’t going to just walk up and let somebody kill him. They knew that. I was gonna under the impression that Bran was important to the night king because he was the three eyed raven, which is holds the entire history of humans and the night king wanted to eliminate him above all else for some reason, maybe to erase the history on man. Bran knew that and came up with the plan to use himself as bait. He needed to be vulnerable before the night king would come. The night king just walked up and drew his sword slowly after his victory looked like a sure thing and there was nobody left guarding Bran.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Tue May 14, 2019 2:15 pm

Nodack wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 1:57 pm
Before he became a White Walker, the Night King was a First Man that was captured by Children of the Forest, Leaf among them. Leaf pressed a dragonglass dagger into his chest, causing his eyes to turn blue and turning him into the first of the White Walkers. The Children of the Forest created the White Walkers to defend themselves when Westeros was invaded by the First Men, who were cutting their sacred trees and slaughtering them.


The night king wasn’t going to just walk up and let somebody kill him. They knew that. I was gonna under the impression that Bran was important to the night king because he was the three eyed raven, which is holds the entire history of humans and the night king wanted to eliminate him above all else for some reason, maybe to erase the history on man. Bran knew that and came up with the plan to use himself as bait. He needed to be vulnerable before the night king would come. The night king just walked up and drew his sword slowly after his victory looked like a sure thing and there was nobody left guarding Bran.
By that logic, there didn't need to be a war at all. Nobody needed to die. Bran could have just hung out with nobody (or maybe a couple minions) guarding him, let the night king walk up, and then have cat-like Arya jump from behind the scenes and kill him. Poof. All gone, without sacrificing thousands of souls. easy peasey

(by the way, I enjoy talking with you about this, so I hope you aren't offended by my takes on how the show has turned the last couple of seasons)

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Tue May 14, 2019 5:26 pm

Not at all. I love to banter with you. :D

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Tue May 14, 2019 5:28 pm

I took an English class and n high school called How to win an argument. I enjoy when we are on opposite sides in politics. It doesn’t happen much but it is fun sometimes.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Tue May 14, 2019 6:29 pm

Nodack wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 5:28 pm
I took an English class and n high school called How to win an argument. I enjoy when we are on opposite sides in politics. It doesn’t happen much but it is fun sometimes.
wow, high school. Was that in the 80s? :P


agreed.

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Tue May 14, 2019 8:16 pm

Graduated in... never mind.

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Nodack
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Nodack » Sun May 19, 2019 9:48 pm

It is done.

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ShelC
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by ShelC » Mon May 20, 2019 5:29 am

Thought it ended about as well as it could've at this point, right? You can argue a lot of things didn't make sense or ended up not meaning anything but I think the characters all ended up where they need to be. It was like GRRM told the writers, "Here's how I see the ending for each character, fill in the blank(s) on how to get there".

I think when people re-watch this series in 5 or 10 years or whatever, more will be in agreement that there was a noticeable change after season 6.

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Indy
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by Indy » Mon May 20, 2019 5:40 am

ShelC wrote:
Mon May 20, 2019 5:29 am
Thought it ended about as well as it could've at this point, right? You can argue a lot of things didn't make sense or ended up not meaning anything but I think the characters all ended up where they need to be. It was like GRRM told the writers, "Here's how I see the ending for each character, fill in the blank(s) on how to get there".

I think when people re-watch this series in 5 or 10 years or whatever, more will be in agreement that there was a noticeable change after season 6.
yeah, it went from well-planned, to thrown together will cool spectacle.

* Where was the white horse that Arya found out of nowhere at the end of the last episode? What was the point?
* No way Gray Worm lets Jon live if he knows what he did. He would not have kept him in prison for weeks on end.
* Why did Drogon decide to melt the iron throne? It is like he knew what it stood for and was melting it as a warning to others that this game has ended... but he isn't a TV writer... he is a dragon.
* Why would anyone at that gathering besides Samwell think Bran would be a good king? He has literally done nothing for 10 years. He just exists to exist. Talk about failing up.
* Why would Gray Worm think it was a good idea to let the people their choose a new king/queen, knowing they would decide his fate and that of Tyrion and Jon? He was more loyal to Dany than anyone, and gained the most from her.

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ShelC
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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8

Post by ShelC » Mon May 20, 2019 6:10 am

Indy wrote:
Mon May 20, 2019 5:40 am
ShelC wrote:
Mon May 20, 2019 5:29 am
Thought it ended about as well as it could've at this point, right? You can argue a lot of things didn't make sense or ended up not meaning anything but I think the characters all ended up where they need to be. It was like GRRM told the writers, "Here's how I see the ending for each character, fill in the blank(s) on how to get there".

I think when people re-watch this series in 5 or 10 years or whatever, more will be in agreement that there was a noticeable change after season 6.
yeah, it went from well-planned, to thrown together will cool spectacle.


* Where was the white horse that Arya found out of nowhere at the end of the last episode? What was the point? "Symbolism"/Cool Visual?
* No way Gray Worm lets Jon live if he knows what he did. He would not have kept him in prison for weeks on end. - 100% Agree.
* Why did Drogon decide to melt the iron throne? It is like he knew what it stood for and was melting it as a warning to others that this game has ended... but he isn't a TV writer... he is a dragon. - More symbolism.
* Why would anyone at that gathering besides Samwell think Bran would be a good king? He has literally done nothing for 10 years. He just exists to exist. Talk about failing up. - Still at a loss with this character. Can he see the future or not? Did he know all of this was going to happen? But yea, no way they'd make him King in his current condition. For years he's been all "I'm not longer Bran. I feel nothing. I want nothing. Ok, I'll be King."
* Why would Gray Worm think it was a good idea to let the people their choose a new king/queen, knowing they would decide his fate and that of Tyrion and Jon? He was more loyal to Dany than anyone, and gained the most from her. - Gray Worm and the armies were probably a major issue for the writers in sorting things out after the first act of the episode. Seems like they just decided to ignore logic and just push thru with the story.
Last edited by ShelC on Mon May 20, 2019 8:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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