Phxsuns.net is dead, long live phx-suns.net!

[Mori Chu]

I don't mind Cubby at all, and we even allowed him here for a brief time. But he made a few threads that were nothing more than anti-Suns trolling after we'd lost a game or something of that nature, and folks got upset, so I asked him to leave. I still like the dude but I understand why others don't and why he doesn't fit in as part of our community.

[Indy]

I have a hard time tolerating blatant racists.

[Phoenix219]

By definition, thats what tolerance is - putting up with something that you *really really* don't like, and in fact, could despise.... but *tolerating it.*

[Superbone]

The only thing I'm thankful for about that bitter dude is that he was the genesis of phxsuns.net.

[Aztec Sunsfan]

By definition, thats what tolerance is - putting up with something that you *really really* don't like, and in fact, could despise.... but *tolerating it.*

Tolerance is not about allowing constant abuse from others. Respect must be a two-way road in order to call for tolerance.

That Cubby guy in essence is nothing but an atention-whore, pressing whatever buttons neccesary to get a response, a validation of his existence.

[Indy]

By definition, thats what tolerance is - putting up with something that you *really really* don't like, and in fact, could despise.... but *tolerating it.*

I must have missed your point

[Immortal]

I joined up in the early 2000's. I was Immortal on the other site. I tried registering with that name here, but I could never get the activation email to come through on my MSN account. Had to create this one with gmail. I sure wish I could find my Rebel avatar somewhere.

[Cap]

By definition, thats what tolerance is - putting up with something that you *really really* don't like, and in fact, could despise.... but *tolerating it.*

I must have missed your point

Just that it's kind of redundant to say you have a hard time tolerating something (in this case blatant racists). If tolerating something isn't a challenge, the term "tolerate" doesn't really apply. You don't talk about "tolerating" people being wonderful.

[Indy]

Well I do. You don't know me very well.

And I disagree. I can easily tolerate some things. Tolerance isn't know for awful things. Just things you don't agree with.

[Superbone]

I joined up in the early 2000's. I was Immortal on the other site. I tried registering with that name here, but I could never get the activation email to come through on my MSN account. Had to create this one with gmail. I sure wish I could find my Rebel avatar somewhere.

Maybe Mori could set you up with your rightful user name.

[virtual9mm]

My issue with Cubby is that he just made things so unpleasant that he started to drive people away. Like me, for instance.

One issue was the spam, like the posting of tens, or even hundreds of threads just to drown out conversation. It's along the same principles as a DDOS attack on a website.

But the bigger issue is that if you want to foster greater tolerance, you have to abide by certain rights and responsibilities. Cubby's MO was never to engage in conversation. He just wanted to attack people using very racist and frankly -- evil -- language. I remember there being a very nice poster of latina background (YGR). He posted really nasty sexist and racist language that would have landed him in jail had he done it in person. Hence, the effectiveness of VT's threat.

When I was a mod back at Sose's site, I was perhaps too intolerant of certain harmless posts (especially from Phoenix219 regarding Marion). But Cubby's stuff was harmful. The point at which a pluralistic society can no longer tolerate diversity is when there is one form of this "diversity" that would destroy the very diversity that spawned it. That's the same reason why we in the US cannot tolerate fundamentalist Islam of the type that encourages terrorism against non Muslims.

[LazarusLong]

Cubby was sometimes clever and oddly entertaining, but he eventually always reverted back to be a cyber bully, sometimes a vicious one. There's no room or reason for that, anytime.

[Mori Chu]

azwildcat: If you want me to rename your user account, just send me a PM and tell me exactly what username you want and I'll make it so.

[Superbone]

Cubby was sometimes clever and oddly entertaining, but he eventually always reverted back to be a cyber bully, sometimes a vicious one. There's no room or reason for that, anytime.

Exactly.

Life is too short to be associated with his type.

[Phoenix219]

Well I do. You don't know me very well.

And I disagree. I can easily tolerate some things. Tolerance isn't know for awful things. Just things you don't agree with.

I've been trying not to post here because it never goes well, and there is still a bad taste in my mouth from times past. I had to address this point, though. The problem comes with - what, or who defines the difference between awful, and things you don't agree with? Who decides where the moral compass lies? Yeah, there reaches a point where its just so evil that everyone agrees, but before that point, there is a lot of *giant* gray area where people need to be allowed to make their own personal judgement calls on their own feelings and philosophies, and there needs to be a point where that is OK, and that we all just agree to disagree.

in the end, how can you know what is "ok" to tolerate and what "isn't" ? who is so superior that it can *define* that spectrum for an entire species, race or nationality? when you attach an arbitrarily chosen moral compass to it.... it seems to almost defeat the point of tolerating something.

Tolerance needs to be as neutral at possible or it is pointless and becomes more like the politically correct code that seems to be enforced these days. individuality should be the most *celebrated* part of us ALL and bring out the biggest variety and ranges of outcomes. I am not you, and I do not have to agree with you, but we should all be able to agree that is okay and our individual perogative.

In the case of Cubby, most of that stuff was terrible and worthy of being banned, 10, 15 years ago. Thats not what got him ran off now, when he wasn't given the benefit of the doubt, or more of a 2 day chance in general from anyone. I've always been at the very least supportive of a thread in the general section with an Enter at your own Risk type attitude where he would be allowed to engage those who did. He's pretty harmless these days over on spurstalk, and as Laz said, is oddly entertaining.

Some people will never like him, and thats fine (this isn't directed at anyone in particular!)... thats awesome, good for you. But just say, I don't like him because he's an Asshole and keep it real, because by definition, its not an issue of tolerance.

[Mori Chu]

In the case of Cubby, most of that stuff was terrible and worthy of being banned, 10, 15 years ago. Thats not what got him ran off now, when he wasn't given the benefit of the doubt, or more of a 2 day chance in general from anyone. I've always been at the very least supportive of a thread in the general section with an Enter at your own Risk type attitude where he would be allowed to engage those who did. He's pretty harmless these days over on spurstalk, and as Laz said, is oddly entertaining.

I gave him a shot here, let him make an account (personally invited him to, actually), and stood up for him initially when people objected to that; I wanted to give him a chance. And he was pretty decently behaved for a week or two. But then after a while, Cubby was targeting individual posters telling them to go F**k their mother and other such things. I also got reports that he was sending rude PMs. And he made a vulgar thread after the Suns lost a game, taunting us. It wasn't in the "General" section. I decided to ban him at that point. I think it was merited.

[YGR]

My issue with Cubby is that he just made things so unpleasant that he started to drive people away. Like me, for instance.

One issue was the spam, like the posting of tens, or even hundreds of threads just to drown out conversation. It's along the same principles as a DDOS attack on a website.

But the bigger issue is that if you want to foster greater tolerance, you have to abide by certain rights and responsibilities. Cubby's MO was never to engage in conversation. He just wanted to attack people using very racist and frankly -- evil -- language. I remember there being a very nice poster of latina background (YGR). He posted really nasty sexist and racist language that would have landed him in jail had he done it in person. Hence, the effectiveness of VT's threat.

When I was a mod back at Sose's site, I was perhaps too intolerant of certain harmless posts (especially from Phoenix219 regarding Marion). But Cubby's stuff was harmful. The point at which a pluralistic society can no longer tolerate diversity is when there is one form of this "diversity" that would destroy the very diversity that spawned it. That's the same reason why we in the US cannot tolerate fundamentalist Islam of the type that encourages terrorism against non Muslims.

It’s nice to see you again v9. I, YGR, am from Okinawa, Japan. You were always nice to me. Thank you. I think I gave you and other moderators unpleasant time when almost end of your moderator and I am sorry. I wanted apologized to you that time but you were already gone. I think the one of the reasons you left the old site of moderator was because of me. If it was I am very sorry. You and all other moderators were doing great job.

I do remember VT. He mentioned to me that time like, “Fact of life with Cubby, you just admitted weakness, that’s a huge mistake, you need to develop a thick skin (I think) because you just advertised weakness.”

[YGR]

azwildcat: If you want me to rename your user account, just send me a PM and tell me exactly what username you want and I'll make it so.

Mori, I’m jumping in, too. I’ll PM you. Somehow I couldn’t register in with YGR. Ganachan is for my Japanese friends; YGR is part of Phx-suns family. Thanks in advance.

[YGR]

Wow!! I am YGR again!!

That’s a quick response!! Thank you, Mori.

[SwingMan]

Wow!! I am YGR again!!

That’s a quick response!! Thank you, Mori.

Welcome back, YGR - lots of us oldtimers making it back, for sure.

Who else is missing - RE? BillyJoeJimBob? I've got a note out to UO, but he's busy being a brand new daddy.