Phx-Suns.Net

In2ition wrote: I totally understand that, but he was just playing the game with the rules set in place. Time will tell if he did the right thing, and it took a long time to start seeing positive results of his plan. I think we can start to see that it's going to work out quite well, as long as everyone stays healthy. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

Hinkie got a raw deal but it wasn't because of the tank stuff. It was because he didn't do media. The local media continually roasted him for his unavailability. The thing is, he was available but would rarely ever go on the record.

The 76ers are in a fairly decent position roster and salary wise right now, and the Colangelo's are there to reap the rewards after Hinkie bore the brunt of the ire for 3 years. That is pretty shitty. Thankfully it looks like Bryan is screwing things up just like I thought he would. Playing Embiid with a meniscus tear? Idiotic at best. Once they add this year's pick and the Laker's pick they will be pretty good. Embiid needs to stay healthy and they need to resolve the Noel & Okafor issue. I also have changed my mind on Simmons and would just sit him the rest of the year.

carey wrote:

In2ition wrote: I totally understand that, but he was just playing the game with the rules set in place. Time will tell if he did the right thing, and it took a long time to start seeing positive results of his plan. I think we can start to see that it's going to work out quite well, as long as everyone stays healthy. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

Hinkie got a raw deal but it wasn't because of the tank stuff. It was because he didn't do media. The local media continually roasted him for his unavailability. The thing is, he was available but would rarely ever go on the record.

The 76ers are in a fairly decent position roster and salary wise right now, and the Colangelo's are there to reap the rewards after Hinkie bore the brunt of the ire for 3 years. That is pretty s***. Thankfully it looks like Bryan is screwing things up just like I thought he would. Playing Embiid with a meniscus tear? Idiotic at best. Once they add this year's pick and the Laker's pick they will be pretty good. Embiid needs to stay healthy and they need to resolve the Noel & Okafor issue. I also have changed my mind on Simmons and would just sit him the rest of the year.

Are you saying Hinkie is like Lance Blanks, but had a better vision and eye for talent? I still can't believe how Blanks was just giddy when he signed MB and then the way he handed the coaching to Hunter, smh.

In2ition wrote: Are you saying Hinkie is like Lance Blanks, but had a better vision and eye for talent? I still can't believe how Blanks was just giddy when he signed MB and then the way he handed the coaching to Hunter, smh.

What? How did you get that from my post? Blanks was an idiot.

In2ition wrote:

JCSunsfan wrote:

Ring_Wanted wrote:Those talks demonizing Hinkie and clamoring for a lotto revamp were a big overreaction. The draft is perfectible for sure but the 76rs did nothing wrong in my opinion and objectively tanking has always been a thing. This guy simply chose to go this route without trying to dissimulate it. Never saw why the fuss. If his FO was willing to endure the pain, let them have it.

I disagree. Hinkie trotted out some of the worst line ups the NBA has ever seen. He made a mockery of NBA competition. The whole reason for the lottery was to discourage tanking, yet he did it for multiple years. Its one thing to go with younger players. But Hinkie went beyond that. I think the league office agreed with this.

JMO.

I totally understand that, but he was just playing the game with the rules set in place. Time will tell if he did the right thing, and it took a long time to start seeing positive results of his plan. I think we can start to see that it's going to work out quite well, as long as everyone stays healthy. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

There are rules and norms. Hinkie obeyed the rules while violating the norms. It is unfortunate when the rules contain perverse incentives that reward norm breaking, but the norm breaker is still due for some reprobation.

carey wrote:

In2ition wrote: Are you saying Hinkie is like Lance Blanks, but had a better vision and eye for talent? I still can't believe how Blanks was just giddy when he signed MB and then the way he handed the coaching to Hunter, smh.

What? How did you get that from my post? Blanks was an idiot.

It wasn't a dis of your post. Sorry you thought that, Carey. I have to work on my inflection game when I post. I totally agree, Blanks was an idiot. One of his criticisms was that he was terrible with the media and had Babby be his talking piece.

Cap wrote:

In2ition wrote:

JCSunsfan wrote:

Ring_Wanted wrote:Those talks demonizing Hinkie and clamoring for a lotto revamp were a big overreaction. The draft is perfectible for sure but the 76rs did nothing wrong in my opinion and objectively tanking has always been a thing. This guy simply chose to go this route without trying to dissimulate it. Never saw why the fuss. If his FO was willing to endure the pain, let them have it.

I disagree. Hinkie trotted out some of the worst line ups the NBA has ever seen. He made a mockery of NBA competition. The whole reason for the lottery was to discourage tanking, yet he did it for multiple years. Its one thing to go with younger players. But Hinkie went beyond that. I think the league office agreed with this.

JMO.

I totally understand that, but he was just playing the game with the rules set in place. Time will tell if he did the right thing, and it took a long time to start seeing positive results of his plan. I think we can start to see that it's going to work out quite well, as long as everyone stays healthy. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

There are rules and norms. Hinkie obeyed the rules while violating the norms. It is unfortunate when the rules contain perverse incentives that reward norm breaking, but the norm breaker is still due for some reprobation.

I kind of feel that the SSOL Suns got a lot of backlash because they were trying to break the norms. I felt that it was apparent in how the refs and league treated them at times.

I would be willing to bet that somewhere in the ownership by-laws is a statement regarding sincerely seeking to be competitive.

JCSunsfan wrote:I would be willing to bet that somewhere in the ownership by-laws is a statement regarding sincerely seeking to be competitive.

Not that I've heard of.

Of course, Hinkie would argue that he was sincerely seeking to be competitive, but prioritizing the long-term. It's kind of like a macrocosm of resting a star who's healthy enough to play, a practice that used to be controversial but is becoming more accepted.

JCSunsfan wrote:

Ring_Wanted wrote:Those talks demonizing Hinkie and clamoring for a lotto revamp were a big overreaction. The draft is perfectible for sure but the 76rs did nothing wrong in my opinion and objectively tanking has always been a thing. This guy simply chose to go this route without trying to dissimulate it. Never saw why the fuss. If his FO was willing to endure the pain, let them have it.

I disagree. Hinkie trotted out some of the worst line ups the NBA has ever seen. He made a mockery of NBA competition. The whole reason for the lottery was to discourage tanking, yet he did it for multiple years. Its one thing to go with younger players. But Hinkie went beyond that. I think the league office agreed with this.

JMO.

I agree with this totally. I see no genius in tanking. It is not good for the fans of the 76ers or the league. I see genius in San Antonio and how they have kept themselves a factor for over 20 years. You can say they tanked to get Duncan but I think a lot of that was related to an injury to Robinson as well. Whether we like them or not the Lakers never tanked while Jerry Buss was alive. We may hate them but I think most of that is born out of envy and the arrogance of their fans and players not their process.

JCSunsfan wrote:I would be willing to bet that somewhere in the ownership by-laws is a statement regarding sincerely seeking to be competitive.

I would hope. Otherwise, they may try to go to a Euro model where the bottom teams are dropped down to the G League

I didn't say Hinkie was a genius. Just that he did not commit a sin against the basketball gods. It's true that some of his rosters were vomit inducing, but again, a huge part of that was the specific players he drafted, which was determined mainly by draft position. BPA dealt him big men that took years to show up on the court. Rebuilding is ugly and there are many ways to go at it, but while his kids were healing or developing overseas, he made trades for future assets and filled out his roster with garbage and unknown prospects. Why the hate? I wouldn't have spent on trying to win either, and once we get at a certain point, I don't give a damn about the difference between 12 wins and 21.

I wonder though for both the Sixers and the Suns, if they are able to draft and/or find a number of stars and get back to competing for a title with a bunch of great young players, will they be willing to pay them all and pay the luxury tax too? I know this is far down the road, but what if the Sixers have 4 of the 10 best under 25 yr old players? Will they stick to a core that continues and grows together even if they all demand top dollar?