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Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 4:49 am
by Phoenix219
Ring_Wanted wrote:Shabazz wrote:For all the spacing Frye provided, we'd be having similar issues if he was still around.
Of course Frye doesn't solve rebounding or defense, but our offense has been a big problem too. Stagnant and too one on one oriented. Extremely unpleasant to watch for long stretches and just too inconsistent. Less than 100 points against the likes of Nuggets, Pistons, Magic, Heat? Really?
That's where Frye made the real difference. His partnership with Dragic was crazy productive, to the tune of the most prolific pick and pop/roll combo in the league at 1.30 points per possession or so. That's a go to move and even something you can base a whole offense on. This is the only stat I care about. The guy did one thing but did it at an all nba level.
The difference from having that starting, plus Kieff off the bench, to what we have now with is just abysmal.
Maybe some of you differ, but with the gift of hindsight I pay Frye 8M instead of 7M to IT3 and I don't hesitate at all. All I can see is that this swap has turned a solution (offensively) into a problem (everywhere) and it's making Suns basketball pretty hard to watch again.
I agree completely... with the added conclusion that building around that insanely productive go to move also puts Dragic in the driver's seat instead of Bledsoe... leading me to conclude that letting Bledsoe walk could have still gotten us our productive bench PG and all the FTs he can get while still retaining Frye, our offense, and Dragic as lead PG.....and allowing our rookies a bit of time to boot.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 6:01 am
by Indy
SDC wrote:Indy wrote:He has the best true shooting percentage on our team.
bledsoe?
what is the equation for True Shooting Percentage? how do you calculate it?
btw, bledsoe's shooting numbers are .437 FG and .318 3pt FG.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:18 am
by jkalldaway
Indy, were you saying Bledsoe has the best True Shooting % on the team? If so, that isn't true. IT is at 58.4% compared to Bledsoe's 55.4%. Bledsoe is actually 6th. Apologies if you didn't mean Bledsoe.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:41 am
by Indy
Guys--so sorry. I thought I was sorted by TS%. Clearly I wasn't. Must have been TOs/game.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:42 am
by carey
I thought TS weighted 3-point FGs also?
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:53 am
by Indy
It does because it includes points scored, not just shots made.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 8:02 am
by Ring_Wanted
Speaking of TS%, the Mavs seem in talks to trade for Rondo using among other stuff Brandan Wright, whose TS% is a crazy 76%.
I'd try to get involved in that trade. Without Rondo, the Celtics are one of the few teams that need Thomas' offense and where he'd start, and Plumlee also makes sense to them alongside Sullinger/Olynyk.
What kind of return would you look for in such scenario?
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 8:34 am
by carey
Ring_Wanted wrote:Speaking of TS%, the Mavs seem in talks to trade for Rondo using among other stuff Brandan Wright, whose TS% is a crazy 76%.
I'd try to get involved in that trade. Without Rondo, the Celtics are one of the few teams that need Thomas' offense and where he'd start, and Plumlee also makes sense to them alongside Sullinger/Olynyk.
What kind of return would you look for in such scenario?
My shot at a 3-way.
Greg Smith, Brandan Wright, and Jeff Green to Phoenix.
Rondo to Dallas.
IT3, PJ Tucker, and Jameer Nelson to Boston along with a 1st rounder from each of Dallas & Phoenix.
New Suns line-up
Bledsoe-Ennis
Dragic-Green-Goodwin
Green-Marcus
Markieff, Wright, Smith
Len, Plumlee
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 9:53 am
by Indy
My shot at a 3-way.
I was thinking Scarlett Johansson and Zoe Saldana.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 10:06 am
by Mori Chu
carey wrote:My shot at a 3-way.
Greg Smith, Brandan Wright, and Jeff Green to Phoenix.
Rondo to Dallas.
IT3, PJ Tucker, and Jameer Nelson to Boston along with a 1st rounder from each of Dallas & Phoenix.
New Suns line-up
Bledsoe-Ennis
Dragic-Green-Goodwin
Green-Marcus
Markieff, Wright, Smith
Len, Plumlee
Isn't Jeff Green more of a PF? Can he actually stay in front of the majority of NBA SFs? Also, isn't Green the kind of guy you want to murder after he's been on your team for a while; that is, the kind of guy who'll have one great game and then 3 bad ones, etc.? I hear the Sports Guy talk all the time about how frustrating and inconsistent he is. Are you sure we want him here?
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 10:09 am
by Indy
He is 4th on the Celtics in Defensive Win Shares, and 2nd in Offensive Win Shares. I know that doesn't answer your question, and it is an "advanced stat", but it is another data point.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 10:22 am
by Ring_Wanted
Green is a SF who can play some PF. Historically inconsistent on offense, yes, but seems to have improved in that area. Still very weak rebounder but a quality defender, even got to bother LeBron during their battles in the playoffs.
But I would do without him in a trade. I just want to see Warren. If we were to pry away a piece from the C's, I'd try Olynyk.
And Carey, I knew some of you would aim for both Wright and Greg Smith, but if you are the Mavs, you want at least one backup to Chandler, don't you?
How about this:
Boston gets IT3, Plumlee, Felton, 1stR from Dallas, 1stR from Suns.
Dallas gets Rondo.
Suns get Wright, Olynyk.
No Olynyk = no Plumlee/pick.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 5:37 pm
by SDC
Superboner wrote:Too bad Tolliver doesn't defend or rebound very well. It looks like Frye is being missed big time. I'd probably go back in time and give him that contract. Sure, it's on the high side especially as he ages but we're just not the same team this year. He would have been worth it.
let me qualify, i would not have given him that contract, BUT i would have traded for frye using IT's contract. makes the suns a top ten team. now you need one more big to be a contender. Len is not that person.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 6:07 pm
by Indy
SDC wrote:Superboner wrote:Too bad Tolliver doesn't defend or rebound very well. It looks like Frye is being missed big time. I'd probably go back in time and give him that contract. Sure, it's on the high side especially as he ages but we're just not the same team this year. He would have been worth it.
let me qualify, i would not have given him that contract, BUT i would have traded for frye using IT's contract.
makes the suns a top ten team. now you need one more big to be a contender. Len is not that person.
Puff, puff, pass!
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 6:17 pm
by SDC
they were a top ten team in the espn power rankings all throughout last season.
anyways, from a marc stein tweet:
(2 of 2) Given our reports over the summer that free agent-to-be Goran Dragic has passed Rondo on Houston's wish list when it comes to PGs
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:34 pm
by Indy
SDC wrote:they were a top ten team in the espn power rankings all throughout last season.
anyways, from a marc stein tweet:
(2 of 2) Given our reports over the summer that free agent-to-be Goran Dragic has passed Rondo on Houston's wish list when it comes to PGs
That is completely subjective. Why does that matter?
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:44 pm
by Superbone
The top 10 might not be good enough for a playoff spot in the West.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 8:03 pm
by iLLmatic
Indy wrote:My shot at a 3-way.
I was thinking Scarlett Johansson and Zoe Saldana.
I see your Scarlett Johansson and Zoe Saldana, and raise you to Scarlett Johansson and Kate Upton.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 8:06 pm
by Indy
iLLmatic wrote:Indy wrote:My shot at a 3-way.
I was thinking Scarlett Johansson and Zoe Saldana.
I see your Scarlett Johansson and Zoe Saldana, and raise you to Scarlett Johansson and Kate Upton.
I like more color in my palette.
Re: Game Day: Bucks (12-12) @ Suns (12-13), Mon 12/15/14
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 8:20 pm
by iLLmatic
^ I like bigger boobs on mine.