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Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:IT is NOT in anyway more efficient than LeBron. MVP leaders for me are the leagues 2 best, LeBron, then Kawhi.

He's actually more efficient in many ways. His PER is higher, his true shooting % is higher, he's got a lower turnover rate.

PER is an offensive stat, means squat. LeBron shoots a higher % from the field and 3. LeBron also plays defense at a high level, something I consider efficient, Thomas is a trashcan defensively. Where's the nerd stat that measure defensive energy expended? Nerds have a stat for everything. I hate true shooting percentage, if youre a guy who dunks all the time, it will be super high, look at DJordan, cant shoot a lick, yet there he is. Silly nerd stats.

So offense means squat? I get that PER doesn't measure defense, but it shows that IT is a more efficient offensive player. I won't argue defensively, LeBron is better. As for true shooting percentage, yes it can be misleading with guys that just dunk, but that's a terrible argument to make against IT, who's probably never dunked in his life. The truth is IT scores more per shot than LeBron and I would bet he gets less easy baskets than LeBron.

You're using tiny differences in percentages to argue Thomas is a more efficient offensive player, when if you just watch the games, those numbers go out the window. LeBron makes his teammates better, Thomas does not. Thomas is having the season of his life, LeBron has been doing this with ridiculous efficiency for 12 years. I'm not buying that in the slightest.

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:IT is NOT in anyway more efficient than LeBron. MVP leaders for me are the leagues 2 best, LeBron, then Kawhi.

He's actually more efficient in many ways. His PER is higher, his true shooting % is higher, he's got a lower turnover rate.

PER is an offensive stat, means squat. LeBron shoots a higher % from the field and 3. LeBron also plays defense at a high level, something I consider efficient, Thomas is a trashcan defensively. Where's the nerd stat that measure defensive energy expended? Nerds have a stat for everything. I hate true shooting percentage, if youre a guy who dunks all the time, it will be super high, look at DJordan, cant shoot a lick, yet there he is. Silly nerd stats.

So offense means squat? I get that PER doesn't measure defense, but it shows that IT is a more efficient offensive player. I won't argue defensively, LeBron is better. As for true shooting percentage, yes it can be misleading with guys that just dunk, but that's a terrible argument to make against IT, who's probably never dunked in his life. The truth is IT scores more per shot than LeBron and I would bet he gets less easy baskets than LeBron.

You're using tiny differences in percentages to argue Thomas is a more efficient offensive player, when if you just watch the games, those numbers go out the window. LeBron makes his teammates better, Thomas does not. Thomas is having the season of his life, LeBron has been doing this with ridiculous efficiency for 12 years. I'm not buying that in the slightest.

You're right, IT is having the season of his life and LeBron has been incredible for 12 years, my comments were only about this season. In fact, I said people were being influenced by LeBron's past seasons in calling him the obvious MVP, which seems to be the case here.

You're also right that IT is only slightly more efficient than LeBron this year, but he's still more efficient. And those numbers don't go out the window watching the games, whether you watch the games or not, IT still scores more per shot than LeBron and he still turns the ball over at a lesser rate than LeBron.

Ulis was much more efficient than IT on Sunday. Booya!

Superbone wrote:Ulis was much more efficient than IT on Sunday. Booya!

But was he more efficient than LeBron?

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Superbone wrote:Ulis was much more efficient than IT on Sunday. Booya!

But was he more efficient than LeBron?

#Ulis4MVP #NBABallot

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Superbone wrote:Ulis was much more efficient than IT on Sunday. Booya!

But was he more efficient than LeBron?

Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Split T wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

Split T wrote:
He's actually more efficient in many ways. His PER is higher, his true shooting % is higher, he's got a lower turnover rate.

PER is an offensive stat, means squat. LeBron shoots a higher % from the field and 3. LeBron also plays defense at a high level, something I consider efficient, Thomas is a trashcan defensively. Where's the nerd stat that measure defensive energy expended? Nerds have a stat for everything. I hate true shooting percentage, if youre a guy who dunks all the time, it will be super high, look at DJordan, cant shoot a lick, yet there he is. Silly nerd stats.

So offense means squat? I get that PER doesn't measure defense, but it shows that IT is a more efficient offensive player. I won't argue defensively, LeBron is better. As for true shooting percentage, yes it can be misleading with guys that just dunk, but that's a terrible argument to make against IT, who's probably never dunked in his life. The truth is IT scores more per shot than LeBron and I would bet he gets less easy baskets than LeBron.

You're using tiny differences in percentages to argue Thomas is a more efficient offensive player, when if you just watch the games, those numbers go out the window. LeBron makes his teammates better, Thomas does not. Thomas is having the season of his life, LeBron has been doing this with ridiculous efficiency for 12 years. I'm not buying that in the slightest.

You're right, IT is having the season of his life and LeBron has been incredible for 12 years, my comments were only about this season. In fact, I said people were being influenced by LeBron's past seasons in calling him the obvious MVP, which seems to be the case here.

You're also right that IT is only slightly more efficient than LeBron this year, but he's still more efficient. And those numbers don't go out the window watching the games, whether you watch the games or not, IT still scores more per shot than LeBron and he still turns the ball over at a lesser rate than LeBron.

This goes to show what an awesome year IT is having.

IT is having a monster season offensively. At his size whereabouts I guess his only rivals are Iverson and Tiny Archibald. Advanced stuff crucify him defensively.

I wonder if his defensive stats look worse than they seem because he plays with so many standout defenders. Bradley and Smart are widely considered great defenders and Boston in general is a great defensive team. I know stats like Defensive real plus minus are supposed to account for this, but not knowing how the stat works makes me wonder how accurate it really is.

He needs all the 3D role players he can get and that's what Boston has put around him, but I don't know if that makes you look worse under advanced stats. But I see him standing around a lot. His effort is very intermitent at best. Can't take away anything from his offensive output though.

According to RPM, he is far and away the worst defensive player in the game with a -4.42. Second worst is Allen Crabbe at -3.33. However, IT is the third best offensive player in the game with a rating of 6.10, behind only Harden(6.93) and Westbrook(6.44). This puts him at 1.68 overall, ranking 67th in the NBA.

Again, I don't know how accurate RPM is, but makes for interesting data. For the record, Brandon Knight is the 4th worst player in the NBA according to RPM. Only better than Jahlil Okafor, Semaj Christon, and Brandon Ingram

Its hard to look at the nerd stats for me, I know what I see when I watch him play. You stick out like a sore thumb when youre a bad defender. IT is one of many guys who stick out in that regard. Lillard, Steph, Kyrie, lots of the top PGs are underwhelming on the defensive end. If any of them tried half as hard as Ulis does, they'd be right there among the NBA elites for me. Its a good thing MVP voters dont seem to care about defense, just record and offensive contributions.

One thing RPM has going for it is that generally the guys who pass the eye test defensively rate well on RPM. Guys like Gobert, Draymond, CP3 are widely considered the best of the best defensively and RPM backs that up. But there are outliers. Kawhi is oft considered the best perimeter defender in the league, yet rpm this year puts him just above average. I haven't watched enough Kawhi to know if he's dialed it down defensively this year, but that number seems a little shaky. He rates as a worse defender than Marcus Morris, Jared Dudley, and Luke Babbitt.

The guy is still a monster. Did you see the block against the Rockets?

Read this on Kawhi's defensive stats this season: http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kawhi ... the-spurs/

Ring_Wanted wrote:The guy is still a monster. Did you see the block against the Rockets?

Read this on Kawhi's defensive stats this season: http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kawhi ... the-spurs/

Good read.