Phx-Suns.Net

Superbone wrote:I think I'm starting to waver back to Ayton over Doncic. Ayton is just more of the sure thing. He would probably mesh better with Booker too.

I would be fine with Ayton. I get the sense that the FO may be leaning in his direction. I'd prefer Doncic, but Ayton is a safe pick who is likely to be a good NBA player. I am kind of expecting that we'll get the #2 pick and that the decision will essentially be made for us by whomever picks #1.

I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

JCSunsfan wrote:I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

But when you look at the history of the #1 pick, all of the busts are big guys. Don't pick a player just because of his size.

O_Gardino wrote:

JCSunsfan wrote:I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

But when you look at the history of the #1 pick, all of the busts are big guys. Don't pick a player just because of his size.

Every Euro picked 1 or 2 has been a bust... Doesn't mean we shouldn't pick Doncic.

I don't see much bust potential in Ayton. He might never be a star, but he's too big and athletic to not be productive in some capacity.

Split T wrote:

O_Gardino wrote:

JCSunsfan wrote:I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

But when you look at the history of the #1 pick, all of the busts are big guys. Don't pick a player just because of his size.

Every Euro picked 1 or 2 has been a bust... Doesn't mean we shouldn't pick Doncic.

I don't see much bust potential in Ayton. He might never be a star, but he's too big and athletic to not be productive in some capacity.

Those foreign players who were busts high in the draft were all picked for their unique size and skill. They failed because they didn't have the personality to impose themselves on the game. That is the exact profile of Ayton. I agree that he will "be productive in some capacity", but I think Doncic is the guy with the heart to be a HOF player.

Let me just say that if we swing and miss on this pick, it is going to be very disappointing.

"But when you look at the history of the #1 pick, all of the busts are big guys"

Anthony Bennett???

But for the most part, you are correct.

JCSunsfan wrote:I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

Those players all showed a ton of defensive potential before they were drafted.

JCSunsfan wrote:I think we would be absolutely crazy to go for Doncic over Ayton. Is anyone watching Embiid, AD, and Gobert in the playoffs. The big man--long, active, skilled, defensive stopper big man--is back.

To be fair, they never went away, most of the their teams were just bad.

LazarusLong wrote:"But when you look at the history of the #1 pick, all of the busts are big guys"

Anthony Bennett???

But for the most part, you are correct.

Bennett is a PF who was absolutely drafted for his body over his bball ability. Not super tall, but I consider him a big because of his position.

Cmon. 7-0 with a 7-5 wingspan. Built like a rock. Moves like a guard. Has all the post moves. Scores and rebounds at will. Already has a midrange shot and has shown the ability to shoot out to the three. Defends to the three point line. AND HAS NO FREAKING INJURY HISTORY! And you want to pass on that for a slowfooted 6-7 Euro who shoots 32% from three and still has his baby fat? Sure, he can pass. But man. The GM that chooses Doncic over Ayton will be a joke for decades.

Or picking Ayton over Doncic could be Oden/Durant all over again...

INFORMER wrote:Or picking Ayton over Doncic could be Oden/Durant all over again...

Dont you put that juju on us

INFORMER wrote:Or picking Ayton over Doncic could be Oden/Durant all over again...

I am pretty sure you're just making a point and don't mean that you believe that this will happen. Oden already had a clear injury history when he was drafted and his legs weren't the same length or something like that. The writing was on the wall for his injuries to come. Ayton has no such marks on his record.

INFORMER wrote:Or picking Ayton over Doncic could be Oden/Durant all over again...

I take it then that you are in favor of picking Doncic #1?

JCSunsfan wrote:Cmon. 7-0 with a 7-5 wingspan. Built like a rock. Moves like a guard. Has all the post moves. Scores and rebounds at will. Already has a midrange shot and has shown the ability to shoot out to the three. Defends to the three point line. AND HAS NO FREAKING INJURY HISTORY! And you want to pass on that for a slowfooted 6-7 Euro who shoots 32% from three and still has his baby fat? Sure, he can pass. But man. The GM that chooses Doncic over Ayton will be a joke for decades.

I don't think you have to worry about Doncic going in front of Ayton; historically speaking, it rarely happens. But I do ask you to look at your own argument. You're basically calling for the tall black guy with big muscles over the shorter white guy. Your only argument with Doncic is his 3pt%, which isn't even low, and that you don't like that he's "euro". That's exactly how you pick Kwame Brown and Tyson Chandler over Pau Gasol.

I personally would pick the kid with the heart, ability, and the ball in his hands in a very tough league over the kid with the size who "scores at will" only when his teammates set him up in the one spot on the floor where he can be effective. I'm not very inspired by a huge wing span on a guy who doesn't block many shots. Basically, I don't think Doncic is slowfooted, and I don't think Ayton imposes his will on the game.

I wonder if whoever gets the #2 pick in the draft is going to secretly covet that spot. Unless you really like someone other than Ayton or Doncic, the decision basically gets made for you and there's no backlash or remorse.

For instance, if we got the #1 pick and called up the team with the #2 pick and offered to swap provided they also give us their worst second rounder, or even some heavily protected future second rounder, I don't think the other team would do it.

But if we come away with Ayton or Doncic in this draft, I'm going to be pretty excited about our future.

INFORMER wrote:Or picking Ayton over Doncic could be Oden/Durant all over again...

Or somewhat less dramatically,

Blake Griffin over Harder, Curry, DeRozan.
Andrew Bogut over Chris Paul and Deron Williams.
Dwight Howard over Andre Iguodala.

I could be wrong, but this just seems like the draft where the big guy is good-but-not-great and there are a couple of HOF players picked later. I don't hate Ayton, I just don't think he's a star.

I think Howard had a better career than Iggy. Iggy has transitioned better to a role player, but Howard was a legitimate MVP candidate for a few years. Not sure Blake over Curry/harden/Derozan is all that bad either. Curry and harden are better, Derozan is now, but the clippers don't have any regrets drafting Blake.

Miles Turner or Manu Ginobili?