Phx-Suns.Net

I haven't been a fan of the way IT has been playing, almost since the start of the season.

da_suns_fan wrote:

Xylus wrote:

azsportsfan wrote:

Xylus wrote:Suns bricking a lot of wide open shots. Gerald Green has zero interest in passing the ball this game, regardless of how many defenders he has.

You praised Warren for making his shot (rightfully so) on a nice assist from Green, then say that Green has no interest in passing the ball. He had what, 4 assists? Should of had more but he got Plumleed.

So? At the moment in the game when that comment was made, Green was blatantly ignoring teammates on most plays. Are you really going to use an end game box score to criticize a comment made in the 2nd quarter?

And is anyone REALLY defending Gerald Green's selfishness? I dont think Ive ever seen anyone on the Suns in my 25+ years watching who went to greater lengths to avoid passing the ball.

Can anyone else really think of anyone?

Gerald Green is putting up 27 shots per 40 minutes. That is an insane amount:

http://www.boxscoregeeks.com/players/633-gerald-green

The only guy with more assists than Green last night was... Brandon Jennings.

I like Gerald Green, I think he has a net positive effect on the team. There are stretches in every game, though, where you want him to take the blinders off and pass the goddamn ball.

The offense has seemed very clunky. There's a lot of over dribbling and isolation by players which I don't like to see. Last year's team had better ball movement and finding the open man.

iLLmatic wrote:The offense has seemed very clunky. There's a lot of over dribbling and isolation by players which I don't like to see. Last year's team had better ball movement and finding the open man.

Agreed. And it isn't about losing Frye.

da_suns_fan wrote:

Xylus wrote:

azsportsfan wrote:

Xylus wrote:Suns bricking a lot of wide open shots. Gerald Green has zero interest in passing the ball this game, regardless of how many defenders he has.

You praised Warren for making his shot (rightfully so) on a nice assist from Green, then say that Green has no interest in passing the ball. He had what, 4 assists? Should of had more but he got Plumleed.

So? At the moment in the game when that comment was made, Green was blatantly ignoring teammates on most plays. Are you really going to use an end game box score to criticize a comment made in the 2nd quarter?

And is anyone REALLY defending Gerald Green's selfishness? I dont think Ive ever seen anyone on the Suns in my 25+ years watching who went to greater lengths to avoid passing the ball.

Can anyone else really think of anyone?

Gerald Green is putting up 27 shots per 40 minutes. That is an insane amount:

http://www.boxscoregeeks.com/players/633-gerald-green

He has a higher usage than the PGs. It's crazy. The living definition of unconscious.

Xylus wrote:I like Gerald Green, I think he has a net positive effect on the team. There are stretches in every game, though, where you want him to take the blinders off and pass the goddamn ball.

This is a fair take. I like Gerald Green, I like the attitude he brings to the team, but he has ane extremely low Bball IQ. He sometimes can turn into chucker status when his shot isn't going. There have been plenty of guys in the past who have had low bball IQ's but still been fan favs or have a positive effects on the team. 1 of my favorite suns during the SSOL era was Barbosa and I was well aware he had a low Bball IQ and held my breath everytime he had the ball in crunch time. But he was a valuable part of the team and you had to take the good with the bad.

The game against the Warriors or Nets...Green was going off he had a great game and we got a steal up 8 with under 2 mins left and he chucked up a 3 going 1 on 3 with 20 seconds left on the shot clock...it was a terrible basketball play, but one you have to live with with a Gerald Green.

All this being said, and this seems like it will go against what the majority thinks, I would not re-sign Gerald Green. I think he can get more in another situation then what I would offer him. If its something cheap then I'm all for it, but I'm being realistic especially because I think T.J. Warren will be getting alot of mins at the 3 sooner rather then later.

I will say this though....he looks for Len. It seems like the 1 guy who does look for.

Shabazz wrote:I haven't been a fan of the way IT has been playing, almost since the start of the season.

It becomes that much worse when he's not hitting his shots like in the last couple games. What happened to that automatic mid-range jumper?

You can have a bench SG who chucks and not have it mess up your team. I agree that Gerald Green has tunnel vision and shoots too much, but I don't think he is to blame for our overall offensive problems.

Speaking of Len, I was really happy with the way the whole team was rallying around him. They all seem to be pulling for the guy.

Superbone wrote:

Shabazz wrote:I haven't been a fan of the way IT has been playing, almost since the start of the season.

It becomes that much worse when he's not hitting his shots like in the last couple games. What happened to that automatic mid-range jumper?

Aside from showing no inclination (or ability, maybe) to make a post entry pass, it bothers me when he drives into the lane passes out to a teammate on the perimeter and then runs to that teammate to get the ball back so he can create again.

Shabazz wrote:

Superbone wrote:

Shabazz wrote:I haven't been a fan of the way IT has been playing, almost since the start of the season.

It becomes that much worse when he's not hitting his shots like in the last couple games. What happened to that automatic mid-range jumper?

Aside from showing no inclination (or ability, maybe) to make a post entry pass, it bothers me when he drives into the lane passes out to a teammate on the perimeter and then runs to that teammate to get the ball back so he can create again.

Me too.

Indy wrote:

iLLmatic wrote:The offense has seemed very clunky. There's a lot of over dribbling and isolation by players which I don't like to see. Last year's team had better ball movement and finding the open man.

Agreed. And it isn't about losing Frye.

Last year Gerald was the only real chucker. Throw in Isaiah and it's too many. Now you're the NY Knicks.

specialsauce wrote:

Indy wrote:

iLLmatic wrote:The offense has seemed very clunky. There's a lot of over dribbling and isolation by players which I don't like to see. Last year's team had better ball movement and finding the open man.

Agreed. And it isn't about losing Frye.

Last year Gerald was the only real chucker. Throw in Isaiah and it's too many. Now you're the NY Knicks.

Sure, if they were starting or getting the majority of minutes. But honestly, our problems are more about how our starting 5 get us into holes that we then ask IT and GG to shoot us out of.

And remember that IT is 2nd on the team in assists, and it isn't even close.

That is 100% misleading. Stephon Marbury once averaged 9 assists per game. When you have the ball 80% of the time, your assists will artificially be inflated. If you think Isaiah has been a good facilitator based off his assist totals, I question if you have been watching the games.

And it doesn't matter that he's not starting. He's playing 20+ minutes per game. We're paying him 7 million annually. "At least he's not playing a ton of minutes" is clearly not a player worth that amount

specialsauce wrote:That is 100% misleading. Stephon Marbury once averaged 9 assists per game. When you have the ball 80% of the time, your assists will artificially be inflated. If you think Isaiah has been a good facilitator based off his assist totals, I question if you have been watching the games.

And it doesn't matter that he's not starting. He's playing 20+ minutes per game. We're paying him 7 million annually. "At least he's not playing a ton of minutes" is clearly not a player worth that amount

He leads the team in assists per minute too. He's actually tied with Bledsoe.

nba.com has some interesting statistics with their player tracking. Isaiah does in fact lead the team in time possessing the ball per game at 4.4 minutes. Bledsoe at 4.3 minutes, Dragic at 4.0 minutes. None of which are anywhere close to the leaders (reggie jackson 8.9, john wall 8.3)However Isaiah also leads the team in passes per minute.

It's early in the season. The first 20 or so games are really exhibition games used to develop chemistry and rotations. It's a long season. People have to point the finger early on at someone. Just so happens to be IT3.

I'm not looking to point fingers at anyone. I've watched every minute of every game so far. I don't like the way IT has been running the offense. It's just an observation.

I'm also not blaming him for our struggles.