All Things Ayton

[Superbone]

I'll go for 18 and 8

In his mind, that's 'Dominayting'.

Called it!

But did you have 4 assists for Ayton and 0 for Nurkic?

That was unusual and unexpected for sure.

[Superbone]

This is cool…great guy…just didn’t work out here on the court

Yeah, glad he had that moment with his young fans.

[Superbone]

Scoring wise, like most games I've watched of him this season, he was constantly getting open (or in deep sealing position) and calling for the ball, but they ignored him after the first quarter. He could have easily had 30+ points.

You mentioned the same issue in Phoenix. Why do you think that happens?

[JeremyG]

Scoring wise, like most games I've watched of him this season, he was constantly getting open (or in deep sealing position) and calling for the ball, but they ignored him after the first quarter. He could have easily had 30+ points.

You mentioned the same issue in Phoenix. Why do you think that happens?

I don't know, you guys always try to turn it into being his fault, so you tell me. If I were him, I would stop making the effort to get open like that, I honestly don't know how he doesn't get frustrated by it. I was noticing last night even on screen and rolls, his teammates just drive it to the hoop and take a bad and/or contested shot without even thinking about dumping it back to him for a wide open shot when he's trailing in the paint.

[Superbone]

[Mori Chu]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

[Superbone]

[SunsSince92]

I'll go for 18 and 8

In his mind, that's 'Dominayting'.

Called it!

But did you have 4 assists for Ayton and 0 for Nurkic?

Haha, I didn't, but props to him for the dimes.

[TOO]

What's more surprising, DAs 4 assists or Nurks 4 blocks?

[JeremyG]

But it was all just talk to try to increase his trade value, according to some.

He's still saying it. He really did want to coach him. What's crazy is that he probably would have been the best coach possible for him.

[TOO]

Jeremy: What are your thoughts about Ayton's performance in yesterday's game?

I thought he was very active on both ends, could have done better on the defensive boards but he was also defending a lot of shots (pretty sure he got the best of Booker the majority of the times he defended Book). Scoring wise, like most games I've watched of him this season, he was constantly getting open (or in deep sealing position) and calling for the ball, but they ignored him after the first quarter. He could have easily had 30+ points.

Another distinction people are also not making is that almost all of Nurkic's points came when Ayton was not defending him, while Ayton kept scoring on Nurkic.

The majority of Aytons buckets were jumpers... By this logic Grayson Allen dunked all over Ayton because he was in the same vicinity.

You also have to why wonder it seemed they played better with Ayton off the floor.

[JeremyG]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

[JeremyG]

What's more surprising, DAs 4 assists or Nurks 4 blocks?

Definitely Nurk's 4 blocks. He hasn't had that many blocks since three seasons ago. Ayton had 4+ assists 9 times last season.

[specialsauce]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

Exactly what is he developing? Show me one thing he has even tried to do differently? Shoot a mid ranger with a sexier slimmer waist?

[ShelC]

“That’s how he actually gets his opportunities: The guards create things for him,” Billiups explained. “So losing that in the first game really hurt him. Losing Scoot [Henderson] really hurt him, losing Malcolm [Brogdon] really hurt him. He’s not a guy that you just bring it down and throw it to 20-some times a game and let him just do what he do. That’s just not his game, at least not now.”

[Flagrant Fowl]

Chauncey Billups is a certified Hayter.

I don't feel like checking, but I'm 99% sure 3 of Ayton's 4 assists were kick outs do Jerami Grant after offensive rebounds. Good for Ayton to get the rebound and make the pass, but context is important, he wasn't out there dicing up the defense as a playmaker.

[Kryptonic]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

Exactly what is he developing? Show me one thing he has even tried to do differently? Shoot a mid ranger with a sexier slimmer waist?

This is not like he’s in year 2-3…. This is year 5 and if he’s not gotten it by now, he never will.

I love when KD and book blame people for not developing them…. Great players don’t need others to develop them, they seek out the teaches and develop themselves. He has more ambition to develop his game in 2k tournaments.

[specialsauce]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

Exactly what is he developing? Show me one thing he has even tried to do differently? Shoot a mid ranger with a sexier slimmer waist?

This is not like he’s in year 2-3…. This is year 5 and if he’s not gotten it by now, he never will.

I love when KD and book blame people for not developing them…. Great players don’t need others to develop them, they seek out the teaches and develop themselves. He has more ambition to develop his game in 2k tournaments.

A developmental player should be making developmental player money. Mr. Max has supposedly developed based on his contract.

[Kryptonic]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

Exactly what is he developing? Show me one thing he has even tried to do differently? Shoot a mid ranger with a sexier slimmer waist?

This is not like he’s in year 2-3…. This is year 5 and if he’s not gotten it by now, he never will.

I love when KD and book blame people for not developing them…. Great players don’t need others to develop them, they seek out the teaches and develop themselves. He has more ambition to develop his game in 2k tournaments.

A developmental player should be making developmental player money. Mr. Max has supposedly developed based on his contract.

*mic drop*

[JeremyG]

I wouldn't say I have examined it meticulously, but when I've watched DA I see a mix of things.

- He sets extremely weak / shitty screens. He almost always fails to impede the man he's screening, then immediately "slips" the screen and goes toward the basket, but he hasn't shaken free of his man, so he isn't really open in any interesting position. Then he turns and puts his arm up like, "I'm open, pass it to me!" but he isn't. So they don't pass it to him.

- Or, they do pass it to him, but his man is still right there, and he gets the ball knocked away. Or he catches it, and he bobbles it and loses it.

- Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot.

- So it kind of seems like his teammates learn/decide not to feed him in the post because it isn't actually a good outcome to do so. So they stop really even looking for him, and therefore on the occasions where DA -does- happen to get open or get great position, they miss him. But the deterioration has come over many previous possessions where he's lost his teammates' trust in those post situations.

Does that make sense? I think he basically teaches his teammates that they should not feed him the ball in the post because he will blow it. Then they start to just look him off.

Even if that's the case, it's inexcusable and the coach should not allow it. Especially if you're trying to help a big man develop offensively.

He had 2 turnovers last night. That's no reason to stop going to him when he's cooking.

Also: "Or he does gather the ball but makes some kind of weak fadeaway move or otherwise doesn't actually have post footwork to get himself a good shot."

He's shooting 57.4% on his attempts this season, and 59.6% for his career. How can "he takes bad shots" possibly be a valid excuse? And yet some of these inefficient chuckers in the league get as many attempts as they want without their teammates calling them out?

Exactly what is he developing? Show me one thing he has even tried to do differently? Shoot a mid ranger with a sexier slimmer waist?

Here are a few moves just from last night:

Nice little drop step move: https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=& ... 0(2%20PTS)

Dribble drive to the hoop: https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=& ... (10%20PTS)

Drove past Nurkic, before Gordon came in and stole it: https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=& ... ng%20Layup