Phx-Suns.Net

You're not consistent yet, buddy!

I feel like the two guys we are most frustrated about fitting into our offense are Chris Paul and DeAndre Ayton....Now I don’t expect us to trade either, nor am I calling for a trade, but I was wondering who in the nba would be the best fits in those positions for our offense.

Starting with Ayton, I think we’d either need a real pick and roll big. Someone like Rudy Gobert or Clint Capela. The other option would be a ball handling 5. We’ve seen how the offense operates when Saric keeps things moving from the 5 spot, or what Kaminsky did last night. I think the best possible 5 for our offense would be Bam Adebayo. He can be a pick n roll big, but he’s also a very good creator from the 5 spot. Plus he’d also provide great defense. Any others?

As for the pg spot, we run into trouble because Paul play slow, likes to run lots of pick n roll, and isolate against switches, which takes us out of our offense. A true rim runner would help, but if we had a pg that liked to play fast, move the ball quick, get into the paint, but also could play off ball and hit open shots, that would be ideal.

Our draft still bugs me, because this is almost exactly what Tyrese Haliburton is supposed to be. It’s what Lonzo could theoretically become. Steph Curry would be the ultimate prize, but that’s too easy. Malcolm Brogdon would be great and would make our defense even more switchable as he’s a huge guard. Thoughts?

Ayton and Paul for Siakam and VanFleet?

We know Paul likes PnR and lob threats so yea....Gobert, Capela would be a good fit for him. I've mentioned Mitch Robinson in the past as an above the rim lob threat and shotblocker/rebounder. Problem is all those guys are relegated to dunks and layups so you lose the spacing. Might not matter with our perimeter shooters tho. But I also feel like we underutilize Ayton when we use him as just a screener. I like him taking advantage of mismatches in the post, like he was doing a bit with Wiseman last night and he's more comfortable sitting in the post and knocking down his fadeaway.

If we're sticking with the motion 0.5 offense, then we really don't need a traditional PG but more of a bigger combo guard like a Ball or Hali. Others mentioned George Hill in the offseason who's older but I'm still holding out hope for Payne. He's been injured recently but we've played well when he's out there with Book. He can run the offense, hit the 3, get into the lane, set others up or play off of PointBook and has good enough size and pesky defense. Is he the longterm answer? Who knows, but we have him and the #s don't lie when he's out there.

It does feel like we have 2 different styles with the different lineups and we need to either perfect both or find a way to merge the two. Last night was a step in the right direction I think, but now we'll have to re-integrate Book and Dario (who I'm less worried about).

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

O_Gardino wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:12 am

Ayton and Paul for Siakam and VanFleet?

I think our team would be better this year, no question. But I can't see Tampa doing that, and there is no way Jones would have the balls to do that after bringing Paul here. I mean, I don't think you can trade Paul unless he asks to be traded, unless you are ready to deal with the fall out it would cause in the current Suns players, but also throughout the league.

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

He was ok last night, he wasn’t sleepwalking through the game, but was like halfway between that 4 game stretch of DOMINAYTON and whatever the crap showed up to the Thunder game.

Would a Brogdon-Booker-Bridges-Crowder-Adebayo with Payne-Cam-Saric off the bench be a legitimate contender? A little small, but I think we’d have a legitimate title shot.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

strong disagree on him being pretty good. He was certainly below what his averages should be, except in rebounding. He wasn't bad, but he only took 7 shots, and despite getting the ball numerous times in the paint, he would dribble away from the hoop or pass it out, even when he was pretty open or had a small guy on him. And they have a rookie center he should cook, and nobody else close to his size.

12/13 with 5 TOs

I know everyone needs to do more to help out with Book missing games, but DA took care of all of Book's TOs.

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:28 pm

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

strong disagree on him being pretty good. He was certainly below what his averages should be, except in rebounding. He wasn't bad, but he only took 7 shots, and despite getting the ball numerous times in the paint, he would dribble away from the hoop or pass it out, even when he was pretty open or had a small guy on him. And they have a rookie center he should cook, and nobody else close to his size.

12/13 with 5 TOs

I know everyone needs to do more to help out with Book missing games, but DA took care of all of Book's TOs.

Yeah let’s not get lost in the sauce of a W. We won because of Frank and Mikal.

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:28 pm

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

strong disagree on him being pretty good. He was certainly below what his averages should be, except in rebounding. He wasn't bad, but he only took 7 shots, and despite getting the ball numerous times in the paint, he would dribble away from the hoop or pass it out, even when he was pretty open or had a small guy on him. And they have a rookie center he should cook, and nobody else close to his size.

12/13 with 5 TOs

I know everyone needs to do more to help out with Book missing games, but DA took care of all of Book's TOs.

Ayton only played 23 minutes last night, and I think missed the entire 4 quarter as well, so I think getting 12/13 and 4 assists is pretty good. It wasn’t Dominayton but it was a nice game. The 5 TOs suck but I also feel like most of his TOs were the results of pretty bad passes to him which I feel has been problem this season, with many of them forced and badly telegraphed. Of course it doesn’t help that Ayton has below average catching abilities for a big man.

I feel like his hands are great when it comes to rebounding, even when fighting in traffic with other bigs, but they're terrible catching the ball in the paint on offense or on the move. Plus his other main issue, which isn't uncommon for bigs, is bringing the ball down too low or taking that unnecessary dribble before going up (or going back up) that leads to strips and TOs.

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:37 pm

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:28 pm

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

strong disagree on him being pretty good. He was certainly below what his averages should be, except in rebounding. He wasn't bad, but he only took 7 shots, and despite getting the ball numerous times in the paint, he would dribble away from the hoop or pass it out, even when he was pretty open or had a small guy on him. And they have a rookie center he should cook, and nobody else close to his size.

12/13 with 5 TOs

I know everyone needs to do more to help out with Book missing games, but DA took care of all of Book's TOs.

Ayton only played 23 minutes last night, and I think missed the entire 4 quarter as well, so I think getting 12/13 and 4 assists is pretty good. It wasn’t Dominayton but it was a nice game. The 5 TOs suck but I also feel like most of his TOs were the results of pretty bad passes to him which I feel has been problem this season, with many of them forced and badly telegraphed. Of course it doesn’t help that Ayton has below average catching abilities for a big man.

I am not too worried about the points (and the rebounds were great), but the lack of aggression. In that 4 game stretch, do you remember any time where he got an offensive rebound in the paint and decided to dribble it out or pass it out? Without really focusing on it, I counted 3 times last night. It was probably more because I was multi-tasking for part of the game. I don't think that happened 3 times total in those 4 games.

ShelC wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:54 pm

I feel like his hands are great when it comes to rebounding, even when fighting in traffic with other bigs, but they're terrible catching the ball in the paint on offense or on the move. Plus his other main issue, which isn't uncommon for bigs, is bringing the ball down too low or taking that unnecessary dribble before going up (or going back up) that leads to strips and TOs.

Yeah, I don't get it. He has a really soft touch around the rim and shows great hands. But when it comes to catching a pass, he is like Alex Len.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

He got most of his stats in the first half. I think he had 11 boards then but ended up with only 13.

specialsauce wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:44 pm

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:28 pm

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:23 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:09 am

Guys, remember when Ayton was really good for 4 games?

He was pretty good last night, too. I'd say he has been good in about 85% of games for a few weeks now. Still encouraged.

strong disagree on him being pretty good. He was certainly below what his averages should be, except in rebounding. He wasn't bad, but he only took 7 shots, and despite getting the ball numerous times in the paint, he would dribble away from the hoop or pass it out, even when he was pretty open or had a small guy on him. And they have a rookie center he should cook, and nobody else close to his size.

12/13 with 5 TOs

I know everyone needs to do more to help out with Book missing games, but DA took care of all of Book's TOs.

Yeah let’s not get lost in the sauce of a W. We won because of Frank and Mikal.

And Nader. And Crowder.

The Suns seem to really want to get Ayton involved early and have achieved a lot more success lately but, even in that stretch of games they always seem to ignore Ayton in the post after halftime and especially in the fourth quarter. We were giving props to Nader because he is one of the only guys to consistently attack the paint. I would like to see Ayton get a few more touches in crunch time even though it will result in a few more turnovers. Figure it out now, not in the playoffs.

I’d reward Ayton if he gets down the court fast and establishes great position, but I don’t know that I have much desire to force feed him in the post.