Phx-Suns.Net

By fine I mean fine for a #1 pick. I see him improving every game. Doncic was known to be a well established pro before he was drafted. Ayton doesn’t have near his experience and is years behind him in that way. He has a lot of potential Doncic is already there. Potential = Takes some time. Ayton missed the start of the season because he was a dumbazz. That doesn’t make him any more or less talented. His stats tell me he is improving. He is starting to attack in the paint more and get fouled. He is becoming a much better defender. His stats already make him a really good player.

I want more from Ayton. I think we will get more from Ayton. I am happy to watch him grow before our eyes.

Nodack wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:41 pm

By fine I mean fine for a #1 pick. I see him improving every game. Doncic was known to be a well established pro before he was drafted. Ayton doesn’t have near his experience and is years behind him in that way. He has a lot of potential Doncic is already there. Potential = Takes some time. Ayton missed the start of the season because he was a dumbazz. That doesn’t make him any more or less talented. His stats tell me he is improving. He is starting to attack in the paint more and get fouled. He is becoming a much better defended. His stats already make him a really good player.

I want more from Ayton. I think we will get more from Ayton. I am happy to watch him grow before our eyes.

Let's look at #1 picks over the past twenty years and see how Ayton compares to them in their second seasons:

Clearly better

2016: Ben Simmons (and I'm not even sure on this one)
2003: LeBron James


About the same, not clearly better or worse

2018: Deandre Ayton * (to date)
2015: Karl-Anthony Towns (KAT was a better offensive player, Ayton is miles better defensively)
2012: Anthony Davis (Ayton is a slightly better rebounder)
2011: Kyrie Irving
2010: John Wall
2009: Blake Griffin
2008: Derrick Rose
2004: Dwight Howard
2002: Yao Ming
1999: Elton Brand


Clearly Worse

2017: Markelle Fultz
2014: Andrew Wiggins
2013: Anthony Bennett
2007: Greg Oden
2006: Andrea Bargnani
2005: Andrew Bogut
2001: Kwame Brown
2000: Kenyon Martin
1998: Michael Olowokandi

It is Doncic that is exceptional -- Ayton is probably above average for a #1 pick. We just want him to be in the LeBron tier.

Based on how he plays 50% of the time -- and assuming that he could play that way 90% of the time -- he's already close to the Patrick Ewing tier. If he can also add a bit of muscle and not be pushed around as much -- he's in the Robinson/Olajuwon tier.

Have patience, folks. He's already made the leap defensively and is occasionally making the leap offensively. With more consistency and growing into his body, he's a superstar.

Thank you.

virtual9mm wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:54 pm

Based on how he plays 50% of the time -- and assuming that he could play that way 90% of the time -- he's already close to the Patrick Ewing tier. If he can also add a bit of muscle and not be pushed around as much -- he's in the Robinson/Olajuwon tier.

Have patience, folks. He's already made the leap defensively and is occasionally making the leap offensively. With more consistency and growing into his body, he's a superstar.

Well, he's made A leap defensively, but I don't think he made THE leap defensively.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:01 pm

virtual9mm wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:54 pm

Based on how he plays 50% of the time -- and assuming that he could play that way 90% of the time -- he's already close to the Patrick Ewing tier. If he can also add a bit of muscle and not be pushed around as much -- he's in the Robinson/Olajuwon tier.

Have patience, folks. He's already made the leap defensively and is occasionally making the leap offensively. With more consistency and growing into his body, he's a superstar.

Well, he's made A leap defensively, but I don't think he made THE leap defensively.

Yes, there is another leap he could take. Which is scary, since he is one of the top one on one defenders already. Paint defense of an Olajuwon or Robinson with perimeter defense of Garnett.

Let's look at #1 picks over the past twenty years and see how Ayton compares to them in their second seasons:

I mostly agree with your list, but I would put KAT and Anthony Davis in the "clearly better" category. It's pretty striking to see how many bad-to-mediocre #1 overall picks there have been. Fultz, Wiggins, Bennett, Bargnani, Brown, Olowakandi? Oof. It's a real coin flip, more than it should be. I really hate the one-and-done college system we have right now. I hope they find a way to keep guys in school for 2-3 years so we know more about them before they come to the NBA.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:55 am

I hope they find a way to keep guys in school for 2-3 years so we know more about them before they come to the NBA.

Pay them. It’s that simple.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:55 am

Let's look at #1 picks over the past twenty years and see how Ayton compares to them in their second seasons:

I mostly agree with your list, but I would put KAT and Anthony Davis in the "clearly better" category. It's pretty striking to see how many bad-to-mediocre #1 overall picks there have been. Fultz, Wiggins, Bennett, Bargnani, Brown, Olowakandi? Oof. It's a real coin flip, more than it should be. I really hate the one-and-done college system we have right now. I hope they find a way to keep guys in school for 2-3 years so we know more about them before they come to the NBA.

They’re gonna go the other way and let high schoolers back in

Cap wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:11 am

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:55 am

I hope they find a way to keep guys in school for 2-3 years so we know more about them before they come to the NBA.

Pay them. It’s that simple.

exactly. and if they don't, I hope the top kids never go. They shouldn't be making billions off of the kids. Do the 50% BRI for the kids.

It would be interesting if the NBA was run under the European model. LeBron might’ve had a signature shoe when he was 14.