JustWinBaby wrote:Aztec Sunsfan wrote:“If you don’t stand by your principles when the stakes are at it’s highest, then you don’t have principles, just opinions”
... so yeah, I’m not disappointed if lacking on the team guys as egomaniac as Lebron, wife beaters as Kidd or rapist on the loose (ok, ok, alleged ones) like Kobe prevented us from going all the way to the Top. Championship rings shouldn’t be a blank check to relieve someone from acting like a decent human being.
Of course people have character flaws all over them, but there are limits that must be respected. And of course, within the law, everyone is free to set their own.
Just curious
Is this supposed to be directed at he acquistion of players like Chris Paul, James Harden and Kobe Bryant. I know Kobe had that thing in Denver. However I think he has been clean otherwise. I think both Chris Paul and James Harden have been good citizens off the court, I could be wrong. When did J Kidd beat his wife? I know he reportedly threw a french fry at her. He probably missed. How in the world is Lebron an egomaniac. If we would have ever acquired him they would be building statues of him in this town.
All this righteousness while most of you loved Charels Barkley. I think he had a favorite street where he got good BJ's on a regular basis. You don't think he was well taken care on during his visits to Vegas? He probably has more dirty laundry than all of these guys combined. What about Kevin Johnson? What about Tom Chambers?
Oh that's right you never rooted for these players.
I will take borrowed Bobster words, because they are spot on:
Unfortunately, as a fan of Walter Davis and Kevin Johnson you learn that you can be disillusioned by players if you put to much faith in them. Basically, they're strangers. We don't know them and shouldn't expect perfection from them, but we should expect a amount of personal accountability.
I was younger when rooting for those guys, and barely could understand what a “favorite street” was, neither do I read about it until many years after they took their last shot on the court (and this goes without mention that CONSENSUAL is a key word on this kind of equations, so Barkley is far above KJ on this subject). Also, I have come to learn a lot about the silent victims on those life styles, as well as the league, the players and people in general, so I think we subject the current generation to higher standards nowadays. And hear yourself dude, you are basically saying that since players in the past got away with such behavior, it must be condoned to present day people, as long as they are “statue worthy“. Go ahead kneel to them, I’m no one to judge you, but I take a strong hard PASS. Would you give a daughter in sacrifice to a monster in order to see a banner hanging in your town? Why should others suffer it in her place?
I’m not ashamed of recognizing that I’m not as fully invested on this team, or nothing in particular in my life, to allow me to condone “that thing in Denver” kind of stuff, neither try to minimize domestic violence as a “missed fry” in order to get a parade. So I’m allowed a rape once in a lifetime if I remain “clean” otherwise? What about two? How many rings account for one murder? Can I give my wife -easily 30 pounds and 5 inches smaller than me- a good “shake”, a black eye, a visit to the hospital?
People do mistakes, but ACCOUNTABILITY is key, giving free passes on success, even one, is a recipe for disaster. Take it from someone living in a country when corruption is rampant precisely for this kind of moral standards. Tragically, there isn’t a word in spanish for a direct translation from accountability, to put it simple.
Now to talk about players that currently conduct themselves within the limits of the law (on appearance at least), I just said that anybody is free to set his own limits, and I’m not talking about only taking nice guys, but I wouldn’t be capable to root for players like Horry and Bowen on my own team, actively going for injuring another people.
Jerks? Well, I think this a category where everyone have his own taste.
Egocentric players: It’s a tricky one, most athletes cannot get this far without a big dosis of Ego pushing them, but you know, I root for teams, not individuals, that’s how I picked sides in my first NBA Finals (remember that I don’t have any personal ties to the city). Back then, people were aaaaaall about Jordan, worshiped the guy, to the point of discomfort for my taste, so I liked better the underdog TEAM trying to stop him on a concerted effort, It wasn’t Barkley vs Jordan, it was the Suns against his Airness, so it was an easy pick for me. But I respect Jordan and his legacy, and back then there was still a “Mega Star within the team” vibe when it comes to players.
Today, it is more about “individual brands”, and that’s fine, they have to monetize their window of excellence, but when you have players like Lebron, almost humiliating a front office, a lockeroom, an entire fan base, to subject them to his “wishes”, well, that’s not something I would like to happen to my team, not even for a Banner. You are so fixed on winning that you don’t care, I do. I don’t like a guy appointing himself as “The King” with the “God-wills-it” flair he does, Jordan at least was some sort of Constitutional King, not an Absolutist like Lebron.
I must confess that Amare was my least favorite player on the SSOL years, and would have welcomed multiple trades for him, specially the KG one that was targeted on Marion. So alike he and Lebron, but at least James have delivered, I must concede.
And I could go on and on detailing you my PERSONAL taste on players, but it’s clear that we approach competition from very different angles, I'm not a “winning at all costs” kind of guy, you obviously are, so let’s agree to disagree within players that just are jerks on or off the court, but regarding players with more than shady actions on his background, well, I’m sorry, I can not see you to the eyes and respect your posture, not that you care.
Being “serious about winning” and the word Winner itself, includes for me a really big component of HOW you won and WHO you are.
Are you fucking kidding me?