Phx-Suns.Net

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

Again, I get it. I just think Ishbia would’ve spent his way into the second apron anyway if it weren’t for the Beal trade, so I hate that we got the team to where we are today, but I don’t hate the Beal trade itself nearly as much. Instead I hate the KD trade for getting the ball rolling.

Oh right
I am still quite confused by the Bucks tweet

What the hell was that about

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:10 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

That’s not what I remember from the chatter at the time, but maybe you are right and the mouthpieces around the suns were just using it as an excuse. We loved Camara at the time because we had no way of bringing in new talent but he was just ok during summer league, nothing special, and if Portland really wanted him that badly he wouldn’t have sled to something like 56th pick. A lot of hoopla was made at the time that his was the only salary that made the trade work.

Fair…I think for me, with hindsight, it’s just that the KD trade had a chance to work(maybe a small chance) but the Beal trade did not. Also, if we don’t trade for KD, we almost certainly trade for Dame…so we probably end up in a similar spot…though the price is probably less

What I hate about the KD trade wasn’t specifically that we got KD. It was that we got absolutely cleaned out in terms of assets. I’d have been ok with all the picks and swaps if we had kept Mikal and Cam. Or given up Mikal and Cam and only sent out two picks with protection.

In the same light I hated the Orlando trade for Bane. Not that it wasn’t a good fit per se, but that Olando gave up so much for a guy who could help them be top 4 as a ceiling, and they don’t have the bullets in the chamber to improve unless they moved their real core.

I don’t remember us being linked to Dame but if we were my guess is the results would be so much different, because Dame is actually an incredible leader, and maybe we’d have already sent out CP3 to get Dame.

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:12 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:10 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

That’s not what I remember from the chatter at the time, but maybe you are right and the mouthpieces around the suns were just using it as an excuse. We loved Camara at the time because we had no way of bringing in new talent but he was just ok during summer league, nothing special, and if Portland really wanted him that badly he wouldn’t have sled to something like 56th pick. A lot of hoopla was made at the time that his was the only salary that made the trade work.

Must have just been people trying to make sense of it. It would have been easy to avoid Toumani for salary purposes.

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 8:20 am

I honestly don’t get why anyone would think that the Beal trade sank us. Yes he had a no trade clause and that was a major bitch but he only cost us CP3 who was over the hill and a bunch of 2nd round picks. KD trade was the one that actually cleaned our entire cupboard.

I didn’t like the KD trade at the time and still don’t like it today. KD put up numbers but he did not deliver anywhere near the type of value one would expect from their number one star. Did we have roster issues? Yes we did. But as a number one star KD is deeply flawed and he’s pretty unaware in terms of his impact on a team of players that look up to him. Luckily for Houston they have some tough minded people on their team, starting with Ime.

How brave!

bajanguy008 wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 8:48 am

Finally got some time to watch the whole game
Well expect the power outage during our 4th quarter run tsk

That sucked. The Suns power surge was so great during that period of time that it knocked out all evidence of it. I remember K Ray saying something like the Suns are on a 17-0 spurt when we finally got audio/video back.

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:10 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

I'm not going to blame Ayton for that "throw in". Suns brass should have held tight on Camara. Shuttered that idea. Put the cap on it.

bajanguy008 wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:12 am

Oh right
I am still quite confused by the Bucks tweet

What the hell was that about

They're just reminding us that they beat us in the Finals that year. Bastards! Just take the win and the high road, but no. But it was dumb in that they only won one game on that court so the joke's on them.

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:12 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:10 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

That’s not what I remember from the chatter at the time, but maybe you are right and the mouthpieces around the suns were just using it as an excuse. We loved Camara at the time because we had no way of bringing in new talent but he was just ok during summer league, nothing special, and if Portland really wanted him that badly he wouldn’t have sled to something like 56th pick. A lot of hoopla was made at the time that his was the only salary that made the trade work.

That's not what I remember. He showed surprising potential for a 2nd round pick is what I remember. I was excited about his future with us.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 10:09 am

bajanguy008 wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 8:48 am

Finally got some time to watch the whole game
Well expect the power outage during our 4th quarter run tsk

That sucked. The Suns power surge was so great during that period of time that it knocked out all evidence of it. I remember K Ray saying something like the Suns are on a 17-0 spurt when we finally got audio/video back.

Apparently some of the greatest highlights and levels of noise and energy unheard of in our arena were happening. And we missed all of it. I was honestly gutted when I heard stories from fans that attended about the insanity that took place. Fuck!

Superbone wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 10:17 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:12 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:10 am

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 9:03 am

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

Wasn’t salary…he was less than a minimum. Could’ve easily just not sent us Keon Johnson…Portland wanted him and that’s another reason to ding our former center…he wasn’t good enough to keep a late 2nd round rookie out of a trade.

That’s not what I remember from the chatter at the time, but maybe you are right and the mouthpieces around the suns were just using it as an excuse. We loved Camara at the time because we had no way of bringing in new talent but he was just ok during summer league, nothing special, and if Portland really wanted him that badly he wouldn’t have sled to something like 56th pick. A lot of hoopla was made at the time that his was the only salary that made the trade work.

That's not what I remember. He showed surprising potential for a 2nd round pick is what I remember. I was excited about his future with us.

Yes I was excited too. As Suns fans we were all pretty sad in thinking any player younger than 30 was a beacon of hope. But his summer league numbers were quite average. I was constantly looking for silver linings.

So there’s no way to find those 6 minutes of play anywhere? Not even on the basketball streams sites?

Does anyone know what the "lewd gesture" was that Brooks got fined $25k for? Something about an "upward thrust with his hands". Was that by chance after he made that acrobatic basket and 1? If so doesn't he deserve a bit of celebration?

JJ Slim wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 12:05 pm

Does anyone know what the "lewd gesture" was that Brooks got fined $25k for? Something about an "upward thrust with his hands". Was that by chance after he made that acrobatic basket and 1? If so doesn't he deserve a bit of celebration?

Yeah, that was the play. I guess it was a wrestling signature called a crotch chop. Maybe one of our wrestling aficionados will chime in.





ETA:

Earlier this season, the league fined Philadelphia 76ers center Joel Embiid $50,000 on Nov. 2 for making the same gesture during an Oct. 31 game against the Boston Celtics. The “DX Chop” celebration is borrowed from the world of professional wrestling, where the gesture gained popularity during the “Attitude Era” of WWE in the late ’90s.

Hehe



My adolescent years

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 8:20 am

I honestly don’t get why anyone would think that the Beal trade sank us. Yes he had a no trade clause and that was a major bitch but he only cost us CP3 who was over the hill and a bunch of 2nd round picks. KD trade was the one that actually cleaned our entire cupboard.

I didn’t like the KD trade at the time and still don’t like it today. KD put up numbers but he did not deliver anywhere near the type of value one would expect from their number one star. Did we have roster issues? Yes we did. But as a number one star KD is deeply flawed and he’s pretty unaware in terms of his impact on a team of players that look up to him. Luckily for Houston they have some tough minded people on their team, starting with Ime.

What??? The Beal trade also cost us 1st round pick swaps with WAS in 2024, 2026, 2028, and 2030. Yes, those are swaps and not outright pick losses (we weren't allowed to trade those 1sts) but swaps can be very costly because now if we have a down season we don't get to keep our own lottery pick. Those swaps are absolutely a huge part of why the Beal trade was so harmful. That plus his no-trade clause made it extremely "all-in' with no picks and no flexibility to move him if it didn't work out. I absolutely think the Beal trade was a disaster and that it is what ultimately sunk the team. Giving up so much for KD was also painful, but at least KD was an All-Star and an asset we could trade later. Beal was an injured bum and couldn't be traded so we had to just cut him and pay his salary until next decade.

https://www.nba.com/news/wizards-suns-t ... chris-paul

Oh that makes more sense now. Still seems a little petty to fine him.