Phx-Suns.Net

OE32 wrote:BTW - unless a killer deal is available, I'd prefer to keep both Chandler and Tucker, moving Tucker to the bench in the near future.

I go back and forth on those two. I'm not itching to move them but what are you going to do if it was offered a 1stR pick and cap flexibility. Of course you NEVER pay to get rid of them, but given the state of the franchise if you can get a positive package this season, you need to take it and run. There will always be another hustler and there will alway be another vet willing to sign his last relevant contract.

There will always be another hustler and there will alway be another vet willing to sign his last relevant contract.

Very rationale take.

Indy wrote:So I have to ask: What about TJ and Alex is more exciting than Booker so far?

I think Len's the type of player who takes time to develop. I think he has the potential to be a monster on defense and a very good offensive player at the league's toughest position. There simply aren't that many great rim protectors, and of those, there are even fewer who have real offensive potential. I know not everyone agrees with this take, but I see Len as a potential max player.

As far as TJ goes - I thought he showed more energy in his first summer league stint than at any other point as a Sun. I think he's the type of player who needs the freedom to shoot 15-20 shots a night to get in a rhythm offensively and defensively. Booker is a shooter - and more than that - but he's also kind of a textbook 2 guard. I think TJ has the potential to be a go-to scorer. He may not get there, whereas we can already be pretty sure that Booker will be a 20 PPG scorer in this league. I'm simply intrigued by his array of moves and the potential that comes with his unique abilities.

Just because I'm more excited about a player doesn't mean I think that player is more valuable. At this point, I wouldn't trade any of the three for just about anyone, but I admit that Booker is the one who would require the most value in a deal for me to pull the trigger. TJ and Alex are riskier, and therefore less valuable, assets, but I love them for the reasons provided above.

You kind of have to trade Knight or Bledsoe and let Booker start next year, don't you? Sending him back to the bench seems like such a waste and I wouldn't put it past Hornacek to do so if he's still the Suns' coach.

carey wrote:You kind of have to trade Knight or Bledsoe and let Booker start next year, don't you? Sending him back to the bench seems like such a waste and I wouldn't put it past Hornacek to do so if he's still the Suns' coach.

I think Booker should start, with Knight and Archie coming off the bench. And at this point, I prefer Archie at point. TJ should also start with the twin towers, with Tucker coming in when one of the towers goes out.

OE32 wrote:There simply aren't that many great rim protectors, and of those, there are even fewer who have real offensive potential. I know not everyone agrees with this take, but I see Len as a potential max player.

First, let me say that I am a big Len supporter. And I think it will take time before he reaches his full potential, likely another 3-5 years.

That said, I haven't seen anything that tells me he will be a top-notch rim protector or an offensive weapon. And we need him to be both to be a max player. Unless you are saying Max Player meaning one of the top 3-5 FAs in a given year, who is given the max because someone has to spend it. That I can maybe see happening at some point. But I just can't see a way (so far) that Alex will be considered one of the top 2-3 Cs in the game. That just isn't him.

OE32 wrote:Booker is a shooter - and more than that - but he's also kind of a textbook 2 guard. I think TJ has the potential to be a go-to scorer.

A text-book 2 guard is a go-to scorer, at least in my book. The skills TJ has shown do not tell me he is a guy you throw the ball to and say, "go to work." He scores off movement, cutting, back-doors, and needs good passing to make that happen. I know we have already discussed this during our bet, but I can't see him ever getting to be a 25 ppg scorer.

OE32 wrote:Just because I'm more excited about a player doesn't mean I think that player is more valuable.

Fair enough. That's the part I was confused about. I get that when it is a great aging vet and there is the next generation on the bench, but with 3 guys <23 years old, I wasn't sure why TJ/Alex would be more exciting when they have shown fewer flashes of brilliance.

OE32 wrote:

Indy wrote:So I have to ask: What about TJ and Alex is more exciting than Booker so far?

I think Len's the type of player who takes time to develop. I think he has the potential to be a monster on defense and a very good offensive player at the league's toughest position. There simply aren't that many great rim protectors, and of those, there are even fewer who have real offensive potential. I know not everyone agrees with this take, but I see Len as a potential max player.

This is my optimistic look at Len as well. I you make a stretch big man out of him you have a monster whose impact could be comparable to Ibaka.

As far as TJ goes - I thought he showed more energy in his first summer league stint than at any other point as a Sun. I think he's the type of player who needs the freedom to shoot 15-20 shots a night to get in a rhythm offensively and defensively. Booker is a shooter - and more than that - but he's also kind of a textbook 2 guard. I think TJ has the potential to be a go-to scorer. He may not get there, whereas we can already be pretty sure that Booker will be a 20 PPG scorer in this league. I'm simply intrigued by his array of moves and the potential that comes with his unique abilities.

I could see him not getting real playing time (until the team was done) as a unnecessary hurdle in his development. Big stain in Hornacek's record. He has made improvements, though. He can hit threes now. I believe Warren acquiring a long shot was a given to some people but he is making shots. Btw, is Hornacek a hell of a shooting coach?

Not for Archie.

A Warren-Len-Chandler frontcourt has horrendous spacing and outside shooting. That does not feel like a successful 2016 lineup to me.

The Bobster wrote:Not for Archie.

Touche.

Mori Chu wrote:A Warren-Len-Chandler frontcourt has horrendous spacing and outside shooting. That does not feel like a successful 2016 lineup to me.

Sure, but games are long and sometimes you can use a different kind of lineup. Knowing Len can be used alongside an enforcer because he provides offense is nice, as well as using Warren without being scared by his lack of defense and rebounding. In case Len develops, of course.

Mori Chu wrote:A Warren-Len-Chandler frontcourt has horrendous spacing and outside shooting. That does not feel like a successful 2016 lineup to me.

But a Len, Chandler, Ingram front line would be brilliant.

Mori Chu wrote:A Warren-Len-Chandler frontcourt has horrendous spacing and outside shooting. That does not feel like a successful 2016 lineup to me.

Didn't you hear? Warren's a 40% 3FG shooter. And Len's been solid from midrange.

The Bobster wrote:Not for Archie.

But he's uncoachable!

Superbone wrote:

The Bobster wrote:Not for Archie.

But he's uncoachable!

That's what we are hearing. We've also heard before what a workhorse he is at the gym.

So don't coach him. He wants to be the players he is right now? Fine by me, but become as effective as possible at what you do. Barbosa also had this his first couple of years.

OE32 wrote:

Mori Chu wrote:A Warren-Len-Chandler frontcourt has horrendous spacing and outside shooting. That does not feel like a successful 2016 lineup to me.

Didn't you hear? Warren's a 40% 3FG shooter. And Len's been solid from midrange.

Don't look now, Mr 40%.

But yeah, I can totally see this guy developing a pretty wide offense.

Speaking of the Hawks, apparently Schroeder or Teague is gonna be available sooner than later.

The hoarder in me wants Schroder, but that's crazy with Bledsoe. If you can pawn off Bledsoe AND Knight in the process, I am listening.

(And what if the draft forces us to take Dunn?)