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Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:Bledsoe gets a lot of assists where he just happens to be the guy who makes the last pass. Ulis and truer PGs get assists where they actually see a play unfolding and go out of their way to pass to somebody who is open or who can get a shot. There is a huge difference. Bledsoe is the one who I think should never be a starting NBA PG. He doesn't play the position the right way. I am just done with these ball hogging guards who don't share the ball or make their teammates better.

Eric Bledsoe is not a ball hog.

Indy wrote:

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:Bledsoe gets a lot of assists where he just happens to be the guy who makes the last pass. Ulis and truer PGs get assists where they actually see a play unfolding and go out of their way to pass to somebody who is open or who can get a shot. There is a huge difference. Bledsoe is the one who I think should never be a starting NBA PG. He doesn't play the position the right way. I am just done with these ball hogging guards who don't share the ball or make their teammates better.

Eric Bledsoe is not a ball hog.

I was just going to say this. He may not see the floor like the Nash, Kidd, rubio, ulis point guards, but he's a willing passer. Bledsoe gets a bad rap often, but he was very good last year and is a very good player. I wouldn't hesitate to move him, but it has nothing to do with his play, just his age.

Split T wrote:

Indy wrote:

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:Bledsoe gets a lot of assists where he just happens to be the guy who makes the last pass. Ulis and truer PGs get assists where they actually see a play unfolding and go out of their way to pass to somebody who is open or who can get a shot. There is a huge difference. Bledsoe is the one who I think should never be a starting NBA PG. He doesn't play the position the right way. I am just done with these ball hogging guards who don't share the ball or make their teammates better.

Eric Bledsoe is not a ball hog.

I was just going to say this. He may not see the floor like the Nash, Kidd, rubio, ulis point guards, but he's a willing passer. Bledsoe gets a bad rap often, but he was very good last year and is a very good player. I wouldn't hesitate to move him, but it has nothing to do with his play, just his age.

His usage rate is also less than guys like Curry, and Kwahi, and nobody would call either of them ball hogs.

I wouldn't say usage is a good indicator of a ball hog. A better measure would be time spent with the ball per touch. And I'd discount the first 'touch' of every possesion that brings the ball up the court and waits for guys to get into position
Take the Klay's 60 point game for example. I guess his usage was high that game, but he barely had the ball in his hands.

Hermen wrote:I wouldn't say usage is a good indicator of a ball hog. A better measure would be time spent with the ball per touch. And I'd discount the first 'touch' of every possesion that brings the ball up the court and waits for guys to get into position
Take the Klay's 60 point game for example. I guess his usage was high that game, but he barely had the ball in his hands.

Guards who averaged more time with ball per touch than Bledsoe:

First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

Lowry, Derozan, IT, Irving, CP3, George Hill, Tony Parker, Dragic, Conley, Teague, Westbrook, harden, Rubio, Lillard, Kemba, and wall all hold the ball longer than bled per touch.

I assume Carey already posted this, but here is McD's season end interview.

http://www.nba.com/suns/video/teams/sun ... -interview

He hits all the hot topics, and gives a lot of political answers.

• Excited about the young core. It all came together after the trade deadline. Young core will be in PHX over the summer.
• Team played hard despite so many loses and "just kept coming".
• Bled is still a core piece of the team, and PGs often peak later, so he expects Bled to keep getting better.
• Watson did a great job managing the locker room full of talented players who often didn't get to play.
• Knight played badly. He needs to play better and the team needs to do a better job of making him successful. His talent (borderline allstar 2 years ago) didn't go away.
• Book will work on leg strength to help him on defense.
• OKC and Golden State lost a lot of games when their players were young.
• Chandler wants to stay here as a mentor and a leader.
• Len's high end games are pretty good, other times he struggles. They have been throwing too much at him. Need to simplify and get him good at a couple of different things and grow him though a multi year plan. There are more layers he can add to his game.

Here are the things I thought were controversial or interesting:

• Had goal of being a playoff team, which was unrealistic given the age of the roster and the commitment to developing young guys.
  -- If you go back to the beginning of the season, he was lowering expectations from the get-go. He predicted 26.5 wins, IIRC, and told us from day one that young teams don't win a lot. The playoff goal was never his. Might be just lip service to winning, or he might be talking about Sarver's goals.
• There are "at least" 5 really good players in this year's draft. Very good players at guard and wing, where we already have depth. Will take BPA and work out the roster.
  -- I would love to know who their top 5 are. Fultz, Ball, Jackson, Tatum?, ?
• They have the option to rapidly accelerate the playoff timeline by trading some young talent. This year, especially, they will have the ability to trade.
  -- He talks a lot about how he doesn't know what they will choose to do with their options. He says that if they are patient, they can build a very sustainable core that wins for a long time, but if they are not they can get into the playoffs very soon. This whole section sounded to me like he isn't sure he can talk Robert into keeping patient with the growth of the young guys.
• There are a few of our young guys, especially Devin, that I just don't foresee any scenario in which we would move him... now or ever
  -- I wonder who his other young untouchables are, or his second tier of guys who he wants to keep long term.

Split T wrote:

Indy wrote:

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:Bledsoe gets a lot of assists where he just happens to be the guy who makes the last pass. Ulis and truer PGs get assists where they actually see a play unfolding and go out of their way to pass to somebody who is open or who can get a shot. There is a huge difference. Bledsoe is the one who I think should never be a starting NBA PG. He doesn't play the position the right way. I am just done with these ball hogging guards who don't share the ball or make their teammates better.

Eric Bledsoe is not a ball hog.

I was just going to say this. He may not see the floor like the Nash, Kidd, rubio, ulis point guards, but he's a willing passer. Bledsoe gets a bad rap often, but he was very good last year and is a very good player. I wouldn't hesitate to move him, but it has nothing to do with his play, just his age.

He's not a ballhog, but he just can't pass very well. In particular, he's not good at passing toward the basket, so you end up playing a style where you clear out for Eric and let him drive. Which is OK sometimes, but it's not great for that to be the team's first or best option. You aren't going to win a lot that way. I'm not mad at the guy, but I would rather cash in on his good season.

I'm sure Booker, Chriss, Bender and Ulis are "untouchable" right now, mostly because Booker is our franchise guy, Chriss and Bender are unknowns and Ulis isn't a target for other teams. I think TJ could be had, as could Len. Knight for sure.

The 5 really good players are probably Ball, Fultz, Jackson, Fox and maybe Tatum. Maybe Isaac or one of the other guards.

ShelC wrote:I'm sure Booker, Chriss, Bender and Ulis are "untouchable" right now, mostly because Booker is our franchise guy, Chriss and Bender are unknowns and Ulis isn't a target for other teams. I think TJ could be had, as could Len. Knight for sure.

The 5 really good players are probably Ball, Fultz, Jackson, Fox and maybe Tatum. Maybe Isaac or one of the other guards.

He has to say 5 because we can get any spot 1-5. You don't say that your pick isn't valuable if it is 4th or 5th.

Indy wrote:

ShelC wrote:I'm sure Booker, Chriss, Bender and Ulis are "untouchable" right now, mostly because Booker is our franchise guy, Chriss and Bender are unknowns and Ulis isn't a target for other teams. I think TJ could be had, as could Len. Knight for sure.

The 5 really good players are probably Ball, Fultz, Jackson, Fox and maybe Tatum. Maybe Isaac or one of the other guards.

He has to say 5 because we can get any spot 1-5. You don't say that your pick isn't valuable if it is 4th or 5th.

That could def be it.

Ya, he said at least 5. He's just saying we are guaranteed a shot at a good player

Split T wrote:Ya, he said at least 5. He's just saying we are guaranteed a shot at a good player

Guaranteed a shot at a good prospect. There's never any guarantee that a good prospect will become a good player.

Yep.

Cap wrote:

Split T wrote:Ya, he said at least 5. He's just saying we are guaranteed a shot at a good player

Guaranteed a shot at a good prospect. There's never any guarantee that a good prospect will become a good player.

Unless it is Lonzo BALL you mean!!!1!!!1!!

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote:

Cap wrote:

Split T wrote:Ya, he said at least 5. He's just saying we are guaranteed a shot at a good player

Guaranteed a shot at a good prospect. There's never any guarantee that a good prospect will become a good player.

Unless it is Lonzo BALL you mean!!!1!!!1!!

LaVar is that you??!!?!

Split T wrote:First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

See, that's really interesting. When watching them run the team it feels totally different. It feels like the ball sticks with Bledsoe and that it moves freely with Ulis. Maybe that's not the right stat to describe the difference.

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

See, that's really interesting. When watching them run the team it feels totally different. It feels like the ball sticks with Bledsoe and that it moves freely with Ulis. Maybe that's not the right stat to describe the difference.

When Ulis has the ball, he himself is usually in motion. Bledsoe seems to spend more time dribbling in place. Also Ulis can probe the paint while keeping his dribble, while Bledsoe seems to do more of his dribbling on the perimeter. Bleds often "pounds the ball" at the top of the key while he waits for teammates to clear out, then barrels toward the rim, picking up his dribble on reaching the paint, and hopes to get off a shot or a pass. I wonder, is there a "dribbling in place" stat, or a "dribble map" of where a player does his dribbling?

Cap wrote:

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

See, that's really interesting. When watching them run the team it feels totally different. It feels like the ball sticks with Bledsoe and that it moves freely with Ulis. Maybe that's not the right stat to describe the difference.

When Ulis has the ball, he himself is usually in motion. Bledsoe seems to spend more time dribbling in place. Also Ulis can probe the paint while keeping his dribble, while Bledsoe seems to do more of his dribbling on the perimeter. Bleds often "pounds the ball" at the top of the key while he waits for teammates to clear out, then barrels toward the rim, picking up his dribble on reaching the paint, and hopes to get off a shot or a pass. I wonder, is there a "dribbling in place" stat, or a "dribble map" of where a player does his dribbling?

There you go. I couldn't put it into thought or words. Yep, that describes the difference really well and explains why that stat could still be so similar despite the play/result difference.

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

See, that's really interesting. When watching them run the team it feels totally different. It feels like the ball sticks with Bledsoe and that it moves freely with Ulis. Maybe that's not the right stat to describe the difference.

Stats can be misleading and this one may not tell the whole story, but our eyes can be misleading too. I think there's a good chance we want Bledsoe to be a ball hog so we remember the times he holds the ball the whole possession and forget those same times for Ulis. As a team we averaged 20.9 assists per game once Ulis took over as the starter for the last 15 games. Our season average was 19.6. However, interesting to note is that we averaged 23.0 assists per game in the 10 games we played with Bledsoe after the all star break.

Cap wrote:

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:First off, Bledsoe ranks 45th at 4.58 seconds. Ulis is 49th at 4.55 seconds by the way.

See, that's really interesting. When watching them run the team it feels totally different. It feels like the ball sticks with Bledsoe and that it moves freely with Ulis. Maybe that's not the right stat to describe the difference.

When Ulis has the ball, he himself is usually in motion. Bledsoe seems to spend more time dribbling in place. Also Ulis can probe the paint while keeping his dribble, while Bledsoe seems to do more of his dribbling on the perimeter. Bleds often "pounds the ball" at the top of the key while he waits for teammates to clear out, then barrels toward the rim, picking up his dribble on reaching the paint, and hopes to get off a shot or a pass. I wonder, is there a "dribbling in place" stat, or a "dribble map" of where a player does his dribbling?

There is a stat that tells us Ulis dribbled 5.2 times per touch and Bledsoe dribbled 4.3. That could perhaps indicate that Bledsoe spent more time just holding the ball.