Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 5:15 am
by virtual9mm
What's most disturbing about this loss for me is that we're seeing the same kind of mental collapse as we saw in the Dallas series. We hadn't seen this before...losing 4 in a row to the Bucks was painful but the Suns were battling to the end in each of these games.
And...Chris Paul was back this game. What is it about Chris Paul that enables these kinds of collapses? We've seen them over and over in his career. Sure, we can talk about injuries and COVID and such...but I'm not liking the pattern.
I thought the Suns were doing fine without him until the last couple of games, and that's a depth issue as much as anything else. I'd rather have the Suns commit to a partial rebuild without Paul rather than try to win a title with him. A Suns built around Booker and a tuned-in Ayton with a third star and elite role players like Bridges is going to be a contender with or without Paul -- as long as you don't have these mysterious collapses. I say that the Suns try to trade Paul to a team trying to make the jump into the playoffs and get whatever we can get.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 6:55 am
by ShelC
Not quite as down as others but this one sucked hard. Disappointed we didn't have the juice to show up. I don't think the Cs had much to do with our play early on; we just missed every shot and never got into the game. I'm chalking this stretch up to fatigue mostly but also now working CP and TC back in with Monty still figuring out rotations and combos.
I don't think we're as bad as we've looked, we know we have holes on the roster but when we get into this funk, it gets ugly.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
The Suns lose in the Finals and they pretty much stand pat (their big addition? Landry Shamet).
The Celtics lose in the Finals and they add Malcolm Brogdon and Danilo Gallinari (who is out injured).
What do I take from this? The Suns are complacent with what they have - sometimes you have to be aggressive adding talent to keep your team on top. They should have gotten rid of Crowder over the summer and gotten a big forward who can defend and they should have moved some picks and players to get more scoring, especially off the bench.
You act like you didn’t like what you saw on the court tonight.
Three embarassing losses in one week.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:32 am
by TOO
Suns getting slapped back to reality, maybe Jones and his cronies will do something good, as unlikely as that seems.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
What's most disturbing about this loss for me is that we're seeing the same kind of mental collapse as we saw in the Dallas series. We hadn't seen this before...losing 4 in a row to the Bucks was painful but the Suns were battling to the end in each of these games.
And...Chris Paul was back this game. What is it about Chris Paul that enables these kinds of collapses? We've seen them over and over in his career. Sure, we can talk about injuries and COVID and such...but I'm not liking the pattern.
I thought the Suns were doing fine without him until the last couple of games, and that's a depth issue as much as anything else. I'd rather have the Suns commit to a partial rebuild without Paul rather than try to win a title with him. A Suns built around Booker and a tuned-in Ayton with a third star and elite role players like Bridges is going to be a contender with or without Paul -- as long as you don't have these mysterious collapses. I say that the Suns try to trade Paul to a team trying to make the jump into the playoffs and get whatever we can get.
They won’t, but I’ve been hoping for the same since last years collapse
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
And...Chris Paul was back this game. What is it about Chris Paul that enables these kinds of collapses? We've seen them over and over in his career. Sure, we can talk about injuries and COVID and such...but I'm not liking the pattern.
Chris Paul wasn't playing on Monday. This team has a number problems. Paul is only one of them.
I thought the Suns were doing fine without him until the last couple of games, and that's a depth issue as much as anything else. I'd rather have the Suns commit to a partial rebuild without Paul rather than try to win a title with him. A Suns built around Booker and a tuned-in Ayton with a third star and elite role players like Bridges is going to be a contender with or without Paul -- as long as you don't have these mysterious collapses. I say that the Suns try to trade Paul to a team trying to make the jump into the playoffs and get whatever we can get.
A "tuned-in Ayton" is hardly a guarantee.
I don't think there is any chance the Suns trade Paul. I think the chances are higher he gets waived in the offseason, and I doubt that will even happen.
I would love to move on from Paul, but it just isn't realistic to think Jones/Monty will.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:04 am
by INFORMER
Eventually the toilet is going to get clogged.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:07 am
by TOO
Saw a tweet saying Joe Biden made a trade to help a Phoenix team before James Jones did. Made me laugh and also very very sad at the same time.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:09 am
by INFORMER
As a basketball fan, it's cool to see the Celtics put up this performance on the third game in four nights, on the road, all while playing without Al Hordford and still missing Robert Williams.
They also pulled it off starting Blake Griffin's corpse.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Saw a tweet saying Joe Biden made a trade to help a Phoenix team before James Jones did. Made me laugh and also very very sad at the same time.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:27 am
by INFORMER
Honestly, it probably is just the December 15 clearance that is the hold up for James Jones. And it is probably wiser to wait for it. The Crowder situation should have been resolved in the offseason, but once we got into the regular season, waiting is the prudent thing to do.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:49 am
by Split T
At this point I think we need to wait until we figure out if CP3 is going to give us anything. This team isn’t winning a title if the CP3 we’ve seen is the CP3 we get. That would dictate the direction I go.
If CP3 can get back to being himself, then I think it makes sense to make a go for it trade. If he’s gonna be a shell of himself, then try and move Crowder for an asset that makes sense in the future. Don’t trade for Eric Gordon to get us to the 2nd round instead of the 1st round.
Ultimately long term we need to find Booker a sidekick…I think it’s pretty clear Ayton and Mikal are not that. They are 3rd/4th pieces at best. They are good 3rd and 4th pieces, but we need to find that 1 or 2. This summer is probably a more likely time to figure that out.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
At this point I think we need to wait until we figure out if CP3 is going to give us anything. This team isn’t winning a title if the CP3 we’ve seen is the CP3 we get. That would dictate the direction I go.
If CP3 can get back to being himself, then I think it makes sense to make a go for it trade. If he’s gonna be a shell of himself, then try and move Crowder for an asset that makes sense in the future. Don’t trade for Eric Gordon to get us to the 2nd round instead of the 1st round.
Ultimately long term we need to find Booker a sidekick…I think it’s pretty clear Ayton and Mikal are not that. They are 3rd/4th pieces at best. They are good 3rd and 4th pieces, but we need to find that 1 or 2. This summer is probably a more likely time to figure that out.
Honestly, I don't think you have to wait for CP3. Even if he starts playing better, we've seen this movie before. He can't sustain it through a playoff run. So I don't think there is any point in having him be the determining factor.
In terms of Crowder, I'm not sure that Suns can be that picky. But I think regardless, it has to make sense long-term. Even a move like packaging him with Shamet and Saric for Kevin Love makes sense long-term because we get out of Shamet's deal. On the flip side, Love is a "go for it" acquisition.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
As a basketball fan, it's cool to see the Celtics put up this performance on the third game in four nights, on the road, all while playing without Al Hordford and still missing Robert Williams.
They also pulled it off starting Blake Griffin's corpse.
Brad Stevens seems pretty good at all things basketball.
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
As a basketball fan, it's cool to see the Celtics put up this performance on the third game in four nights, on the road, all while playing without Al Hordford and still missing Robert Williams.
They also pulled it off starting Blake Griffin's corpse.
Definitely a case where saying "we didn't have Cam or Jae" rings hollow. Robert Williams + Horford >>>>>>>>
Re: Game Day: Celtics (20-5) @ Suns (16-8), Wed 12/7/22
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 10:10 am
by LazarusLong
That the Celtics beat the Suns shouldn't be a surprise.
Boston handled the Suns easily when they met in the second half of the season.
And that was with Crowder, Cam Johnson and a reasonably healthy Paul.
What was shocking was the way the Suns turned tail and failed to respond ... at home ... to the Celtics run.
When Luke Kornet goes 6-6, that's a telling stat (looking at you, Jock Landale).
This was Watson-era Suns at its worst.
