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Well, when you look at what else they have in the paint, he probably is. This is the worst group of PF the Suns have had since I've been watching them. When you're so desperate you're using Warren or Ariza there instead of at SF you're screwed.
I think this is a very fair take. He hasn't been changing the game at all. But how much of that is what we have around him? Who has been the most impactful rookie center in the last 10 years?The Bobster wrote: ↑Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:14 amWell, when you look at what else they have in the paint, he probably is. This is the worst group of PF the Suns have had since I've been watching them. When you're so desperate you're using Warren or Ariza there instead of at SF you're screwed.
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Crit Crit Crit Crit Tota Tota Per Per Per Per Per Shoo Shoo Shoo Shoo
Rk Player From To Tm PTS TRB BLK WS G GS MP FG FGA FT FTA FG% eFG% FT% TS%
1 Karl-Anthony Towns 2016 2016 MIN 18.3 10.5 1.7 8.3 82 82 32.0 7.6 14.1 2.7 3.4 .542 .555 .811 .590
2 Nikola Jokic 2016 2016 DEN 10.0 7.0 0.6 6.7 80 55 21.7 3.8 7.5 1.9 2.4 .512 .535 .811 .582
3 Greg Monroe 2011 2011 DET 9.4 7.5 0.6 6.6 80 48 27.8 3.8 6.9 1.8 2.9 .551 .551 .622 .575
4 Marc Gasol 2009 2009 MEM 11.9 7.4 1.1 6.4 82 75 30.7 4.3 8.1 3.4 4.6 .530 .530 .733 .590
5 Brook Lopez 2009 2009 NJN 13.0 8.1 1.8 5.8 82 75 30.5 5.5 10.3 2.1 2.6 .531 .531 .793 .568
6 Mason Plumlee 2014 2014 BRK 7.4 4.4 0.8 4.7 70 22 18.2 2.8 4.3 1.7 2.8 .659 .659 .626 .670
7 Greg Oden 2009 2009 POR 8.9 7.0 1.1 4.6 61 39 21.5 3.2 5.8 2.4 3.7 .564 .564 .637 .599
8 Andre Drummond 2013 2013 DET 7.9 7.6 1.6 4.5 60 10 20.7 3.5 5.7 1.0 2.7 .608 .610 .371 .578
9 Bam Adebayo 2018 2018 MIA 6.9 5.5 0.6 4.2 69 19 19.8 2.5 4.9 1.9 2.6 .512 .512 .721 .570
10 Nerlens Noel 2015 2015 PHI 9.9 8.1 1.9 4.0 75 71 30.8 4.0 8.7 1.9 3.1 .462 .462 .609 .493
The Heat are a perfect example of how skill set determines a young player’s role, irrespective of draft hype. They drafted two wings in 2015: Justise Winslow (no. 10 overall) and Josh Richardson (no. 40 overall). Winslow was a one-and-done star at Duke who could do everything but shoot. Richardson, a four-year player at Tennessee, was seen as a 3-and-D prospect with a low ceiling. Winslow still can’t shoot four years later, while Richardson has gone from a good shooter to a great one (39.9 percent from 3 on 6.9 attempts per game) and turned himself into a more well-rounded player in the process. Richardson is a two-way star who can play on or off the ball, while Winslow is stuck in a sixth-man role to limit the damage his poor shooting inflicts on his own team.
I get what you are saying, but we would be extremely lucky if Josh develops into a 6th man on a middling team... that is how far off he has been. And he was taken #4. Huge difference between 4 and 10.Marty [Mori Chu] wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 11:08 amThanks for posting that article. I found their comparison to the Heat wings particularly compelling:
The Heat are a perfect example of how skill set determines a young player’s role, irrespective of draft hype. They drafted two wings in 2015: Justise Winslow (no. 10 overall) and Josh Richardson (no. 40 overall). Winslow was a one-and-done star at Duke who could do everything but shoot. Richardson, a four-year player at Tennessee, was seen as a 3-and-D prospect with a low ceiling. Winslow still can’t shoot four years later, while Richardson has gone from a good shooter to a great one (39.9 percent from 3 on 6.9 attempts per game) and turned himself into a more well-rounded player in the process. Richardson is a two-way star who can play on or off the ball, while Winslow is stuck in a sixth-man role to limit the damage his poor shooting inflicts on his own team.
If he played under control and defended he'd be a nice Igg-lite role player. But he just can't finish or shoot. And for one reason or another he won't be a plus defender either. Won't extend on what we should have done with him over the offseason...Split T wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 11:48 amYa, I thought Jackson would do enough other stuff to make up for his lack of shooting, but it’s becoming obvious that if you can’t shoot and don’t have another elite skill, you’re gonna struggle to succeed. Jackson does quite a few things well,but nothing at an elite level. He really needs to work on his shooting and playmaking and that will open up a lot of opportunities for his scoring. Would be really nice if he started defending like he was supposed to.
No, I think he's been about as advertised, mostly empty stats, the only impact I saw was the 1st couple of games when defenses sagged on him because they thought he was gonna do something in the post. Much like he showed ag Arizona, he has little to no post game or offensive moveset, its as if he has no idea what to do with the ball once he has it aside from passing or shooting. I wanted to draft Doncic and was willing to max Capela to shore up the 5 in the off-season, so far I wish we had gone that route, but we didn't. So I'm gonna hope for the best that Ayton can really grow on both ends of the court because this franchise needs it. At least I don't hate the Ayton pick as much as I did with Jackson and the Bust Towers.
I think we should still call them the Twin Towers, but specify it is post 9/11. Duncan and Robinson are the pre 9/11 twin towers.TheOriginalOriginal wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:37 pmNo, I think he's been about as advertised, mostly empty stats, the only impact I saw was the 1st couple of games when defenses sagged on him because they thought he was gonna do something in the post. Much like he showed ag Arizona, he has little to no post game or offensive moveset, its as if he has no idea what to do with the ball once he has it aside from passing or shooting. I wanted to draft Doncic and was willing to max Capela to shore up the 5 in the off-season, so far I wish we had gone that route, but we didn't. So I'm gonna hope for the best that Ayton can really grow on both ends of the court because this franchise needs it. At least I don't hate the Ayton pick as much as I did with Jackson and the Bust Towers.
Capela has been awesome, but even in hindsight I still couldn't bring myself to max him out. Houston got him on the deal he should have, but of course the Suns would have had to offer more.TheOriginalOriginal wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:37 pmwas willing to max Capela to shore up the 5 in the off-season
Indy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:52 pmI think we should still call them the Twin Towers, but specify it is post 9/11. Duncan and Robinson are the pre 9/11 twin towers.TheOriginalOriginal wrote: ↑Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:37 pmNo, I think he's been about as advertised, mostly empty stats, the only impact I saw was the 1st couple of games when defenses sagged on him because they thought he was gonna do something in the post. Much like he showed ag Arizona, he has little to no post game or offensive moveset, its as if he has no idea what to do with the ball once he has it aside from passing or shooting. I wanted to draft Doncic and was willing to max Capela to shore up the 5 in the off-season, so far I wish we had gone that route, but we didn't. So I'm gonna hope for the best that Ayton can really grow on both ends of the court because this franchise needs it. At least I don't hate the Ayton pick as much as I did with Jackson and the Bust Towers.
