Phx-Suns.Net

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:59 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:46 am

Ring_Wanted wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:54 am

That's only depth if you compare it to a team that incurred in malpractice last season. It looks like a 'complete' roster but it still has huge holes given the specific players added, all of which bring a concerning amount of question marks.

Also, as proposed by that tweet, the bench is terribly hollow and the starting five unbalanced. I'd start Bridges over Oubre. That way the starters have more defense and one fewer guy that needs the ball in his hands, while the second unit gets a go-to guy offensively.

In any case, we are not fighting against the 18-19 Suns, but against 29 teams in a league that, with few exceptions has improved across the board with talent distribution or has not gotten worse enough to be within reach. Who are we beating on paper with that roster? CHA, NYK, MIN, WAS, MEM, OKC? I don't see 30 wins in there, although maybe I am underrating the impact of getting rid of Jackson.

Cleveland? Dallas? Chicago? Atlanta? New Orleans? Detroit? Orlando? Sacramento? What makes these teams better than us on paper?

With our current roster, fully healthy, and guys playing about where expected, we are much better than the 19 win team last year. Probably 10-12 extra wins this year. Based on last year, that puts us at... last in the West.

As of right now, I think the only team that got clearly worse and are in danger of a big fall is OKC.

I hope I am wrong and this team shows a lot more than expected, but if we are not in the bottom 2-3 in the west, I will be extremely surprised.

I would add Memphis.

With all of the offseason turnover, I think its really hard to predict who is going to be good/bad next season.

Should make for a compelling season.

Split T wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:46 am

Ring_Wanted wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:54 am

That's only depth if you compare it to a team that incurred in malpractice last season. It looks like a 'complete' roster but it still has huge holes given the specific players added, all of which bring a concerning amount of question marks.

Also, as proposed by that tweet, the bench is terribly hollow and the starting five unbalanced. I'd start Bridges over Oubre. That way the starters have more defense and one fewer guy that needs the ball in his hands, while the second unit gets a go-to guy offensively.

In any case, we are not fighting against the 18-19 Suns, but against 29 teams in a league that, with few exceptions has improved across the board with talent distribution or has not gotten worse enough to be within reach. Who are we beating on paper with that roster? CHA, NYK, MIN, WAS, MEM, OKC? I don't see 30 wins in there, although maybe I am underrating the impact of getting rid of Jackson.

Cleveland? Dallas? Chicago? Atlanta? New Orleans? Detroit? Orlando? Sacramento? What makes these teams better than us on paper?

Yeah, I should have mentioned CLE too for sure. Go on and add CLE, ATL and CHI to my list. Winning a pretty optimistic 67% of those games gives you what, 15 Ws? I am just not seeing it with our huge weakness on defense and rebounding. And we absolutely lack experience winning at the pros too. Obviously would love to be wrong and have PHX be the surprise of the season, but the alleged improvement over the '18-19 Suns is not enough to me to have faith.

Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:12 am

I think this group will figure it out on offense in time. Defense and rebounding are looking like massive weaknesses, but those areas are more about will than skill. Unfortunately, Baynes is really the only guy on the roster that has committed to both of those areas thus far in his career.

We're really going to find out about Ayton this year. I'm sure he'll have a long career, but I'm expecting Monty to put it on him and I want to see how he responds.

I would agree that defense is the weakness, but only because I felt they needed to add a weakside shotblocker and rebounder next to Ayton. I really thought Vonleh would have been a good match.

That being said, their defense has improved from last year. Just adding a couple actual PFs to the roster will help with defense, a d Rubio is no sloutch on that end. My expectation is that Ayton is an improved defender this year, and not putting such a huge load on Booker offensively and being competitive night in and night out will show that Devin can play passable defense.

The rebounding, which was the worst in the league last year, will be much improved this year with the additions of Rubio, Saric, Kaminsky and Baynes.

Hermen wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:07 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:59 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:46 am

Ring_Wanted wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:54 am

That's only depth if you compare it to a team that incurred in malpractice last season. It looks like a 'complete' roster but it still has huge holes given the specific players added, all of which bring a concerning amount of question marks.

Also, as proposed by that tweet, the bench is terribly hollow and the starting five unbalanced. I'd start Bridges over Oubre. That way the starters have more defense and one fewer guy that needs the ball in his hands, while the second unit gets a go-to guy offensively.

In any case, we are not fighting against the 18-19 Suns, but against 29 teams in a league that, with few exceptions has improved across the board with talent distribution or has not gotten worse enough to be within reach. Who are we beating on paper with that roster? CHA, NYK, MIN, WAS, MEM, OKC? I don't see 30 wins in there, although maybe I am underrating the impact of getting rid of Jackson.

Cleveland? Dallas? Chicago? Atlanta? New Orleans? Detroit? Orlando? Sacramento? What makes these teams better than us on paper?

With our current roster, fully healthy, and guys playing about where expected, we are much better than the 19 win team last year. Probably 10-12 extra wins this year. Based on last year, that puts us at... last in the West.

As of right now, I think the only team that got clearly worse and are in danger of a big fall is OKC.

I hope I am wrong and this team shows a lot more than expected, but if we are not in the bottom 2-3 in the west, I will be extremely surprised.

I would add Memphis.

I had them in there and before I clicked submit I went through their roster again. They played with a lot of turmoil last year and still managed 33 wins. I don't think they are too far off that pace this year even with the trades they made to reboot themselves.

Downgrading from Conley to Ja should be a decent hit though. Unless Ja is a stud from the get go.

When we acquired Richaun half of .net was wondering if he's any good and I was quite confident that most would like him when he got on the court. I watched a bunch of The Process couple seasons ago when Embiid was still on minutes restrictions and Dario was really my favourite player to watch. Glad someone did a passing vid on him, yes he is coming off a down year but I find it hard to believe that his skill sets will not be a big plus for the team and especially Ayton.

The stats would say only 2asts per game but clearly doesn't indicate how he reads the game. Just my 2cents
https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1149799300353814528

Some of those passes are Bird-like.

Saric is great. I'm excited to see him in a Suns uni.

Suns have not had a decent passing 4/5 since Diaw.

Actually, the last several teams have been some of the worst passing teams in franchise history

Rubio and Saric should put some extra voltage in the offense.

Saric is a major upgrade and a major x-factor this season.

LazarusLong wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:43 pm

Suns have not had a decent passing 4/5 since Diaw.

Actually, the last several teams have been some of the worst passing teams in franchise history

Rubio and Saric should put some extra voltage in the offense.

The best passer on the team last year was Booker. Now he is probably 4th.

Rubio and Saric are certainly better and Ty Jerome probably is (he just has not played an NBA game yet, so I pause).

Ayton's a good passer too. He finds the open man

They have the pieces to start running (literally) a classic Suns offensive scheme to maximize the roster..... But will they? Pick and roll, open shooters and cutters, running the ball..... Could this team handle 7SOL?

Phoenix219 wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 13, 2019 1:46 pm

They have the pieces to start running (literally) a classic Suns offensive scheme to maximize the roster..... But will they? Pick and roll, open shooters and cutters, running the ball..... Could this team handle 7SOL?

I actually don't think our roster would be able to handle 7SOL; I just don't think athletically we're at that level. I also don't think this is a "classic" suns roster.

I think if I'm going to compare this roster to any style, it's going to be that of the Spurs with Ginobili, Parker, and Duncan. I think we have the makings of a smart team that will make the right plays, be solid defensively, and maybe be a bit more proficient at shooting the 3. I'm not trying to argue that we'll be a good as those Spurs teams, but I think we've got a roster that can play, and be successful, at that similar style.

If Ayton makes a leap and Saric plays as well as I think he can, I think we could be in the battle for the 7-8 spot.

I understand being pessimistic or cautious when looking ahead to next season. And some teams have made huge improvements, like the Lakers and Clippers, so it's arguable that we will have trouble rising in the standings in the West.

But I think some folks have underestimated just how immensely better our lineup looks than last season's. We have basically fixed our two weakest starting positions, PG and PF, with guys who fit in our system and won't mess up the chemistry with our two stars Booker and Ayton. We retained our SF who was a breakout success at the end of last year. We did some addition by subtraction by getting rid of guys who exhibited ballhogging and bad character. And we hired a coach who is universally well liked by players and folks around the league. It's a nice team.

And as that Saric passing video shows, I think an understated part of what will make this team better next year is that much more than last year, guys will help make other guys better. We will have way more willing passers, guys who will make the right play, guys who don't just care about their own scoring numbers. Rubio and Saric and Oubre and all these guys will be team-first and that will rub off on others. I think the whole will be greater than the sum of the parts, when the opposite was true last year.

I know it sounds stupid to talk about the playoffs or .500 or things like that. But I don't see any reason why this team could not make a huge improvement. If you look at the West, yeah there is a ton of talent, but I don't at all think that the top 8 playoff teams are locked in. I see about 5-6 teams that feel like locks, and I could easily imagine almost any other team going on a run to get that 7th or 8th seed. Why couldn't we get more wins than a Sacramento, Minnesota, Dallas, New Orleans, etc.? Those teams won way more than we did last year, but we have every bit as much talent and more than they have.

I like this roster a lot. I could totally see them being a huge shock to the league next season and blowing away everybody's expectations. Yes, I could see this as a playoff team. More likely not, but still, I do not at all think that is crazy talk to hope for it or think that we have an outside shot at it.

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:34 pm

I understand being pessimistic or cautious when looking ahead to next season. And some teams have made huge improvements, like the Lakers and Clippers, so it's arguable that we will have trouble rising in the standings in the West.

...

I like this roster a lot. I could totally see them being a huge shock to the league next season and blowing away everybody's expectations. Yes, I could see this as a playoff team. More likely not, but still, I do not at all think that is crazy talk to hope for it or think that we have an outside shot at it.

Mori--I totally get the optimism. And our roster is much better constructed than last year. But to make the playoffs in the west, it will likely take 48-50 wins like last year. That means we not only have to win the same games we won last year, but also find another THIRTY games to win. I just don't see us being able to do that. It won't be the 2019-20 Suns playing the 2018-19 Suns. I just don't see enough teams in the league worse than us (especially in the West).

Indy wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:13 pm

Marty [Mori Chu] wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:34 pm

I understand being pessimistic or cautious when looking ahead to next season. And some teams have made huge improvements, like the Lakers and Clippers, so it's arguable that we will have trouble rising in the standings in the West.

...

I like this roster a lot. I could totally see them being a huge shock to the league next season and blowing away everybody's expectations. Yes, I could see this as a playoff team. More likely not, but still, I do not at all think that is crazy talk to hope for it or think that we have an outside shot at it.

Mori--I totally get the optimism. And our roster is much better constructed than last year. But to make the playoffs in the west, it will likely take 48-50 wins like last year. That means we not only have to win the same games we won last year, but also find another THIRTY games to win. I just don't see us being able to do that. It won't be the 2019-20 Suns playing the 2018-19 Suns. I just don't see enough teams in the league worse than us (especially in the West).

Nobody expected the Clippers to win 48 games last season.

Would love to see amare come back for one more year and play "udonis haslem" role on this team.

SDC wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 14, 2019 5:26 am

Would love to see amare come back for one more year and play "udonis haslem" role on this team.

I am just fine to not have Amare on this team. To be honest, I'd much rather give it to someone like Bender or Spalding.