Phx-Suns.Net

I think trading Payne had more to do with how much they’d have to spend in luxury tax to keep him around. They just didn’t believe it was worth the cost and I can’t say I blame them. Payne was wildly inconsistent and injury-prone (though we do admittedly have our fair share of players who are injury-prone).

With Sarver gone, I think it’s been a nice change of pace that the team isn’t focused on simply cutting costs. Ishbia has made a lot of changes that Sarver never would have allowed, and it’s always encouraging as a fan when you have an owner who shows a genuine desire to win.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Yeah, it must be really annoying when somebody repeatedly defends something over and over, every time it is brought up.

(I'm busting your balls, JG)

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

I like to understand why they did what they did, but I don’t agree with every move they make. I’ve definitely disagreed with some. I also realize that sometimes there’s just stuff going on that we don’t know about.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:57 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:54 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:37 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:25 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 10:02 am

We did him so dirty.

Eh, he got all his money guaranteed. He’s gonna play more in Milwaukee than he would here. How do you figure we did him dirty?

He loved Phoenix, he wanted to stay here and help us win a championship. And we gave up a draft pick to get rid of him when we had no other actual point guard on the roster. And still don't.

Well the giving up a pick and not having a pg is irrelevant…has nothing to do with doing him dirty.

And I’m sure lots of people have loved Phoenix and wanted to stay. Can’t make basketball decisions like that.

That's why I included the giving up a pick and having no PG--it shows we did him dirty in the sense that it wasn't even a basketball decision.

Of course it was a basketball decision. He wasn’t good enough to justify spending 25 million on.

I get the whole it’s not my money thing, but it’s unrealistic and honestly kinda ridiculous to expect Ishbia to spend 25 million on a fringe rotation player.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Because it doesn’t help to incessantly whine about what’s been done and is in the rear mirror. You have to move forward as a fan.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 1:47 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Because it doesn’t help to incessantly whine about what’s been done and is in the rear mirror. You have to move forward as a fan.

GODDAMMIT, WHY DIDN’T WE CALL TAILS?!

I was just thinking about how much crap the FO used to take over the past 2-3 years for not making moves. Internal improvement became a joke, re-acquiring Torrey Craig became a joke and we were wishing Jones would make some kind of move giving up assets for guys like John Collins, Bojan Bogdanovic, Kuzma (plus other trade scenarios involving guys like Lou Williams, Quickley, Max Strus/Duncan Robinson). Instead the FO stayed patient and we have a true Big 3 with actual depth on the roster. This is arguably the most talented roster in franchise history and the most talented roster in the NBA. Not too bad.

Remember these articles?

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2022/11/17 ... ukee-bucks

https://valleyofthesuns.com/2022/12/15/ ... -threat/2/

Feels like nitpicking to be complaining about trading Cam Payne away. He had a good run here but wasn't reliable and the entire roster turned over. We've started fresh with 13 new players. Sometimes those moves need to be made.

Ya Payne was awesome in the bubble and the finals year. He’s been a replacement level player the last two years. Just not someone you spend a lot of money on.

ShelC wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 2:16 pm

I was just thinking about how much crap the FO used to take over the past 2-3 years for not making moves. Internal improvement became a joke, re-acquiring Torrey Craig became a joke and we were wishing Jones would make some kind of move giving up assets for guys like John Collins, Bojan Bogdanovic, Kuzma (plus other trade scenarios involving guys like Lou Williams, Quickley, Max Strus/Duncan Robinson). Instead the FO stayed patient and we have a true Big 3 with actual depth on the roster. This is arguably the most talented roster in franchise history and the most talented roster in the NBA. Not too bad.

Remember these articles?

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2022/11/17 ... ukee-bucks

https://valleyofthesuns.com/2022/12/15/ ... -threat/2/

Feels like nitpicking to be complaining about trading Cam Payne away. He had a good run here but wasn't reliable and the entire roster turned over. We've started fresh with 13 new players. Sometimes those moves need to be made.

I can now safely say I was right about it being Sarver being the limiting factor and not Jones. Many fought me on this including INF whom btw is sorely missing from our discussions lately.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 2:43 pm

I can now safely say I was right about it being Sarver being the limiting factor and not Jones. Many fought me on this including INF whom btw is sorely missing from our discussions lately.

Where's he been?

I think Sarver could be the limiting factor…it also could be that Ishbia is pushing for these moves and that’s the difference

Cap wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 1:57 pm

Superbone wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 1:47 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Because it doesn’t help to incessantly whine about what’s been done and is in the rear mirror. You have to move forward as a fan.

GODDAMMIT, WHY DIDN’T WE CALL TAILS?!

YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT L** L****** WASN'T THE REASON THE BULLS WON THREE IN A ROW?

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Please run a search for “Tyrese” and “Haliburton.”

There does seem to be a lot more criticism of draft choices than trades. But again, when I say "most fans" I'm not just talking about our small group here, but the wider fanbase in general.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 3:13 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Please run a search for “Tyrese” and “Haliburton.”

Hassel too.

Who hires Igor as head coach but then doesn’t draft Doncic?

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 5:10 pm

There does seem to be a lot more criticism of draft choices than trades. But again, when I say "most fans" I'm not just talking about our small group here, but the wider fanbase in general.

That’s sadly the problem with the information age. Not only is it easy for anybody to share his/her opinion, so many people do take that opportunity that with any move you can always find plenty of people who are for or against. If you always focus on one side of it, you will always find evidence that supports and reinforces that notion.

With respect to Payne, I agree fully with Split that we did not do anything particularly unfair towards him. He has barely been useful the last year plus and we helped him get a 19 mil payday, and he made enough of an impression on the league that the Bucks picked him up. As far as our interaction with him goes Phoenix was decidedly a net positive on his life.

pickle wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 7:11 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 5:10 pm

There does seem to be a lot more criticism of draft choices than trades. But again, when I say "most fans" I'm not just talking about our small group here, but the wider fanbase in general.

That’s sadly the problem with the information age. Not only is it easy for anybody to share his/her opinion, so many people do take that opportunity that with any move you can always find plenty of people who are for or against. If you always focus on one side of it, you will always find evidence that supports and reinforces that notion.

With respect to Payne, I agree fully with Split that we did not do anything particularly unfair towards him. He has barely been useful the last year plus and we helped him get a 19 mil payday, and he made enough of an impression on the league that the Bucks picked him up. As far as our interaction with him goes Phoenix was decidedly a net positive on his life.

He likely wouldn't have gotten that last contract if we didn't give it to him

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 04, 2023 12:59 pm

I'm genuinely curious about the tendency of most Suns fans to feel like they have to be in favor of, defend, or eventually come around to, basically every move the front office makes. Is there a reason why this is the case?

Not a single fan has any input whatsoever into player personnel moves of the Suns because they don’t own the team. The Suns are a product. They are entertainment like going to a concert to see your favorite band. I like a lot of bands but, I don’t like every single song they all do. You can choose to watch/listen to them and support them or not. One song I don’t like isn’t going to make me not like them anymore. I’m not going to go on a forum of the bands fans and start complaining about that song. The bands album went platinum, there were several hits and they sold out every concert. The song won a Grammy. The band I am talking about is fictitious. I am just trying to give my perspective.

You have absolutely no control over anything that happens with the Suns. I have been a fan since the 80’s and have seen roster change after roster change. I have had these same discussions about many players that have come and gone. The bus is heading into a snow storm and you aren’t driving. Sometimes it’s just better to have a seat, put on your headphones and stop stressing out the driver.

Yo "Nodack"

That's a very good analogy man