Phx-Suns.Net

Indy wrote: The real question on my mind is, who do we take at 5 or 6?

If we move one of Knight or Bledsoe before the draft it is Hield. If we don't I worry it is going to be Brown or we reach for one of the big men like Ellenson.

OE32 wrote:My "if things go well" scenario includes our getting Sabonis at #13 - I don't think he'll be there. Can't identify a PG worthy of the #13 pick, so I think it would be a better idea to grab Sabonis if he's there and keep Knight rather than passing on Sabonis, taking Saric in trade and drafting a PG. Some solid SG prospects possibly available at #13 (Beasley, Furkan), but I can't imagine us taking another SG with Booker and Bogdan on board. WWYD?

First I trade Knight. Period. Market value. Whatever it is. Don't want, don't need.

Now I have way more freedom. Especially if I turn Bledsoe into a variable as well instead of a considering him a keeper. Would Utah/BRY/DAL/HOU/IND/LAL/MIL/NYK/SAC trade for him once he proves he is ok?

We need to carefully ponder bringing in Bogdanovic while he is cheap. I want to see him. Drop Archie.
Solidify Books as starter.

Can't say anything else until the lotto happens.

No matter what happens, I think there's a decent chance we trade a lotto pick. This draft is loaded with 4s and 2s. We don't need 2s, but most of the league does. I could see plenty of teams wanting to trade up to grab one of Murray, Hield, Beasley or Korkmaz.

5 or 6 is a conundrum. I think the top of the draft, no matter what, is Simmons-Ingram-Hield-Bender-Murray-Dunn. So 5-6 is likely guard territory, and there's a drop off after that. We'll see if one of the PFs is able to distinguish himself enough to put him in that range. If not, we should trade down, because we can't, simply can't take another 2.

OE32 wrote:5 or 6 is a conundrum. I think the top of the draft, no matter what, is Simmons-Ingram-Hield-Bender-Murray-Dunn. So 5-6 is likely guard territory, and there's a drop off after that. We'll see if one of the PFs is able to distinguish himself enough to put him in that range. If not, we should trade down, because we can't, simply can't take another 2.

I would definitely be open to moving a pick, but I don't know who is on the trade block. Would I move a pick #3 or worse for Love? Yup. Would I do some crazy trade with Cleveland for Irving and Love moving #3-6, Bledsoe, Chandler, and one of the Miami picks? Yup.

That said there isn't a long list of other players that might be available that I'm interested in acquiring with that pick. We're not getting a Blake Griffin or Derrick Favors. We could probably have an Okafor or Stanley Johnson but it seems as if we missed the boat on Aaron Gordon and I don't really want the other two. I just hope McDonough makes the smart move, whether that's keeping the pick and selecting the right guy or moving the pick for someone that helps us the next 5 or 6 years.

carey wrote:

OE32 wrote:5 or 6 is a conundrum. I think the top of the draft, no matter what, is Simmons-Ingram-Hield-Bender-Murray-Dunn. So 5-6 is likely guard territory, and there's a drop off after that. We'll see if one of the PFs is able to distinguish himself enough to put him in that range. If not, we should trade down, because we can't, simply can't take another 2.

I would definitely be open to moving a pick, but I don't know who is on the trade block. Would I move a pick #3 or worse for Love? Yup. Would I do some crazy trade with Cleveland for Irving and Love moving #3-6, Bledsoe, Chandler, and one of the Miami picks? Yup.

That said there isn't a long list of other players that might be available that I'm interested in acquiring with that pick. We're not getting a Blake Griffin or Derrick Favors. We could probably have an Okafor or Stanley Johnson but it seems as if we missed the boat on Aaron Gordon and I don't really want the other two. I just hope McDonough makes the smart move, whether that's keeping the pick and selecting the right guy or moving the pick for someone that helps us the next 5 or 6 years.

I could see Love coming back in a deal. But I think that if no one is available, try trading down to the 6-9 range and grabbing a future pick in the deal. If we're targeting Chriss, Sabonis or Ellenson, well, all three could be available at 8/9. Might as well add something in the process. Not sure there's a player held by any of those teams (NOP, DEN, SAC, TOR) that I'd want to take back. TOR needs a PF anyway. I keep looking at Denver - they may want to combine their picks to move up. But we have tons of picks as it is and would have to move the additional pick to a third team. Could happen.

Booker - A
Teletovic - A-
Leuer - B+
Bledsoe - B
Price - B-
Tucker - C+
Len - C+
Warren - C+
Goodwin - C
Chandler - C
Knight - C
Keef - F

Split T wrote:Keef - F

You missed a letter:

Keef - FU

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:Keef - F

You missed a letter:

Keef - FU

Haha, good catch!

Split T wrote:

Superbone wrote:

Split T wrote:Keef - F

You missed a letter:

Keef - FU

Haha, good catch!

LOL!

Just a side note. I hate trade talk during the season as most know but, this is the off season after a horrible year. There should be lots of trade talk. Proceed.

Nodack wrote:LOL!

Just a side note. I hate trade talk during the season as most know but, this is the off season after a horrible year. There should be lots of trade talk. Proceed.

You are too funny, North Dakota!

Indy wrote:Mori, do you really think Tyson had a better year than Len? And Knight was only slightly more disappointing than Len?

I think I might be too biased toward the start of the season when Tyson was playing pretty well. He tapered off a lot after that. My score for him is probably too high.

In terms of Len's grade and Knight's grade, well, maybe part of it is that I'm thinking about the player's potential. I don't think Knight is capable of doing much more, and that's just what he is. Len gets a low grade because I expected more and I know he can do much better.

So it is more about grading them against your expectations of them, not in comparison to each other or other players in the league?

Indy wrote:So it is more about grading them against your expectations of them, not in comparison to each other or other players in the league?

I did mine the same way. I mean, if Steph Curry is A+, then no one on this team gets better than a C.

OE32 wrote:

Indy wrote:So it is more about grading them against your expectations of them, not in comparison to each other or other players in the league?

I did mine the same way. I mean, if Steph Curry is A+, then no one on this team gets better than a C.

I did a mix of comparing them against themselves and against their teammates. I ignored the rest of the league.

Bledsoe: C (He's not a point guard, but he's be the perfect 3rd guard)
Booker: B+ (he played well, but there are a lot of unrealistic expectations)
Chandler: C (A lot of talk, not much backing it up when it mattered)
Goodwin: C- (Wasn't given much of a shot, doesn't have much of a shot)
Knight: D+ (Move him. He's a streaky shooting, bad defending, under-sized shooting guard)
Len: C (He really regressed in some ways, the only real improvement has been rebounding)
Leuer: B- (I think we've seen about as good as he's going to get)
Teletovic: B (Great shooter, but that's about it)
Tucker: C+ (Gets everything from his talent, just not talented enough)
Price: C+ (over-aggressive defensively which hurts the team on occasion)
Warren: B (I was hoping to see him get a lot more minutes)

Hornacek: D+ (He lost the team last season when he couldn't control the Morrii)
Watson: D (The defense got even worse after he took over)
McDonough: D+ (His drafting has been ok, but some of his trades have been awful)
Sarver: F- (He's the reason this franchise has hit rock bottom)

Team: F- (We all deserve some kind of award for watching this mess this year.

Watson: D (The defense got even worse after he took over)

That is what I saw too. But do you have data on that?

I generally agree with Bobster. I might switch Leuer's and Teletovic's ratings; Telly is a great gunner, little else, while Leuer is solid, but not great, all around. Together, they make a decent tandem at 4; they just need to stay healthy.

Booker needs to stay in the starting lineup. If they experiment with three guards again, or Chandler and Len starting again, it will be evidence that it's the same shit, different day.

I think Watson has a chance to be a better-than decent coach as he gains experience. I'm not sure that will be done in Phoenix. He stayed fairly calm piloting this garbage scow of a team through a shit storm. If he has some great and wonderful vision for the Suns, that's fine, but I doubt it.

Indy wrote:

Watson: D (The defense got even worse after he took over)

That is what I saw too. But do you have data on that?

Opponents against Hornacek (49 games)- 47.3 FG%, 37.8 FT%, 22.5 Ast, 15.6 Trn, 106.3 Pnts
Opponents against Watson (33 games) - 45.8 FG%, 37.6 3Pt%, 22.2 Ast, 13.9 Trn, 109.0 Pnts

The Defense was particularly bad in February, but was decent enough in April.