Phx-Suns.Net

I'm moving on, Jeremy. You can think what you want to think. Monty is the root of all evil and Crowder is a perfect angel. Got it.

Not saying that at all. I think Crowder handled this very poorly. But I also think we should have offered him an extension since he was an important part of the team.

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

Jae is just trying his best to get his last big paycheck before he becomes a vet min guy. He is probably only 3 years away from that. And what we would be willing to pay for a backup 4 that has been great on defense but all-off or all-on with shooting probably isn't what he wants for his last multi-year contract.

And for the record, I 100% support Jae doing what is best for him and his family, even if that means saying he won't work for the Suns anymore.

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I am not sure he was the easiest, but he was the worst starter on the team, so we just naturally looked there. I think his ability to bridge the gap between the young guys and the old-heads is under-rated.

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

You dont extend a guy in front of another guy in need of an extension. Thats just weird business.

TOO wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:52 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

You dont extend a guy in front of another guy in need of an extension. Thats just weird business.

I didn't say what order to do it in. But we shouldn't have told him: "You're not starting, you're not finishing games, and we're not going to extend you. Now go out there and be a good happy teammate."

That's completely unrealistic.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:56 pm

TOO wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:52 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

You dont extend a guy in front of another guy in need of an extension. Thats just weird business.

I didn't say what order to do it in. But we shouldn't have told him: "You're not starting, you're not finishing games, and we're not going to extend you. Now go out there and be a good happy teammate."

That's completely unrealistic.

Its also a business, Crowder knows this, dudes never been on a team more than like 2 years, he knows its Cams time with the extension looming, lets not act like Crowder is some sort of victim here. He's old, time to make way for the younger player.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

That’s a weird all-or-nothing mentality. If we know we want to upgrade him, you don’t extend him. His contract is much easier to move as an expiring.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:56 pm

TOO wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:52 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

You dont extend a guy in front of another guy in need of an extension. Thats just weird business.

I didn't say what order to do it in. But we shouldn't have told him: "You're not starting, you're not finishing games, and we're not going to extend you. Now go out there and be a good happy teammate."

That's completely unrealistic.

Lots of assumptions there. It very well could have been Crowder coming to us and asking to extend and we said we wanted to see how the season unfolded. Certainly a possibility as that was the same thing we did with Ayton. We don’t know that he was told he wasn’t starting or finishing games. It’s also possible we were willing to extend him, just not at the price he wants.

I think it’s very possible he said I want 3 years 40 million, or something north of the MLE and we said no. He knows if he goes to free agency that the MLE is the most he’s getting. If he gets traded before free agency, his new team might extend him for more than the MLE.

If he wanted an extension in the 12 million a year range, I think not extending is the right call.

Indy wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:42 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I am not sure he was the easiest, but he was the worst starter on the team, so we just naturally looked there. I think his ability to bridge the gap between the young guys and the old-heads is under-rated.

FTFY

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 2:12 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:56 pm

TOO wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:52 pm

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:47 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 1:39 pm

Unless what pissed him off was trying to upgrade him and replace him. He’s better than nothing obviously and we could use him right now, but I think almost all of us agreed he was the easiest rotation guy to upgrade.

I would have had no problem upgrading him. But since we didn't, we should have extended him.

You dont extend a guy in front of another guy in need of an extension. Thats just weird business.

I didn't say what order to do it in. But we shouldn't have told him: "You're not starting, you're not finishing games, and we're not going to extend you. Now go out there and be a good happy teammate."

That's completely unrealistic.

Lots of assumptions there. It very well could have been Crowder coming to us and asking to extend and we said we wanted to see how the season unfolded. Certainly a possibility as that was the same thing we did with Ayton. We don’t know that he was told he wasn’t starting or finishing games. It’s also possible we were willing to extend him, just not at the price he wants.

I think it’s very possible he said I want 3 years 40 million, or something north of the MLE and we said no. He knows if he goes to free agency that the MLE is the most he’s getting. If he gets traded before free agency, his new team might extend him for more than the MLE.

If he wanted an extension in the 12 million a year range, I think not extending is the right call.

I'm not making assumptions, I'm going off of what has been reported.

Shabazz wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 12, 2022 10:15 pm

INFORMER wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 12, 2022 8:40 pm

This was the most interesting (yet obvious) thing from the Yahoo article:

All this has left rival executives questioning why Phoenix barred Crowder from the team in the first place? Was he really that much of a malcontent? It’s considered a cardinal rule that when teams declare their design to trade a player, it intrinsically lowers his value.

“I thought the way Phoenix played the situation was strange,” one Western Conference executive told Yahoo Sports. “You’re not a super deep team. You’re a contender. Doesn’t it seem like there’s some other way to resolve this other than him sitting out and hurting your depth?”

“For Jae to hold out is pretty rare. It’s pretty extreme,” one Eastern Conference executive said. “It’s really interesting they didn’t just play hardball with him.”

This seemed more driven by Jae. He’s clearly been a malcontent all summer.

I think the point of the league executives is to wonder out loud whether there was a better way to respond to Jae's malcontent act.

Yeah, other "league executives" would love to get a good player for a bag of beans, so no wonder they'd wonder out loud to the media.

I don't think their comments do anything to impact trade value. It's honestly just common sense questioning.

The Suns are doing just fine shooting themselves in the foot when it was to this situation.

Of course they have their eye on his trade value. It's their job be on this stuff. Didn't expect the naivete from you.

I agree that this situation isn't ideal, but I also don't think Jones should give Crowder away just to resolve the situation as soon as possible.

I'm expecting Crowder to be at home until the new year when there's more stuff available on the market at this point. There's a good chance he's moved for very little to a team who wants to cut salary and will buy him out. But there's zero incentive for the Suns to make that kind of move right now.

Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 13, 2022 4:47 pm

Of course they have their eye on his trade value. It's their job be on this stuff. Didn't expect the naivete from you.

I just don't think they are reasoning, "Ooo, let me give this quote to the media...that will drive his trade value down."

Again, Jae sitting at home is enough of a bargaining chip in trade negotiations for rival GMs. Wondering why the Suns aren't playing hardball with Crowder, or why they let it get this far, isn't going to move the needle.

I get that you don't really want to extend Crowder if you are going to sign Cam Johnson to a chunky deal soon and start him. But I am not really sure Cam is ready yet. He kind of disappears in games. Jae is such a fighter, he brings a toughness and a defensive mindset and an F-You edge that the team is really missing otherwise. I think he has been a great Sun. I honestly think we wouldn't have come back to beat the Lakers in the '21 first round without him. Cam Johnson has the brighter future but he's a finesse guy, quieter, not nearly as tough or strong or defensive. I worry that we'll lose something without Jae here. Our only real veteran warrior now will be Chris Paul, and he's not exactly the toughest guy around.

I really hope they can get a playable backup guard for Crowder.

Not really sure what else CamJ needs to do…He needs to start at this point. Ya Crowder is going to always give you the toughness and defense, but his shot would completely disappear at times. Cam shot 43% from 3 last year. His per-36 splits were 17/6/2. We need to see how he holds up in the 1st unit. Especially if we are going to give him a big extension.

The real ideal situation was to move Cam into the starting lineup and to have Crowder off the bench as backup. Someone we could use more with bigger front lines and bulkier wings. Crowder took offense to that. I don’t necessarily blame him for not wanting to take a step back, but I think that’s where his value is now. He can be a starter on a team with 3 stars, but on most teams I think he’s a backup now. I’m curious if Atlanta would even start him if they acquired him.