Phx-Suns.Net

In2ition wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 2:37 pm

specialsauce wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 2:24 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 2:12 pm

How did you not like Barbosa?

The person can be great yet a lousy player.

He had a very lowIQ for the game and we were asking him to be the backup PG. His fastbreak head down turnovers were ridiculous

When Dragic came along and he slid to the 2 spot, he was much better when he didn’t have to make decisions.

I hated the wild layups where he ended up on the floor under the basket. The Spurs figured it out pretty quickly, and whenever he made one of those, they purposefully pushed the ball quickly to a wide open corner three, that they never seemed to miss. Unfortunately, the Suns never figured out the Spurs were doing this on purpose as a scouted tactic.

Bingo bango bongo

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 1:52 pm

Only about a month till training camp guys.

And about 2 months to get this thread to 200 pages! Hop to it boys!

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/lates ... r-the-suns

Looks like chuck is on the same page as the majority of us….

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 5:35 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 1:52 pm

Only about a month till training camp guys.

And about 2 months to get this thread to 200 pages! Hop to it boys!

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/lates ... r-the-suns

Looks like chuck is on the same page as the majority of us….

What’s all this about getting DA “back” to All-Star level?

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:48 am

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

Good call…. He could also help him with porn star management

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:52 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:48 am

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

Good call…. He could also help him with porn star management

Haha, he is an expert on that.

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 5:35 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 1:52 pm

Only about a month till training camp guys.

And about 2 months to get this thread to 200 pages! Hop to it boys!

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/lates ... r-the-suns

Looks like chuck is on the same page as the majority of us….

The most important piece? That people wanted to trade for a couple of mediocre wings?

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:48 am

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

It's almost impossible to be named an All-Star as just a dirt worker. Even Rodman--perhaps the most elite dirt worker of all time--only had 2 All-Star selections in his career.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 9:38 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:48 am

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

It's almost impossible to be named an All-Star as just a dirt worker. Even Rodman--perhaps the most elite dirt worker of all time--only had 2 All-Star selections in his career.

It's true, but at this rate, this would be a better avenue for Deandre to make the All-Star game than his current road he's taking, no?

Everyone widely considered Rodman to be probably the best defender and rebounder in the league, right? We can agree on that, correct?

I've said long ago that Ayton should aspire to have a career and role like Robert Parish had too. If he does that, he will win titles and go to the multiple All-Star games. And Parish's All-Star appearances didn't start until he was 27 yrs old.

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 9:48 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 9:38 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:48 am

Kryptonic wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:44 am

Gotta be an all star first before you can get back to it…. Chucks emphasis on ayton needing to be the dirt worker is more or less what the majority of us want from him and would be happy with is more or less what I was referring to.

Maybe they should ask Rodman to come in and mentor him on the finer skills of being an All-Star level role player and dirt worker.

It's almost impossible to be named an All-Star as just a dirt worker. Even Rodman--perhaps the most elite dirt worker of all time--only had 2 All-Star selections in his career.

It's true, but at this rate, this would be a better avenue for Deandre to make the All-Star game than his current road he's taking, no?

Everyone widely considered Rodman to be probably the best defender and rebounder in the league, right? We can agree on that, correct?

He was an elite defender in the early years of his career (DPOY twice). But the DPOY awards came before his rebounding prowess.

Only 5 times has the top rebounder won DPOY in the same season: 3 years in a row from 2000-03 (Mutombo, Wallace, Wallace), and Howard two years in a row (2008-10).

One of those 5 times, the player still was not named an All-Star (Ben Wallace in 2001-02). And Dwight Howard averaged 18-21 ppg his years.

Rodman and Wallace are probably the two best examples of true non-scoring "dirt worker" All-Stars. But I feel like it would be more difficult today. I agree that adding elite rebounding and defense would help get Ayton an All-Star nod, but he would probably still need the double-digit scoring as well (which I'm sure he'll have).

Rudy made multiple all stars as an almost strictly defensive player

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:28 am

Rudy made multiple all stars as an almost strictly defensive player

Yes but he also averaged 14-16 ppg.

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:02 am

I've said long ago that Ayton should aspire to have a career and role like Robert Parish had too. If he does that, he will win titles and go to the multiple All-Star games. And Parish's All-Star appearances didn't start until he was 27 yrs old.

If you want him to play like Parish, then it's not about the rebounding.

Parish's rpg in his All-Star seasons: 9.5, 10.8, 10.6, 10.7, 10.6, 9.5, 10.6, 10.1, 10.6

Ayton's rpg in his first five seasons: 10.3, 11.5, 10.5, 10.2, 10.0

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:34 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:02 am

I've said long ago that Ayton should aspire to have a career and role like Robert Parish had too. If he does that, he will win titles and go to the multiple All-Star games. And Parish's All-Star appearances didn't start until he was 27 yrs old.

If you want him to play like Parish, then it's not about the rebounding.

Parish's rpg in his All-Star seasons: 9.5, 10.8, 10.6, 10.7, 10.6, 9.5, 10.6, 10.1, 10.6

Ayton's rpg in his first five seasons: 10.3, 11.5, 10.5, 10.2, 10.0

Are we forgetting that he played in a frontcourt with McHale and Bird? They also each averaged 8-9 rebounds per game during those years. I'm not sure how many extra boards were available.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:30 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:28 am

Rudy made multiple all stars as an almost strictly defensive player

Yes but he also averaged 14-16 ppg.

That’s not very much. Ayton will average that

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:36 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:34 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:02 am

I've said long ago that Ayton should aspire to have a career and role like Robert Parish had too. If he does that, he will win titles and go to the multiple All-Star games. And Parish's All-Star appearances didn't start until he was 27 yrs old.

If you want him to play like Parish, then it's not about the rebounding.

Parish's rpg in his All-Star seasons: 9.5, 10.8, 10.6, 10.7, 10.6, 9.5, 10.6, 10.1, 10.6

Ayton's rpg in his first five seasons: 10.3, 11.5, 10.5, 10.2, 10.0

Are we forgetting that he played in a frontcourt with McHale and Bird? They also each averaged 8-9 rebounds per game during those years. I'm not sure how many extra boards were available.

That's a fair point, but I don't know if that factors into All-Star selections.

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:41 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:30 am

Split T wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:28 am

Rudy made multiple all stars as an almost strictly defensive player

Yes but he also averaged 14-16 ppg.

That’s not very much. Ayton will average that

Agreed. I was just saying that a true "dirt worker" scoring in single digits like Ben Wallace and Dennis Rodman might have a difficult time becoming an All-Star in today's NBA.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:44 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:36 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:34 am

In2ition wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 10:02 am

I've said long ago that Ayton should aspire to have a career and role like Robert Parish had too. If he does that, he will win titles and go to the multiple All-Star games. And Parish's All-Star appearances didn't start until he was 27 yrs old.

If you want him to play like Parish, then it's not about the rebounding.

Parish's rpg in his All-Star seasons: 9.5, 10.8, 10.6, 10.7, 10.6, 9.5, 10.6, 10.1, 10.6

Ayton's rpg in his first five seasons: 10.3, 11.5, 10.5, 10.2, 10.0

Are we forgetting that he played in a frontcourt with McHale and Bird? They also each averaged 8-9 rebounds per game during those years. I'm not sure how many extra boards were available.

That's a fair point, but I don't know if that factors into All-Star selections.

Not being seen as an afterthought by most of your peers not named Jokic would help that