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Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2023 11:25 pm
by iLLmatic
specialsauce wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 10:37 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:46 pm
specialsauce wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 2:59 pm
Piano dude don’t get it either. Ain’t nobody gonna run their offense through Deandre Ayton. He’s not even the third best offensive option on that team. They’re going to operate through Scoot and Anf and Ayton will be left to set screens and look lost as usual. It’s not because Billups hates Ayton, it’s because Ayton is…….mediocre.
His contract:performance ratio is a huge mismatch
Explain why he's the top ranked Blazer in the ESPN Top 100.
If it’s in the rankings it must be true!
Enjoy the last few weeks of this debate. By January, nobody will be talking about him leaguewide in a positive or negative way. He’ll be just another overpaid role player on a low level team
I’m so damn glad he’s gone.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2023 12:37 pm
by JeremyG
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 9:57 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:39 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 3:23 pm
He’s average at rebounding.
Statistics and history do not back up that assertion.
He was 12th in the league in rebounding last year. The league has 30 teams. Meaning he’s near the middle of all starting centers. If you want to pull hairs, he’s slightly above average.
That’s one season, not his whole career.
Also, you’re conflating centers with RPG to get to 12 out of 30. He was 10th among centers.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
by Cap
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2023 8:33 pm
by In2ition
I think it was pretty clear that Nurk is a far better passer than Ayton and I didn't even need this stat to know that.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
by Split T
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 7:29 am
by MightyMoog
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 12:37 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 9:57 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:39 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 3:23 pm
He’s average at rebounding.
Statistics and history do not back up that assertion.
He was 12th in the league in rebounding last year. The league has 30 teams. Meaning he’s near the middle of all starting centers. If you want to pull hairs, he’s slightly above average.
That’s one season, not his whole career.
Also, you’re conflating centers with RPG to get to 12 out of 30. He was 10th among centers.
So you’re justifying a 2 step rise in ranks by taking out 2 players that are probably smaller than him. Even at 10th he’s average. Top 5 would be elite. Top 10 would be above average.
He’s never going to be an elite center. He needed to be top 3-4 in the west by now. Except he sits behind Jokic, AD, KAT, Sabonis and by the end of this year Wemby and Chet will leapfrog him.
He might be better than some of these guys, but he’s in the same group as Zubac, Valenciunas, Nurkic and Gobert.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:32 am
by JeremyG
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
If you include a bunch of non-centers and non-starters and people who play 10 minutes per game.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:33 am
by TOO
Cope.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:34 am
by JeremyG
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 7:29 am
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 12:37 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 9:57 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:39 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 3:23 pm
He’s average at rebounding.
Statistics and history do not back up that assertion.
He was 12th in the league in rebounding last year. The league has 30 teams. Meaning he’s near the middle of all starting centers. If you want to pull hairs, he’s slightly above average.
That’s one season, not his whole career.
Also, you’re conflating centers with RPG to get to 12 out of 30. He was 10th among centers.
So you’re justifying a 2 step rise in ranks by taking out 2 players that are probably smaller than him. Even at 10th he’s average. Top 5 would be elite. Top 10 would be above average.
He’s never going to be an elite center. He needed to be top 3-4 in the west by now. Except he sits behind Jokic, AD, KAT, Sabonis and by the end of this year Wemby and Chet will leapfrog him.
He might be better than some of these guys, but he’s in the same group as Zubac, Valenciunas, Nurkic and Gobert.
It will be fun to revisit this at the end of the season.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:37 am
by TOO
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:34 am
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 7:29 am
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 12:37 pm
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 9:57 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:39 pm
Statistics and history do not back up that assertion.
He was 12th in the league in rebounding last year. The league has 30 teams. Meaning he’s near the middle of all starting centers. If you want to pull hairs, he’s slightly above average.
That’s one season, not his whole career.
Also, you’re conflating centers with RPG to get to 12 out of 30. He was 10th among centers.
So you’re justifying a 2 step rise in ranks by taking out 2 players that are probably smaller than him. Even at 10th he’s average. Top 5 would be elite. Top 10 would be above average.
He’s never going to be an elite center. He needed to be top 3-4 in the west by now. Except he sits behind Jokic, AD, KAT, Sabonis and by the end of this year Wemby and Chet will leapfrog him.
He might be better than some of these guys, but he’s in the same group as Zubac, Valenciunas, Nurkic and Gobert.
It will be fun to revisit this at the end of the season.
It wont, hopefully this will be dead by then, just like the horse we've been beating for years.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:32 am
by Split T
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:32 am
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
If you include a bunch of non-centers and non-starters and people who play 10 minutes per game.
Ok he moves to 17 if you take out the players who didn’t play 20 minutes a game. Whether they are a C or PF is irrelevant.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:39 am
by Kryptonic
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:32 am
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:32 am
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
If you include a bunch of non-centers and non-starters and people who play 10 minutes per game.
Ok he moves to 17 if you take out the players who didn’t play 20 minutes a game. Whether they are a C or PF is irrelevant.
Now exclude anyone who’s initials aren’t DA and he’s number 1!
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:40 am
by Kryptonic
Would be hilarious if Marty or bone lock this at page 199
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:54 am
by JeremyG
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:32 am
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:32 am
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
If you include a bunch of non-centers and non-starters and people who play 10 minutes per game.
Ok he moves to 17 if you take out the players who didn’t play 20 minutes a game. Whether they are a C or PF is irrelevant.
So he was 17th out of how many players? How do you determine if that’s “average” or not? (Which was the original contention.)
Also, my original point was that you can’t just look at one season to determine if he’s an average rebounder. His TRB% was higher in his other seasons.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:57 am
by Split T
Fair, I was just responding to Cap’s request…
Ayton is an above average rebounder to me. He was good enough to be the best rebounder on an above average rebounding team. I wouldn’t call him elite though as 14 teams had guys with better rebound rates.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 10:43 am
by Superbone
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:57 am
Fair, I was just responding to Cap’s request…
Ayton is an above average rebounder to me. He was good enough to be the best rebounder on an above average rebounding team. I wouldn’t call him elite though as 14 teams had guys with better rebound rates.
The thing is, he could be so much better if he had some rebounding fundamentals. Like blocking out, for instance.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2023 11:11 am
by Cap
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:54 am
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 9:32 am
JeremyG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:32 am
Split T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 15, 2023 5:48 am
Cap wrote: ↑Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:26 pm
Anybody here have Stat Hound? Where did DA fall on the TRB% leader board?
I know it wasn’t Top 10 (or particularly close). Zubac was 10th at 19.51. Ayton was 18.1.
20th
If you include a bunch of non-centers and non-starters and people who play 10 minutes per game.
Ok he moves to 17 if you take out the players who didn’t play 20 minutes a game. Whether they are a C or PF is irrelevant.
So he was 17th out of how many players? How do you determine if that’s “average” or not? (Which was the original contention.)
Also, my original point was that you can’t just look at one season to determine if he’s an average rebounder. His TRB% was higher in his other seasons.
Wanna go back a few years?
Ayton: 18.5, 19.6, 19.5, 18.6, 18.1
Nurkić: 20.2, 16.9*, 20.2, 21.5, 19.5
* Eight games
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2023 4:03 am
by MightyMoog
Anyone else excited for the Ayton revenge game?
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:05 am
by Kryptonic
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 4:03 am
Anyone else excited for the Ayton revenge game?
in his own head it will be.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2023 8:39 am
by Shabazz
MightyMoog wrote: ↑Mon Oct 16, 2023 4:03 am
Anyone else excited for the Ayton revenge game?
This is the “revenge game for the revenge game.”
