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Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 5:40 pm
by Superbone
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 5:09 pm
Of course what I *really* want is for us to find a way to reacquire my true love, Rubaeo, next year. He still has lots of good years left in him!
It's time for you to start thinking about he team and not yourself, Marty!
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:06 pm
by Split T
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 5:09 pm
My initial reaction to that proposed trade is negative; it feels like a lot to give up all of Ayton, CamJ, Crowder, and a future 1st. I like Siakam, but are we really any better after that trade? But I guess I'm undervaluing Trent Jr as the other return on the deal. He doesn't really pass or run an offense, but maybe we would rely more on Book and Siakam to do that? And CP3's corpse for a year or so?
Crowder and a future 1st are hardly anything. Ayton on a max deal is debatable whether he has much value. CamJ has some value but he is also looking to get paid.
It really isn’t much at all. But that comes down to how you view Ayton. If Ayton is still a potential superstar, then I guess it’s a lot.
Still think you’re underrating Siakam here. He’s a legit top 15 guy in the league right now. He’s far and away the best player in the deal. Trent is expensive, but he helps make up for losing CamJ’s shooting and Cam will probably cost the same next year. Cam is better, but the upgrade in giving Booker a legit #2 is a no brainer for me.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:17 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
My hope is that the Suns make moves that eventually gets to point-Booker in their best lineup. I didn't like the idea 4 years ago, but I've seen enough from him to feel comfortable with him being the primary guard ball handler. I'd like to pair him with a scoring/shooting wing. They can be the 2 or 3, I don't really care because Bridges will ideally fill the other spot.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:26 pm
by Split T
Ya I think Booker at the 1 is my ultimate plan too. Then put a ton of shooting and at least 1 other big playmaker.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:29 pm
by ShelC
Same. It might be easier to find a shooter/scorer than a high level point guard.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:36 pm
by TOO
The guy that struggles with traps and pressure when the game is on the line is who you want at PG? Welp.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:40 pm
by Aztec Sunsfan
Ayton is 24 years old, so he fits perfectly into Scottie Barnes timeline like a glove for the Raptors, wonder how many offers can give them a Big man like Ayton at that age? Even if you consider Siakam a far better player, all the reason behind him being shopped is about the Raptors conceding and pivoting to build around Barnes. Assuming ”better offers”… let’s say somehow Toronto could get KD, the age disparity would continue to be a major problem, Barnes neediing time to reach his prime but KD needing a seasoned partner rigth now.
Ayton for Siakam would be perfect fit for both sides, they should just swap them and keep the rest to continue reshaping their rosters.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:42 pm
by Split T
TOO wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:36 pm
The guy that struggles with traps and pressure when the game is on the line is who you want at PG? Welp.
Well I’d want a 2nd ball handler still. Also Book has actually done well against doubles this year according to the numbers. But just imagine Siakam being the guy Booker passes to on a trap instead of Mikal or Ayton or Jae. Kinda drastically changes things.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:46 pm
by ShelC
Aztec Sunsfan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:40 pm
Ayton is 24 years old, so he fits perfectly into Scottie Barnes timeline like a glove for the Raptors, wonder how many offers can give them a Big man like Ayton at that age? Even if you consider Siakam a far better player, all the reason behind him being shopped is about the Raptors conceding and pivoting to build around Barnes. Assuming ”better offers”… let’s say somehow Toronto could get KD, the age disparity would continue to be a major problem, Barnes neediing time to reach his prime but KD needing a seasoned partner rigth now.
Ayton for Siakam would be perfect fit for both sides, they should just swap them and keep the rest to continue reshaping their rosters.
Does the defense drop off too much without DA anchoring? Can we get away with Londale/Biz at the 5 if we have Siakam at the 4? Or are we swapping one problem for a different one?
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:47 pm
by Split T
Aztec Sunsfan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:40 pm
Ayton is 24 years old, so he fits perfectly into Scottie Barnes timeline like a glove for the Raptors, wonder how many offers can give them a Big man like Ayton at that age? Even if you consider Siakam a far better player, all the reason behind him being shopped is about the Raptors conceding and pivoting to build around Barnes. Assuming ”better offers”… let’s say somehow Toronto could get KD, the age disparity would continue to be a major problem, Barnes neediing time to reach his prime but KD needing a seasoned partner rigth now.
Ayton for Siakam would be perfect fit for both sides, they should just swap them and keep the rest to continue reshaping their rosters.
I think GS would be a fascinating Siakam spot. Would Toronto rather have Ayton/CamJ or Wiseman/Kuminga/Moody?
The warriors would have to figure out how to make the salaries work though.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:48 pm
by Split T
ShelC wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:46 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:40 pm
Ayton is 24 years old, so he fits perfectly into Scottie Barnes timeline like a glove for the Raptors, wonder how many offers can give them a Big man like Ayton at that age? Even if you consider Siakam a far better player, all the reason behind him being shopped is about the Raptors conceding and pivoting to build around Barnes. Assuming ”better offers”… let’s say somehow Toronto could get KD, the age disparity would continue to be a major problem, Barnes neediing time to reach his prime but KD needing a seasoned partner rigth now.
Ayton for Siakam would be perfect fit for both sides, they should just swap them and keep the rest to continue reshaping their rosters.
Does the defense drop off too much without DA anchoring? Can we get away with Londale/Biz at the 5 if we have Siakam at the 4? Or are we swapping one problem for a different one?
Our defense is awful this year anyways with Ayton on the court. We’ve been much better with Biyombo
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 7:27 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:42 pm
TOO wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:36 pm
The guy that struggles with traps and pressure when the game is on the line is who you want at PG? Welp.
Well I’d want a 2nd ball handler still. Also Book has actually done well against doubles this year according to the numbers. But just imagine Siakam being the guy Booker passes to on a trap instead of Mikal or Ayton or Jae. Kinda drastically changes things.
Exactly. I didn't want to get too far into rosterbating, but the assumption is there's another ball handler to replace Paul because having just one on the court is a terrible idea.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 7:35 pm
by Aztec Sunsfan
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:47 pm
Aztec Sunsfan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:40 pm
Ayton is 24 years old, so he fits perfectly into Scottie Barnes timeline like a glove for the Raptors, wonder how many offers can give them a Big man like Ayton at that age? Even if you consider Siakam a far better player, all the reason behind him being shopped is about the Raptors conceding and pivoting to build around Barnes. Assuming ”better offers”… let’s say somehow Toronto could get KD, the age disparity would continue to be a major problem, Barnes neediing time to reach his prime but KD needing a seasoned partner rigth now.
Ayton for Siakam would be perfect fit for both sides, they should just swap them and keep the rest to continue reshaping their rosters.
I think GS would be a fascinating Siakam spot. Would Toronto rather have Ayton/CamJ or Wiseman/Kuminga/Moody?
The warriors would have to figure out how to make the salaries work though.
Ayton is a playoff tested and productive player, and while consistency is not a adjective for him, he is “consistent”next to those three, but on top of all of this, he is no longer a development player.
And Ayton at the max won’t be so awful on Toronto as long as Barnes is still on a rookie scale.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:25 am
by Wally_West
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:18 am
by INFORMER
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 2:55 pm
I’d see this as a move for next year. You’d have Booker/Bridges/Siakam at the 2-4 and can build the rest of the roster around that.
Except you would barely have any resources left to build with.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:20 am
by INFORMER
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 2:55 pm
Also Trent is shooting 36% from 3 and is a career 38% shooter.
Wally_West wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 3:09 pm
Trent also averaging 18pts and legit guy who can get his own points. Him with Booker, Siakim and Bridges, he’d be fucking deadly.
Trent isn't very good. He gives you a lot of high volume, poor shooting performances that ultimately outweigh the few nights when he is "on." He isn't a plus acquisition, and Toronto was dumb to move Norman Powell for him.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:24 am
by INFORMER
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:06 pm
Still think you’re underrating Siakam here. He’s a legit top 15 guy in the league right now.
I like Siakim, but I don't have a desire to trade the farm for him. It's a zero-sum proposition.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:27 am
by INFORMER
Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:17 pm
My hope is that the Suns make moves that eventually gets to point-Booker in their best lineup.
ShelC wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:29 pm
Same. It might be easier to find a shooter/scorer than a high level point guard.
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:26 pm
Ya I think Booker at the 1 is my ultimate plan too. Then put a ton of shooting and at least 1 other big playmaker.
I can't believe so many of you want this. I have no desire to return to Point Book. That takes us backward, not forward.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:05 pm
by Split T
INFORMER wrote: ↑Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:18 am
Split T wrote: ↑Thu Jan 05, 2023 2:55 pm
I’d see this as a move for next year. You’d have Booker/Bridges/Siakam at the 2-4 and can build the rest of the roster around that.
Except you would barely have any resources left to build with.
You’d have Booker/Trent/Bridges/Siakam
You’d have the TPMLE to go get a C…also depends on how many picks you gave up in the trade. CP3 would also still be here for a year and you could potentially use his salary to bring in more players tomorrow.
Re: Suns News: Week 12 (1/2 - 1/8)
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:08 pm
by ShelC
Ideally it'd be Book sharing ballhandling duties with another guard that can handle and run some offense but also score and shoot. We looked good with him and Payne, but maybe someone with more size and consistency. I wouldn't put him in a backcourt with a pure SG that can't do anything but score or a 3-D SG like Okogie where Book is 100% PG.