Phx-Suns.Net

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:32 pm

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:22 pm

Beal over Book??? Wat

re-tool with Beal and KD???


wtf is being said here????? I know we down bad but come on. Especially Beal talk, he hasn’t done shit to earn any type of benefit of doubt. Dude is all talk, last year talking about how he’s never been sweep in his entire life then preceded to have the biggest disaster class game of the whole series. I don’t hate him or nothing, but he hasn’t done anything here that will make think fondly of his time as a sun. It didn’t work, it sucks, it is what it is. I’ll be happy when he’s gone.

It’s not really about Beal…we have to attach assets to him to get off his contract. That alone makes using him to upgrade a problem. You wouldn’t need to do that with Booker. I think Beal would be better if you separated him from Booker…they don’t fit together, not if you also want Tyus Jones to play.

Personally I’d blow the whole thing up…but if you want to absolutely maximize this year and next…I can see an argument for moving Book…of course this is in a video game world. I said as much in the beginning that I wouldn’t actually do it…you’d have to deal with too many other consequences, including KD certainly asking out in the very near future.

I hope we can convince someone to take Beal, but I just don’t see it making enough of a difference to justify mortgaging any more of the future.

For the record, I would absolutely move Beal and 31 for Jimmy…I just don’t see Miami doing it or us finding a 3rd team to pull it off.

We’ll probably end up with something like Vucevic and Lonzo Ball while also having to trade away 2031…that isn’t worth it to me.

Hell no. You keep forgetting that you barely get 50 - 60% of the games where Beal is able to play. How hard is that to understand? Regardless of whether Book is somehow making Beal play worse by existing on the court with him, you move Book and then you have fragile glass man playing sometimes and going from a Big 2 scenario to KD and secondary players most nights while Beal sits out games due to various ailments. No.

Booker never stays healthy, either, though.

I don’t keep forgetting. I’ve said it multiple times that the availability with Beal is a problem. You aren’t able to separate the on-court play from his availability …that’s fine, but it’s what I’m doing.

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:49 am

Cap wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:24 am

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:54 am

I ain’t mad at jimmy, dude just wants to play here. I respect it.

I’m not going back to look, but I’m pretty sure that’s not what you said when Bledsoe did it.

But when Dragic did it, a lot of people were on his side

Tie breaker, Robert Horry. Which is probably the closest analogy.

Nah, the problem with all of the analogies is they occurred when they were on our team. Butler is doing it to get to our team…what about KD? Butler is going further than KD did, but KD forced his way here. That’s the closest analogy and I don’t think we had a problem with it.

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:48 pm

Nah, the problem with all of the analogies is they occurred when they were on our team. Butler is doing it to get to our team…what about KD? Butler is going further than KD did, but KD forced his way here. That’s the closest analogy and I don’t think we had a problem with it.

I feels very different when it helps your team versus hurts your team, but it’s the same behavior. If you’re looking for positive examples of masculinity, this kind of behavior isn’t it. A “man” doesn’t turn on his team like that. A man mans up.

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:32 pm

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:22 pm

Beal over Book??? Wat

re-tool with Beal and KD???


wtf is being said here????? I know we down bad but come on. Especially Beal talk, he hasn’t done shit to earn any type of benefit of doubt. Dude is all talk, last year talking about how he’s never been sweep in his entire life then preceded to have the biggest disaster class game of the whole series. I don’t hate him or nothing, but he hasn’t done anything here that will make think fondly of his time as a sun. It didn’t work, it sucks, it is what it is. I’ll be happy when he’s gone.

It’s not really about Beal…we have to attach assets to him to get off his contract. That alone makes using him to upgrade a problem. You wouldn’t need to do that with Booker. I think Beal would be better if you separated him from Booker…they don’t fit together, not if you also want Tyus Jones to play.

Personally I’d blow the whole thing up…but if you want to absolutely maximize this year and next…I can see an argument for moving Book…of course this is in a video game world. I said as much in the beginning that I wouldn’t actually do it…you’d have to deal with too many other consequences, including KD certainly asking out in the very near future.

I hope we can convince someone to take Beal, but I just don’t see it making enough of a difference to justify mortgaging any more of the future.

For the record, I would absolutely move Beal and 31 for Jimmy…I just don’t see Miami doing it or us finding a 3rd team to pull it off.

We’ll probably end up with something like Vucevic and Lonzo Ball while also having to trade away 2031…that isn’t worth it to me.

31 will suck losing, Gambo seemed to imply we ain’t giving that up even to unload Beal, so we’ll see. Any Beal trade will probably be bottom of the barrel stuff so we ain’t giving up more than 2nds but even so, I still think most of these Beal trades make us better.
I think any package for Beal is making us a better team for the most part. Even something silly like THJ and Tobias Harris makes us better. We can probably flip THJ for a mid center cuz he’s an expiring contract, and Harris would probably do great as a back up to KD plus he’s an expiring next year. Getting off of Beal is priority now since his benching.

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 1:48 pm

Milwaukee is a 2nd apron team. No way they can trade for Jimmy unless it’s Dame or Giannis. Memphis was always an interesting team for Jimmy.

Milwaukee actually can as long as they drop below the 2nd apron…so they’d need a 3rd team like Detroit to take on salary.

Lopez/THJ/Connaughton to Miami

Middleton to Detroit

Jimmy, Richardson, Larsson to Milwaukee works

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:02 pm

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 1:48 pm

Milwaukee is a 2nd apron team. No way they can trade for Jimmy unless it’s Dame or Giannis. Memphis was always an interesting team for Jimmy.

Milwaukee actually can as long as they drop below the 2nd apron…so they’d need a 3rd team like Detroit to take on salary.

Lopez/THJ/Connaughton to Miami

Middleton to Detroit

Jimmy, Richardson, Larsson to Milwaukee works

Is there way for us to sneak in Beal to Detroit and get Middleton and Portis to us? Haha

Perhaps…would be interesting

This works on Spotrac lol


Pistons: Beal, Delon Wright

Heat: Lopez, Pat Connaughton, THJ

Bucks: Tobias Harris, Jimmy Butler

Suns: Middleton, Portis

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:11 pm

Perhaps…would be interesting

HIMPOSSIBLE

No thank you to that. Khris is washed and Bobby plays no D.

Just give them Beal and every second rounder we own. Done.

My 2c on Beal: I don't think he sucks as a player. Watching him last/this year, he actually does several things better than Booker. He's a better defender; he's had multiple great come-from-behind blocks and some nice deflections and steals; he's just bulkier and bigger than Booker and can hold his position better. He's much better and more inclined to try to take charges than Book. He also seems to give a more consistent defensive effort than Book and doesn't give up on the play as often. I appreciate that. Offensively IMO he has slightly better handles than Book and can execute a better herky-jerky dribble to get a shot. His actual shooting and scoring aren't as good as Book's, but Beal doesn't seem to get doubled and overwhelmed and lose the ball as badly as Booker seems to do. Whether that's because Beal doesn't get those double-teams thrown at him is a different question, but still, I notice it.

But the two big issues that sour me on Beal are (1) the bad fit next to Booker, since they are both prototypical SGs and you don't need two of those on the court at the same time; and (2) the brittleness and frequent nagging injuries. I don't think Beal is a weak player or lacks toughness or whatever euphemism you want to use. I believe he genuinely wants to play and isn't wilting at the first sign of pain. I just think his body has taken a lot of pounding and mileage and that he is easily injured these days. And I also think he sometimes makes foolish plays where he splays out his body or dives or moves in such a way that makes him more likely to collide with another player or take a hard foul or fall awkwardly, often triggering one of those nagging injuries. I wish he would learn to play like a 30+ year old and protect his body more. That might reduce his explosiveness some, but it would keep him available and prolong his career. (KD has exactly this same problem, fwiw.)

You add up Beal's pros and cons, and he's a nice player but absolutely not worth close to $50m/year and certainly not on this roster/team. If he could curb the injuries I honestly wouldn't mind considering shipping out Booker, just because Book would net such a colossal haul that we could basically stay talented while also having a treasure trove of assets to improve. But Beal can't stay healthy, so that's a horrible idea. And you don't just discard your soon-to-be franchise leading scorer and face of the team like that.

Cap wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:56 pm

Split T wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 2:48 pm

Nah, the problem with all of the analogies is they occurred when they were on our team. Butler is doing it to get to our team…what about KD? Butler is going further than KD did, but KD forced his way here. That’s the closest analogy and I don’t think we had a problem with it.

I feels very different when it helps your team versus hurts your team, but it’s the same behavior. If you’re looking for positive examples of masculinity, this kind of behavior isn’t it. A “man” doesn’t turn on his team like that. A man mans up.

When his owner treats him like a slave and tells him to shut his mouth to the media, I completely understand what he's doing. I commend him for not doing this sooner actually.

As split said.

It was interesting that Beal played our last game. Didn't fit the pattern. Looked like he may have played even though not 100%. I wonder if that was related to him getting word they might move him to the second team.

I've said for the past 16 months that Beal shouldn't start if the Suns are also starting a Point Guard. Nurkic vacillating between viable and absolute dog shit from night to night only made that more obvious.

If Beal can't comprehend this situation, there's no hope -- his basketball ego is untenable on this roster.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:45 pm

And you don't just discard your soon-to-be franchise leading scorer and face of the team like that.

But if we’re going to discard him, wouldn’t now be the best time, before he becomes the franchise’s leading scorer?