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In2ition wrote:I feel like we hear this from specialsauce every year when it comes to Euro bigs. Bender actually might end up being the best player in this draft. He's 7'1" and shoots better than Porzingis, runs the floor, passes almost as well as Simmons, rebounds and has a great motor. Bender isn't a knee jerk reaction, he's actually been thought of as a better prospect for longer than Porzingis.

1. He's not a great shooter.

2. He's not a great rebounder.

3. He barely plays in a shitty league. Your 1 anecdote of a friend who you inevitably have biased towards does not a standard make. Anecdotal evidence = least validity.

All he has going for him is that he's tall, fast and young. There's not a single skill that he's above average. Porzingis was a good shooter abroad and played plenty of minutes in a competitive league. I was a hater admittedly and I have underlying skepticism when it comes to using a top 5 pick on all Euro big men prospects, but this is next level bogus here.

OE32 wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

OE32 wrote:I like the video I've watched from him. And FWIW, he killed Sabonis (at least on the stat sheet) when they played U18. I strongly suspect that he's McD's choice at 3/4/5.

Too bad we'll pick at 7 because the basketball gods are jerks.

Or maybe they're just more responsive to positive energy.

Seriously, attitudes couldn't be much worse around here, and I don't really see the reason for it, as long as you're not subjecting yourself to the second halves of our games (because at least in the first half there's still a chance to see Len or Booker go for 30). FWIW, I ranked the teams by their future pick rights a few nights back. Boston #1, Suns #2, Philly #3. Philly's swap rights with SAC are nearly worthless. The future is by empirical standards quite bright in Phoenix when you take into account the young talent on the roster and the other moveable assets.

Surprisingly, Brooklyn wasn't dead last. Bottom three were #28 Lakers; #29 Brooklyn; #30 Miami. That's because while Boston can swap with Brooklyn in '17, Brooklyn still gets a pick that year. Meanwhile, Miami's down 3 picks through 2021. Dismal. At least they have Winslow and (maybe) Whiteside.

My attitude is poor because we've invested heavily in a shitty redundant backcourt and wasted 52m on a C we didnt need. Get rid of that and I'll be farting rainbows in no time. Sure we have a bright future, but it will only come once McD learns how to properly construct a roster. I'm not getting my hopes up.

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

OE32 wrote:

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:

OE32 wrote:I like the video I've watched from him. And FWIW, he killed Sabonis (at least on the stat sheet) when they played U18. I strongly suspect that he's McD's choice at 3/4/5.

Too bad we'll pick at 7 because the basketball gods are jerks.

Or maybe they're just more responsive to positive energy.

Seriously, attitudes couldn't be much worse around here, and I don't really see the reason for it, as long as you're not subjecting yourself to the second halves of our games (because at least in the first half there's still a chance to see Len or Booker go for 30). FWIW, I ranked the teams by their future pick rights a few nights back. Boston #1, Suns #2, Philly #3. Philly's swap rights with SAC are nearly worthless. The future is by empirical standards quite bright in Phoenix when you take into account the young talent on the roster and the other moveable assets.

Surprisingly, Brooklyn wasn't dead last. Bottom three were #28 Lakers; #29 Brooklyn; #30 Miami. That's because while Boston can swap with Brooklyn in '17, Brooklyn still gets a pick that year. Meanwhile, Miami's down 3 picks through 2021. Dismal. At least they have Winslow and (maybe) Whiteside.

My attitude is poor because we've invested heavily in a shitty redundant backcourt and wasted 52m on a C we didnt need. Get rid of that and I'll be farting rainbows in no time. Sure we have a bright future, but it will only come once McD learns how to properly construct a roster. I'm not getting my hopes up.

Thank you

What I care about is, do these players have value in trade?

In my mind, we began our rebuild with the drafting of Len. The picks from that point on form our core. Everything else is just assets to help build that core. Knight was a shitty deal. But the rest? I think not. Bled has value, Chandler has value, and even Knight, whom we have all grown to dislike, has value. The only way my mood will sour is if our core implodes - Len, Warren, Booker, and TBD. That's been my perspective from before McD was hired, and it hasn't changed. Everyone else is just a means to an end.

Edit: I also won't like it if we trade valuable future assets for win-now pieces, unless it advances our interests with respect to drawing free agents. Speaking of - criticizing FA signings? Pssh. It's all about whether the player has value in trade. When you're rebuilding, free agents are just that - free! The Cleveland pick, for instance, was free. Whatever we get for Chandler will have cost us nothing. It's more complicated than that, but that's the essence of it. I know there's opportunity cost, but it's not like we were going to get KD in here this summer in just about any scenario. Whatevs. This is me: Also me: And here's you guys:

OE32 wrote:The only way my mood will sour is if our core implodes - Len, Warren, Booker, and TBD. That's been my perspective from before McD was hired, and it hasn't changed. Everyone else is just a means to an end.

The players feel that way too which is a large part of the problem.

carey wrote:

OE32 wrote:The only way my mood will sour is if our core implodes - Len, Warren, Booker, and TBD. That's been my perspective from before McD was hired, and it hasn't changed. Everyone else is just a means to an end.

The players feel that way too which is a large part of the problem.

That is a fair point. But business is business. WCYD.

specialsauce wrote:

In2ition wrote:I feel like we hear this from specialsauce every year when it comes to Euro bigs. Bender actually might end up being the best player in this draft. He's 7'1" and shoots better than Porzingis, runs the floor, passes almost as well as Simmons, rebounds and has a great motor. Bender isn't a knee jerk reaction, he's actually been thought of as a better prospect for longer than Porzingis.

1. He's not a great shooter.

2. He's not a great rebounder.

3. He barely plays in a shitty league. Your 1 anecdote of a friend who you inevitably have biased towards does not a standard make. Anecdotal evidence = least validity.

All he has going for him is that he's tall, fast and young. There's not a single skill that he's above average. Porzingis was a good shooter abroad and played plenty of minutes in a competitive league. I was a hater admittedly and I have underlying skepticism when it comes to using a top 5 pick on all Euro big men prospects, but this is next level bogus here.

You could be right, he probably has the lowest floor of any of the lottery prospects. What I've seen and what I've read about him, makes him intriguing. As far as the Euro player I know, sure, but that's not the first, second, or upteenth time we've heard about sporadic minutes for unknown reasons.

It's very common for young European players to spend their 18 and 19-year old seasons riding the pine. The playing system is more of a meritocracy that's based on past performance and seniority, not current skill level.

In the year they were drafted,the Gasol Bros and Porzingis all averaged +20 mpg. Bender is averaging 8.6 mpg.

specialsauce wrote:In the year they were drafted,the Gasol Bros and Porzingis all averaged +20 mpg. Bender is averaging 8.6 mpg.

I think both Gasol brothers were over 21 when drafted.

Yep. Pau was drafted in 2001, born in 1980. Marc born 1985, drafted in 2007, playing since 08/09.

Nova is routing Miami but the McClellan Kid from Miami has my attention. Little older, but really can attack the basket. He's DX's 53rd ranked prospect.

BTW every kid from Kentucky declared for the draft. Smart move by Calipari. Takes advantage of the rules. They're allowed to declare and withdraw up to 3 times and can do the combine to get a better sense of where their at before they decide to leave their name in.

I want Buddy Hield. The kid is an alpha and has the ability to change the trajectory of the franchise. Bledsoe and Knight be dammed, get rid of their asses and let Hield run the show if they can't handle it.

If Hield can guard the 1 (and I think he can guard most), then a Hield/Booker backcourt makes sense. If he's BPA, I wouldn't put it past McD. If we want a PF, we can grab him at 13/14. With Sabonis, Rabb, Ellenson, Chriss, Davis all in, you can expect at least one of them to be there.

INF - would you be a dear and rank these guys for us?

There more I watch Brandon Ingram the More I like him. He's a better all around player then he's showing tonight, I just see alot of potential here and he's a TWO WAY PLAYER! Who knew Duke produced them!

This draft Has a Steep drop after 1-2. A convo I was having the other day was comparing Ingram to Parker. I think Ingram is a better prospect Because of his potential to play both ends of the court. Unlike Jabari and Okafor, he actually plays D.The other 2 both averaged more pts and rebounds, but Okafor couldn't, and still can't in the NBA so far, guard a chair and Jabari's rebounding hasn't translated as well to the NBA and he too his a liability on D.

Although I would point out Ingram, who averages 7Rebs a game, has done nothing on the boards tonight. He literally has zero Rebounds. That can't happen. Duke shooting like 20% from 3 can't happen either It's why Oregon is pulling away.

Sunsfan4life wrote:Although I would point out Ingram, who averages 7Rebs a game, has done nothing on the boards tonight. He literally has zero Rebounds. That can't happen. Duke shooting like 20% from 3 can't happen either It's why Oregon is pulling away.

One of Oregon's biggest strengths is rebounding. Ingram, or any single player for that matter, won't rebound well against the Ducks. It has to be a team commitment to hitting the glass, and that's not how Duke plays.

Looking like all chalk tonight. Not surprised. I think after tonight's games Nova may be favored over Kansas.

Buddy Buckets and Co. vs Oregon should be a classic. Sorry Flagrant, but I'm leaning OK.

Sunsfan4life wrote: Sorry Flagrant, but I'm leaning OK.

So has the entire country since we got a #1 seed. My feathers aren't ruffled.