Phx-Suns.Net

Phoenix Suns' 48 Wins Match NBA Record For Non-Playoff Team

"Hey, way to go! You were the best team to be worse than average!"

If they were in the east that year, they'd be the third seed.

SDC wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 26, 2019 1:23 pm

If they were in the east that year, they'd be the third seed.

If they were in China, they would’ve won the championship!

Indy wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 26, 2019 10:12 am

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 26, 2019 9:31 am

I'd like to see a list of ten current PGs who are supposedly better than Ricky Rubio.

Clearly better
Jamal Murray
Luka
Ja
Jrue
CP3
Dame
Simmons
Kemba
Lowry
Dinwiddie
Kyrie
Trae
Curry

That's a pretty good list. I'm not sure about a few of them. Is Luka a PG? Is Jamal Murray? Is Dinwiddie? If you include players like Luka, wouldn't you have to include somebody like Lebron on the list?

I don't think Lowry is clearly better than Rubio. I certainly wouldn't swap. I also wouldn't swap for Trae Young due to his ballhogging tendencies. But that's a personal preference since I don't like ball-hogging shoot-first PGs. I wouldn't swap for CP3 due to his age and contract, but I would concede that just as a pure player today he may be better.

After looking at your list, I would classify Rubio as a roughly league-average PG, though a much better than average passer and worse than average shooter. That is such a colossal upgrade from what we had at the PG spot last year, though, that I am quite grateful for his services. And his contract is quite reasonable given his value and production.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 27, 2019 11:16 am

Indy wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 26, 2019 10:12 am

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 26, 2019 9:31 am

I'd like to see a list of ten current PGs who are supposedly better than Ricky Rubio.

Clearly better
Jamal Murray
Luka
Ja
Jrue
CP3
Dame
Simmons
Kemba
Lowry
Dinwiddie
Kyrie
Trae
Curry

That's a pretty good list. I'm not sure about a few of them. Is Luka a PG? Is Jamal Murray? Is Dinwiddie? If you include players like Luka, wouldn't you have to include somebody like Lebron on the list?

I don't think Lowry is clearly better than Rubio. I certainly wouldn't swap. I also wouldn't swap for Trae Young due to his ballhogging tendencies. But that's a personal preference since I don't like ball-hogging shoot-first PGs. I wouldn't swap for CP3 due to his age and contract, but I would concede that just as a pure player today he may be better.

After looking at your list, I would classify Rubio as a roughly league-average PG, though a much better than average passer and worse than average shooter. That is such a colossal upgrade from what we had at the PG spot last year, though, that I am quite grateful for his services. And his contract is quite reasonable given his value and production.

I went by the position they are listed by NBA.com and which position they play based on the bball-ref counting of minutes per position. I think the only one that had more time at SG instead of PG was Dinwiddie, but he plays both equally well. He's played about the same amount of minutes at point as Kyrie has this year, and it averaging over 6 assists/game.

But it does sound like you see Rubio has an average PG with at least around 10 PGs in the league clearly better, and a few others that would/could be depending on perspective.

Rubio is 2nd in the league in assists. Yeah, I’d say he’s much better than average as a passer.

Yep. That is his elite skill, he is passable as a defender, and shows good leadership. But he doesn't offer anything else. I think that is why he is an average PG. But we have been running with a starting PG that wouldn't even be a backup on a good team, so Rubio is light-years ahead of where we were, so he looks better than he is to us Sans Fans.

He's also a pretty good rebounder for a point guard. Certainly not Fat Lever or Russell Westbrook, but he'll get your 4 or 5 a night.

That is a good point. He is good at that, and for the most part our team is bad at it. So that is a skill we need.

EDIT--I just looked it up, and we have outrebounded our opponents in only 13 games this season. Interesting that id hasn't made much of a difference this year.

We won the boards 13 times: 5-8

We lost the boards (or broke even): 7-14

Rubio really only has one glaring weakness - but it's a really big one. He doesn't have a reliable shot. But we knew that coming in.

The Bobster wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 4:13 pm

He's also a pretty good rebounder for a point guard. Certainly not Fat Lever or Russell Westbrook, but he'll get your 4 or 5 a night.

I saw Fat Lever and Byron Scott play in college at ASU.

Rubio's shot isn't great. But he does have nights when he hits a few 3s to keep the defense honest. His shooting isn't hopelessly bad, it's just inconsistent. I wish it were better, but if it were, he would probably be a max player and we wouldn't have gotten him.

De'Anthony Melton's been really good for the Grizz this season. Not a surprise. He could have easily been on this team instead of Carter.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:31 pm

Rubio's shot isn't great. But he does have nights when he hits a few 3s to keep the defense honest. His shooting isn't hopelessly bad, it's just inconsistent. I wish it were better, but if it were, he would probably be a max player and we wouldn't have gotten him.

He seems to have a knack for hitting clutch 3s in the 4th quarter.

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2019 12:07 am

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:31 pm

Rubio's shot isn't great. But he does have nights when he hits a few 3s to keep the defense honest. His shooting isn't hopelessly bad, it's just inconsistent. I wish it were better, but if it were, he would probably be a max player and we wouldn't have gotten him.

He seems to have a knack for hitting clutch 3s in the 4th quarter.

This got me looking at his splits, and they are pretty telling if not surprising.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/pl ... oting/2020

In wins, he shoots .389 from 3. In losses, he shoots .274.
Home, .393 / Away, .214
3rd Q, .400 / 4th Q, .310
Nov, .385 / Dec, 264

SunsRIt wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:01 pm

The Bobster wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 4:13 pm

He's also a pretty good rebounder for a point guard. Certainly not Fat Lever or Russell Westbrook, but he'll get your 4 or 5 a night.

I saw Fat Lever and Byron Scott play in college at ASU.

1980-81 ASU team had Lever, Scott, Alton Lister and Sam Williams, all of who played in the NBA.
Johnny Nash might have played in the NBA had he not had broken his leg and ankle a season before.

O_Gardino wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2019 8:49 am

JeremyG wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2019 12:07 am

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:31 pm

Rubio's shot isn't great. But he does have nights when he hits a few 3s to keep the defense honest. His shooting isn't hopelessly bad, it's just inconsistent. I wish it were better, but if it were, he would probably be a max player and we wouldn't have gotten him.

He seems to have a knack for hitting clutch 3s in the 4th quarter.

This got me looking at his splits, and they are pretty telling if not surprising.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/pl ... oting/2020

In wins, he shoots .389 from 3. In losses, he shoots .274.
Home, .393 / Away, .214
3rd Q, .400 / 4th Q, .310
Nov, .385 / Dec, 264

Booker's splits are very similar. The Suns win when the backcourt hits 3s. They haven't been hitting in December, and they have struggled in the 4th all year. They do shoot well coming out of halftime.

Telling, if not surprising.

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:31 pm

Rubio's shot isn't great. But he does have nights when he hits a few 3s to keep the defense honest. His shooting isn't hopelessly bad, it's just inconsistent. I wish it were better, but if it were, he would probably be a max player and we wouldn't have gotten him.

It is pretty awful. Besides Baynes, he is the only starter on our team to not hit at least 100 threes in a season for his entire career. I think that says as much about his poor performance as it does about his fear of shooting them. We need our players to take open 3s as part of the offense.

By the way, Cam in on pace to hit 164 3s this year at 40%. Only one player in the history of the league has hit close to that many 3s in their rookie season while playing a reserve role. Landry Shamet hit 167 last year on over 40% in less than 25mpg.

LazarusLong wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2019 9:13 am

SunsRIt wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:01 pm

The Bobster wrote: ↑

Sun Dec 29, 2019 4:13 pm

He's also a pretty good rebounder for a point guard. Certainly not Fat Lever or Russell Westbrook, but he'll get your 4 or 5 a night.

I saw Fat Lever and Byron Scott play in college at ASU.

1980-81 ASU team had Lever, Scott, Alton Lister and Sam Williams, all of who played in the NBA.
Johnny Nash might have played in the NBA had he not had broken his leg and ankle a season before.

That’s the year I went. I was only 10 and still have a few memories of it. I think I still have the program somewhere.