I'm fine with Ayton taking 16 to 20-foot jump shots if he's wide open and hitting around 45% of them like Amar'e did in most of his years as a Sun.
Had to look this up, because 45% seemed too high. You, sir, are correct. Amare had a 7 year run averaging 45% from 10 feet out to the 3pt line. His best season was 50%. That's crazy good.
If James Jones is still GM, I would not be surprised if LeBron finishes his career as a Phoenix Sun.
He just signed a 2 year extension with the Lakers.
We will find a way to trade for him and pay a total of 90M to CP3 and LBJ, similar to how the Nets built a winner around Pierce, KG, Joe Johnson, and Deron Williams. DWade will come out of retirement to play for us and Carmelo will bring the long 2s.
Re: Suns 2020-21 Media Day/Training Camp
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:37 am
by O_Gardino
I hate myself for posting that. Maybe I need to go back to bed.
I'm fine with Ayton taking 16 to 20-foot jump shots if he's wide open and hitting around 45% of them like Amar'e did in most of his years as a Sun.
Sure, but he needs to use the shot to get better shots. Make people cover him there so he can attack the rim.
That's a whole new skill he needs to learn. He can't put the ball on the floor at all.
Ya, if he doesn’t have that skill, I don’t want him shooting mid range shots. At that point he needs to stretch to 3 or roll all the way to the rim. Get out of the mid range if you can’t attack the rim from there.
Ayton is like the poster child for why you can’t trust highlight reels. Everyone on this board knows what Ayton can do, we’ve seen him do all the things in that video. That’s the problem, we want him to do that all the time. Too often he is just content to take 16 foot jumpers, or that baseline fadeaway. Or avoid contact when going to the rim.
He’s supremely talented and could be an absolute monster. Imagine what he could do if he played with aggression at all times? He’d live at the free throw line, he’d create even more open looks for our ball handlers and shooters. He’d be a guy we could just give the ball to and say go make something happen.
I’m happy we have him, I think he’s clearly a valuable player and has a good shot at being a max guy and top 30 guy in the league, but he could be the top C and a top 10 guy if he wants. That’s what we want and why we’re hard on him.
Well said, and the last part is the reason why he will or won't be worth a max contract.
I wanted Doncic so very badly in that draft, but I feel like I've somehow morphed into one of the bigger Ayton defenders on the site. I really like him. He sometimes isn't as furious and aggressive as I wish he could be, but the guy can basically get 18 and 10 in his sleep. And I love how efficient he is, often shooting way over 50%. I recall a lot of 8-for-9 and 11-for-13 type of nights from him. I would be shocked if he ended up not being worth a max contract. Centers like that are pretty rare. As AIG pointed out in his informative post, some of the league's best centers like Embiid and Jokic aren't very far off from Ayton's numbers in most categories. I think I like the overall trajectory of Ayton over almost any center in the NBA other than Jokic, personally. And I think his numbers are going to really soar with CP3 finding him and feeding him lobs and easy baskets. It's going to be a fun season watching Ayton grow and improve.
If he concentrates his offense to mainly attempts below the dotted line, he'd be a monster. He's already a great rebounder and his defense improved beyond what most of us probably expected - and should continue to improve. We just don't need him setting picks 20 feet from the basket (that's on the coaching staff), looking to shoot 15-20 foot jumpers (on Ayton) and being tentative about shooting in the paint (again, on Auton).
That said, I think Paul's shooting and improved floor spacing is going to help Ayton tremendously.
Yep. Then the question will be, is it fools gold or legit.
I’m not looking at stats this year to determine if Ayton is worth the max. The bottom line is, if he doesn’t show growth and fire in dominating the paint on the offensive end and continues to pussy out 15 feet away from the basket, he’s not a max player. He can average 20 and 10 and not be max worthy. You can’t build your franchise around a big man that shoots midrangers.
He needs to dominate the paint. Those 20 points need to come from dunks, post moves, and free throws.
Right. Nobody is saying his stats are not good. Well, except his FTA stats.
I think it's interesting to discuss because the suns will be faced with this decision soon. Basing it off 2019-2020 Ayton I'm not maxing him. Id love to see him start to take over games and being that physically imposing presence we're all hoping he can transform to be.
That is where I am right now too. A lot can change by March, though. I really hope it does and I am eating my words.
I'm fine with Ayton taking 16 to 20-foot jump shots if he's wide open and hitting around 45% of them like Amar'e did in most of his years as a Sun.
Sure, but he needs to use the shot to get better shots. Make people cover him there so he can attack the rim.
That's a whole new skill he needs to learn. He can't put the ball on the floor at all.
Ya, if he doesn’t have that skill, I don’t want him shooting mid range shots. At that point he needs to stretch to 3 or roll all the way to the rim. Get out of the mid range if you can’t attack the rim from there.
That is what can be so frustrating. With his size and athleticism, he should be able to get to the rim with just a couple steps like Giannis.
Re: Suns 2020-21 Media Day/Training Camp
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:24 am
by O_Gardino
I don't think Ayton has the hands to dribble. He can probably develop a move with one dribble and two steps, but not if there is a defender even remotely close.
Re: Suns 2020-21 Media Day/Training Camp
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:26 am
by Split T
He’s flashed that spin move in the paint, but I think that’s usually been off the catch, maybe a 1 dribble move.
I don't think Ayton has the hands to dribble. He can probably develop a move with one dribble and two steps, but not if there is a defender even remotely close.
What do you mean by this? I've seen him dribble, he's not uncapable. He just needs work.
I don't think Ayton has the hands to dribble. He can probably develop a move with one dribble and two steps, but not if there is a defender even remotely close.
What do you mean by this? I've seen him dribble, he's not uncapable. He just needs work.
He bobbles a lot of passes and he bobbles his dribble a lot, too. He can get probably better, but it seems like his hands are less coordinated than his feet.
Watch these bubble highlights. There are a few examples of dribble moves he's capable of, and also a few bobbles. Bear in mind, this is not a scouting video with strengths and weaknesses. This is his best.
1:21 - bobbles a pass, but is able to recover with a bit of dribbling in the post
1:58 - 1 dribble attack from the three point line
3:33 - 1 dribble in the post (after the pass bounces around in his hands)
4:59 - 1 dribble attack from the ft line
8:20 - 1 dribble to a long, wide open jump shot
