Phx-Suns.Net

IMO the KD era has many lessons to offer about team-building. Among them:

- Don't surrender a decade's worth of draft picks for 1-2 supposed star players making max money.
- Don't go into the 2nd apron, basically ever.
- Don't trade away all your fucking 1sts including swaps for a decade. Don't do that!
- Be very careful about how many high-usage offensive players you try to put together. Book, KD, and Beal were all most comfortable being a primary option. Putting those 3 together diminished each of their impact.
- Think about the balance between offensive initiators and finishers on your team. If you have a bunch of finishers and scorers but nobody to start plays or pass or make easy shots for others, you will have a hard time.
- Don't trade for a 36-year-old and expect him to stay at his prime / peak level.
- Don't ever give a player a no-trade clause. Don't ever trade for a player with a no-trade clause!
- You need some hustle guys and attitude guys on a team. If everybody is too mellow, too chill, too calm, you won't have that frantic energy you sometimes need to light a fire under the guys. Always gotta have some dawgs on your team.

What other lessons would you draw from the Unbothered Era?

I love watching just Brooks for multiple entire possessions on both sides of the floor. It's entertainment within the game. He's always chirping, getting physical. I had no idea he was so jacked either. He really helps bring an edge to this team. We would have whimpered and lost that game with our soft roster last season when Indiana started getting physical. We weren't having it last night and it starts with Brooks and rubs off on others.

Never thought I'd say that about him. I love watching him cause other stars to blow up and get a technical as well. Just have to keep those technicals tight so he doesn't start getting suspensions.

I like this guy's style. Similar to Monty's "don't get happy on the farm."

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 1:11 pm

IMO the KD era has many lessons to offer about team-building. Among them:

- Don't surrender a decade's worth of draft picks for 1-2 supposed star players making max money.
- Don't go into the 2nd apron, basically ever.
- Don't trade away all your fucking 1sts including swaps for a decade. Don't do that!
- Be very careful about how many high-usage offensive players you try to put together. Book, KD, and Beal were all most comfortable being a primary option. Putting those 3 together diminished each of their impact.
- Think about the balance between offensive initiators and finishers on your team. If you have a bunch of finishers and scorers but nobody to start plays or pass or make easy shots for others, you will have a hard time.
- Don't trade for a 36-year-old and expect him to stay at his prime / peak level.
- Don't ever give a player a no-trade clause. Don't ever trade for a player with a no-trade clause!
- You need some hustle guys and attitude guys on a team. If everybody is too mellow, too chill, too calm, you won't have that frantic energy you sometimes need to light a fire under the guys. Always gotta have some dawgs on your team.

What other lessons would you draw from the Unbothered Era?

Those are all very good lessons I hope Mat has learned. He was all bravado about the 2nd apron and it backfired spectacularly. All of the NBA knows this now. And we had the type of players in our "new" alignment before he blew it up with the KD and Beal trades. Now we are back to it but without the draft picks. I hope he can continue to recover by picking up some picks along the way.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 1:18 pm

Mori Chu wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 1:11 pm

IMO the KD era has many lessons to offer about team-building. Among them:

- Don't surrender a decade's worth of draft picks for 1-2 supposed star players making max money.
- Don't go into the 2nd apron, basically ever.
- Don't trade away all your fucking 1sts including swaps for a decade. Don't do that!
- Be very careful about how many high-usage offensive players you try to put together. Book, KD, and Beal were all most comfortable being a primary option. Putting those 3 together diminished each of their impact.
- Think about the balance between offensive initiators and finishers on your team. If you have a bunch of finishers and scorers but nobody to start plays or pass or make easy shots for others, you will have a hard time.
- Don't trade for a 36-year-old and expect him to stay at his prime / peak level.
- Don't ever give a player a no-trade clause. Don't ever trade for a player with a no-trade clause!
- You need some hustle guys and attitude guys on a team. If everybody is too mellow, too chill, too calm, you won't have that frantic energy you sometimes need to light a fire under the guys. Always gotta have some dawgs on your team.

What other lessons would you draw from the Unbothered Era?

Those are all very good lessons I hope Mat has learned. He was all bravado about the 2nd apron and it backfired spectacularly. All of the NBA knows this now. And we had the type of players in our "new" alignment before he blew it up with the KD and Beal trades. Now we are back to it but without the draft picks. I hope he can continue to recover by picking up some picks along the way.

Not to play revisionist history, but I think KD and Book, with a better team around them, would have done quite well. Hell, they took the Nuggets to 6 games without Ayton and CP3. If they had surrounded them with better role players, I think they would have been dangerous. The Beal trade is what destroyed the next few years.

But to Mori's original post-very well said and basically agree on all accounts.

Agree with that - I also think they needed a tough coach that KD would respect. Vogel was too goofy and Bud was checked out. That's where Ime comes into play for Houston.

And we did see a boost on the court when Dunn and CG were out there last year but Bud never gave CG any real run and then benched Dunn for no reason. It wouldn't have made much difference with those rosters but it was doable.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 11:19 am

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 6:04 am

Sucks no Mark Williams but I think tonight is a win if we out score them.

Hey, look at that. Your prognostications are SO much better when you do them after the game.

???

AmareIsGod wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 1:11 pm

I love watching just Brooks for multiple entire possessions on both sides of the floor. It's entertainment within the game. He's always chirping, getting physical. I had no idea he was so jacked either. He really helps bring an edge to this team. We would have whimpered and lost that game with our soft roster last season when Indiana started getting physical. We weren't having it last night and it starts with Brooks and rubs off on others.

Never thought I'd say that about him. I love watching him cause other stars to blow up and get a technical as well. Just have to keep those technicals tight so he doesn't start getting suspensions.

I've also noticed that when things start to get to get chippy whether it's Brooks or someone else that the other guys step in to get between whoever it is to not only keep it from getting out of hand but also to defend their team mate. In other words they have each others back.

Superbone wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 12:53 pm

Maybe KD for Dillon Brooks isn't such a bad trade straight up? DB (I didn't realize we had two DBs until I saw Brook's necklace) has brought an intensity to the Suns that is the complete opposite of KD's chill. Plus, he's 8 years younger. He's a much better influence on Book, I know that.

Booker seems re-energized and I think Brooks (and Green too) are a big part of that. We were talking before this season that Booker was no longer an All Star caliber player, that his best years were behind him. It sure doesn't seem like that anymore. I said before we needed a dog on this team like that one player whose name I can never remember that pushed CP3 in the back. Brooks is like him on steroids but also a great team mate and also a really good player. Yeah I think we scored on that trade.

I think KD hate with Suns fans was always a little much. Dude was a good soldier here, wanted to stay a Sun, we failed him more than he failed us imo. The failings of the past two years should be mostly be directed at Matty Ish and front office( neponbaby Josh Bartelstein especially) with their Horrible roster building, hired the wrong coach, TWICE!?? Colluding for Drew Eubanks???!! Wtf.

Not saying the players should be blameless but to me, the locker room cancer was clearly Beal. Dude was all talk, not a serious player about winning. Maybe once upon a time he was, but he wasn’t with us. His comments throughout the season, and pot shots at us with the clippers, shown as much.


Trading for Chris Paul was one of the best moves in franchise history… trading him away for Bradley Beal might’ve one of the worst.

My memory isn't the sharpest on this, but it feels like we've had one blow out win in all of the last 2 or 3 seasons combined.

I've enjoyed watching the few 20+ point drubbings we've delivered this year.

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 10:17 pm

I think KD hate with Suns fans was always a little much. Dude was a good soldier here, wanted to stay a Sun, we failed him more than he failed us imo. The failings of the past two years should be mostly be directed at Matty Ish and front office( neponbaby Josh Bartelstein especially) with their Horrible roster building, hired the wrong coach, TWICE!?? Colluding for Drew Eubanks???!! Wtf.

Not saying the players should be blameless but to me, the locker room cancer was clearly Beal. Dude was all talk, not a serious player about winning. Maybe once upon a time he was, but he wasn’t with us. His comments throughout the season, and pot shots at us with the clippers, shown as much.


Trading for Chris Paul was one of the best moves in franchise history… trading him away for Bradley Beal might’ve one of the worst.

Respectfully disagree. KD is obviously an all time great player, and I swear this is not clickbait, but I think he's just a better shooting TMac. If he hadn't gone to a 73 win team, I don't think he ends his career with any titles.

Wally_West wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 14, 2025 10:17 pm

I think KD hate with Suns fans was always a little much. Dude was a good soldier here, wanted to stay a Sun, we failed him more than he failed us imo. The failings of the past two years should be mostly be directed at Matty Ish and front office( neponbaby Josh Bartelstein especially) with their Horrible roster building, hired the wrong coach, TWICE!?? Colluding for Drew Eubanks???!! Wtf.

Not saying the players should be blameless but to me, the locker room cancer was clearly Beal. Dude was all talk, not a serious player about winning. Maybe once upon a time he was, but he wasn’t with us. His comments throughout the season, and pot shots at us with the clippers, shown as much.


Trading for Chris Paul was one of the best moves in franchise history… trading him away for Bradley Beal might’ve one of the worst.

I think KD was a pretty good soldier when he was here as a Sun, for the most part. He was either our best or co-best (with Booker) player for those two seasons. I don't think "we failed him" so much as, we gave up way too much to get him and therefore couldn't build a good team around him and Booker. It might have been possible to build a better team despite our very limited assets; as you say, the Paul-for-Beal trade was what really completely sunk the team.

But I think the real problem is that we just let KD become the de facto team leader and team PG, bringing the ball up a lot and initiating our offense. That led to a bunch of problems: KD's handles weren't what they used to be, so he would get stripped or turn the ball over a lot; it would marginalize Booker by having Book just stand around waiting for a pass from KD; it reduced the effectiveness of guys like Allen and O'Neale because KD didn't have the passing and playmaking skills to get them great open shots. All of that ruined our offensive flow, and we had acquired almost entirely offensive players, so our bad D wasn't enough to keep up. I remember so many games where it was basically over after the 1st quarter, where we'd already be down 18 points after the 1st. Extremely frustrating.

And even though KD was a good soldier while he he was here, he became a total bitch when it came to trade discussions and post-trade behavior. He seems to have rejected multiple trades that would have helped the Suns, telling the other team not to trade for him and tanking his value. And now that he's gone, he talks trash about us repeatedly. Because of that, I now dislike the guy, want him to lose, and consider him a little bitch.

I honestly don’t get why anyone would think that the Beal trade sank us. Yes he had a no trade clause and that was a major bitch but he only cost us CP3 who was over the hill and a bunch of 2nd round picks. KD trade was the one that actually cleaned our entire cupboard.

I didn’t like the KD trade at the time and still don’t like it today. KD put up numbers but he did not deliver anywhere near the type of value one would expect from their number one star. Did we have roster issues? Yes we did. But as a number one star KD is deeply flawed and he’s pretty unaware in terms of his impact on a team of players that look up to him. Luckily for Houston they have some tough minded people on their team, starting with Ime.

KD wasn't a good soldier. He was the guy snickering and rolling his eyes at the coaches because he didn't like them and because of that it filtered down to the rest of the team. He'd be doing the same thing with Ott if he were still on the roster.

It was literally almost all of our 2nds, and seeing how much they get you these days, would’ve been great to have and don’t forget it was pick swaps too. Why the Beal trade was most crippling in my eyes is it tied us up in the 2nd Apron what would’ve been multiple years. Chris Paul’s contract was literally about to expire. Just letting CP’s contract expire would’ve let us out of both aprons, there was flexibility we could’ve kept that vanished with the Beal Trade.

Could’ve combined salary, take on more salary, Full MLE when his contract expired.

Also giving up Too Many Cameras in the Ayton trade. YUCK! If we didn’t blow our load of 2nds and pick swaps be probably could’ve kept him out of the Ayton trade. Still have Grayson and him. *sigh*.

Finally got some time to watch the whole game
Well expect the power outage during our 4th quarter run tsk

I will piggy back on what I saw someone else mention about physicality.
We definitely folded countless times over the last seasons when teams played aggressive and it's cool to be on the other side of it tbh
I don't think many teams going to enjoy playing against us

We will face tougher opponents that are "deeper, more talented" but I think it's safe to say we are not going to Play Down to the level of teams this season

These guys only know how to play one way and this relentless attitude throughout the current squad is great

Not saying the Beal trade was not bad but once you pull the trigger on the KD trade there was no turning back. Ishbia was never going to just let CP3 expire. On paper Beal was better than anybody else we could’ve gotten for those seconds.

Think Camara was in the trade for salary reasons. It wasn’t that Portland saw something in him and wanted him or else.

pickle wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 15, 2025 8:20 am

I honestly don’t get why anyone would think that the Beal trade sank us. Yes he had a no trade clause and that was a major bitch but he only cost us CP3 who was over the hill and a bunch of 2nd round picks. KD trade was the one that actually cleaned our entire cupboard.

It’s less about what we gave up and more about what we weren’t able to do after the trade. It locked us into the 2nd apron and took away any potential trade assets we had.

I was in favor of the move at the time because we literally just took Denver to 6 with Book/KD and Shamet as our next best player. I thought adding Beal would certainly be an upgrade, but we should have realized we had the offense and focused on surrounding those 2 with the guys who would do the dirty work. We ended up with a team full of guys who wanted to be the 1st option on offense and the last option on defense(hide in the worst player).