Suns Fire Frank Vogel

[Flagrant Fowl]

Jevon Carter? Com'on bro.

Giannis Antetokounmpo has averaged 35.2 points, 13.2 rebounds and 5.0 assists in 6 games in the NBA Finals in his career.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/gianni ... nals-stats

He fucking dominated.

[Gladiator]

Think Jevon comment was more meaning to put him on Jrue or Middleton?

[Flagrant Fowl]

I know. My response is that he wouldn't have made a difference at all.

Well, maybe a negative difference for the Suns.

[Furlanfufi]

I know. My response is that he wouldn't have made a difference at all.

Well, maybe a negative difference for the Suns.

In that game, have we disrupted Bucks offense, we would be one win from the title. Not much we could do about Giannis on the series, but (I think that was game 4) that game would have made a lot of a difference being the game Giannis wasn't stellar.

[JeremyG]

PLAY RANDOM

I remember that and how he seemed so lackadaisical and like he didn’t even care as they fell to 0-2 in the series, and everyone called him the worst coach in Finals history.

But perhaps the rest of the series proved us all wrong. He was better than Monty at least.

He does seem a little too laid back like Vogel, though.

Billups is more of the Chris Paul type.

OR.. Hear me out here, he had the best player in the series who dominated his opponent. I don't think coaching had a whole lot of an impact on how that series turned out.

That (along with the Suns choking) is why I said “perhaps,” as I am still unconvinced he’s a great coach. Although I do believe he outcoached Monty in that series. There’s no excuse for losing a series when you’re up 2-0.

[Gladiator]

I know. My response is that he wouldn't have made a difference at all.

Well, maybe a negative difference for the Suns.

Sorry, misunderstood

[Superbone]

You lost me at Malika Andrews.

What’s wrong with Malika?

[Flagrant Fowl]

PLAY RANDOM

Spoiler: show/hide

I remember that and how he seemed so lackadaisical and like he didn’t even care as they fell to 0-2 in the series, and everyone called him the worst coach in Finals history.

But perhaps the rest of the series proved us all wrong. He was better than Monty at least.

He does seem a little too laid back like Vogel, though.

Billups is more of the Chris Paul type.

OR.. Hear me out here, he had the best player in the series who dominated his opponent. I don't think coaching had a whole lot of an impact on how that series turned out.

That (along with the Suns choking) is why I said “perhaps,” as I am still unconvinced he’s a great coach. Although I do believe he outcoached Monty in that series. There’s no excuse for losing a series when you’re up 2-0.

We don't need to rehash the entire Finals so I'll just end my part by saying that I don't think anyone was outcoached in that series. The players on the court won and lost it.

[SunsRIt]

You lost me at Malika Andrews.

What’s wrong with Malika?

Remember Rachel Nichols?

[Superbone]

You lost me at Malika Andrews.

What’s wrong with Malika?

Remember Rachel Nichols?

I do. I remember her getting in trouble.

[TOO]

Nobody liked Rachel Nichols, I don't even know where she's at anymore.

[iLLmatic]

It’s the same exact situation as last summer. Do we hire Budenholzer (the coach with championship experience) or Billups (the coach that Durant and Booker want)?

We saw how not hiring the players’ choice went this last season. But will giving them what they want result in success?

A lot of the folks here wanted Bud when we got Monty. They ended up playing each other in the Finals. Monty went into the Buck's locker room. It's only fair that Bud comes into ours. Plus, he's an Arizona guy from Holbrook.

Where the hell is that?

[JeremyG]

It’s the same exact situation as last summer. Do we hire Budenholzer (the coach with championship experience) or Billups (the coach that Durant and Booker want)?

We saw how not hiring the players’ choice went this last season. But will giving them what they want result in success?

A lot of the folks here wanted Bud when we got Monty. They ended up playing each other in the Finals. Monty went into the Buck's locker room. It's only fair that Bud comes into ours. Plus, he's an Arizona guy from Holbrook.

Where the hell is that?

20 minutes north of Woodruff.

[Split T]

I leave the country and it all happens…too busy to know what to think…but Bud did seem like the best option available. I’m cool with it.

[Kryptonic]

I've never been a fan of letting your players dictate your coaching hire. You hire the best coach for your franchise, those player won't be around forever.

True, but the fact that it looks more and more like KD and Booker sabotaged the season due to a hire they didn’t like makes me think we either need to change the roster or hire the coach they want.

Just saying…. If they did sabotage the season then I’d want them gone too.

[JeremyG]

I've never been a fan of letting your players dictate your coaching hire. You hire the best coach for your franchise, those player won't be around forever.

True, but the fact that it looks more and more like KD and Booker sabotaged the season due to a hire they didn’t like makes me think we either need to change the roster or hire the coach they want.

Just saying…. If they did sabotage the season then I’d want them gone too.

Yes, I’m leaning towards the first option (“change the roster”). But it looks like they’re gonna keep the big 3 and try again with a different coach. One that will supposedly “hold them accountable.” That means nothing if they once again don’t buy in.

[Drewsprocket]

I've never been a fan of letting your players dictate your coaching hire. You hire the best coach for your franchise, those player won't be around forever.

True, but the fact that it looks more and more like KD and Booker sabotaged the season due to a hire they didn’t like makes me think we either need to change the roster or hire the coach they want.

Just saying…. If they did sabotage the season then I’d want them gone too.

I don’t think there is a shred of evidence of SABOTAGE. What does that even mean based upon what we saw? Just sounds like the emotional pangs of a fan.

[TOO]

Sabotage isn't the right word, but players not doing what the coach asks of them isn't a great look. If Vogel was asking them to shoot more 3s and they willingly didn't, that's on the the players for not doing their job.

[Kryptonic]

I've never been a fan of letting your players dictate your coaching hire. You hire the best coach for your franchise, those player won't be around forever.

True, but the fact that it looks more and more like KD and Booker sabotaged the season due to a hire they didn’t like makes me think we either need to change the roster or hire the coach they want.

Just saying…. If they did sabotage the season then I’d want them gone too.

I don’t think there is a shred of evidence of SABOTAGE. What does that even mean based upon what we saw? Just sounds like the emotional pangs of a fan.

Yea, I'm not sold on them sabotaging anything and hadn't seen that but IF it was the situation I'd want them gone.

[Drewsprocket]

I've never been a fan of letting your players dictate your coaching hire. You hire the best coach for your franchise, those player won't be around forever.

True, but the fact that it looks more and more like KD and Booker sabotaged the season due to a hire they didn’t like makes me think we either need to change the roster or hire the coach they want.

Just saying…. If they did sabotage the season then I’d want them gone too.

I don’t think there is a shred of evidence of SABOTAGE. What does that even mean based upon what we saw? Just sounds like the emotional pangs of a fan.

Yea, I'm not sold on them sabotaging anything and hadn't seen that but IF it was the situation I'd want them gone.

Discussion flies off the rails when we pour over the silly narratives the likes of Stephen A Smith and Perk and Sharpe spew. It’s nott basketball talk, just emotional reactions for viewership. I don’t need a villain to blame. We’re disappointed because the transition from the winning system from a healthy-ish CP3 and co had to this Big 3 lineup. They didn’t meet expectations- so we got big fingers to point all around: poor coaching, KD and Book, Beal’s injuries, no point guard, Ishbia did too much.
The blame isn’t really easily reduced to a single point. but the cries over stars being babies or not being accountable isn’t very basketball oriented. Minnesota exposed the obvious with our offense and dismantled us.