All Things Ayton

[ShelC]

Not for nothing, but is there any doubt we were right to hold firm and not give him the full $185m max deal he wanted?

Of course, one could argue that not giving him the full max is what made him feel slighted by the org and caused him to check out and be disengaged. One could make that argument, if one were so inclined.

[JeremyG]

Beal next? They may finally get to be teammates after all

[Vladimir_Taltos]

It's BACKKKKKK....

[AmareIsGod]

You guys are reaching here…I’ll remind you again that he’s on a 2-way. Is it an agent favor? Ya probably. Livers missed all of last season and this is his chance to get a toe back in. I think this is one of those times where the Michigan connection is a coincidence. We haven’t shown any actual favoritism to Michigan based players…otherwise Jase Richardson would be on our team.

Yeah, but no need to waste a roster spot of any kind as a favor to Bartelstein. What has he done for us lately, besides destroy our team with Beal?

Also, I would say giving $150M to a mediocre franchise player instead of trading him could be called favoritism.

Booker has been here 10+ years…it’s weird if you try to use him as a Michigan connection.

Don't forget who you're talking to, a non Suns fan, you're wasting your time.

Ayton > Booker. Ayton is the real franchise player we should have kept. A real leader. Inspiring with his work ethic. Booker = trash.

[specialsauce]

You guys are reaching here…I’ll remind you again that he’s on a 2-way. Is it an agent favor? Ya probably. Livers missed all of last season and this is his chance to get a toe back in. I think this is one of those times where the Michigan connection is a coincidence. We haven’t shown any actual favoritism to Michigan based players…otherwise Jase Richardson would be on our team.

Yeah, but no need to waste a roster spot of any kind as a favor to Bartelstein. What has he done for us lately, besides destroy our team with Beal?

Also, I would say giving $150M to a mediocre franchise player instead of trading him could be called favoritism.

Booker has been here 10+ years…it’s weird if you try to use him as a Michigan connection.

Don't forget who you're talking to, a non Suns fan, you're wasting your time.

Ayton > Booker. Ayton is the real franchise player we should have kept. A real leader. Inspiring with his work ethic. Booker = trash.

Yall really gonna derail another thread with unrelated shots over JG saying he doesn't think Book earned $150M?

I don't think Book is worth it either. I would have traded him and started over too. It's not that rare of a take. Not because I don't like Booker, but because I don't think him taking that much of our cap space lends itself to room to build a contender. But we had no choice, you rather give him the extension or trade him.

[AmareIsGod]

Yeah, but no need to waste a roster spot of any kind as a favor to Bartelstein. What has he done for us lately, besides destroy our team with Beal?

Also, I would say giving $150M to a mediocre franchise player instead of trading him could be called favoritism.

Booker has been here 10+ years…it’s weird if you try to use him as a Michigan connection.

Don't forget who you're talking to, a non Suns fan, you're wasting your time.

Ayton > Booker. Ayton is the real franchise player we should have kept. A real leader. Inspiring with his work ethic. Booker = trash.

Yall really gonna derail another thread with unrelated shots over JG saying he doesn't think Book earned $150M?

I don't think Book is worth it either. I would have traded him and started over too. It's not that rare of a take. Not because I don't like Booker, but because I don't think him taking that much of our cap space lends itself to room to build a contender. But we had no choice, you rather give him the extension or trade him.

Booker wasn't mediocre until his buddy KD joined the team and really lowered the entire team and their level of effort. If Booker could be impacted that easily, it could be argued he's not worth it as a franchise player. I think the youth movement will return his value as a real franchise player and he won't have to play Robin to Batman and can be the alpha with younger players. To your point, we didn't have a lot of choice and trading him would definitely burn what remains of the bridge Ishbia is clinging to with the fans.

[specialsauce]

Booker has been here 10+ years…it’s weird if you try to use him as a Michigan connection.

Don't forget who you're talking to, a non Suns fan, you're wasting your time.

Ayton > Booker. Ayton is the real franchise player we should have kept. A real leader. Inspiring with his work ethic. Booker = trash.

Yall really gonna derail another thread with unrelated shots over JG saying he doesn't think Book earned $150M?

I don't think Book is worth it either. I would have traded him and started over too. It's not that rare of a take. Not because I don't like Booker, but because I don't think him taking that much of our cap space lends itself to room to build a contender. But we had no choice, you rather give him the extension or trade him.

Booker wasn't mediocre until his buddy KD joined the team and really lowered the entire team and their level of effort. If Booker could be impacted that easily, it could be argued he's not worth it as a franchise player. I think the youth movement will return his value as a real franchise player and he won't have to play Robin to Batman and can be the alpha with younger players. To your point, we didn't have a lot of choice and trading him would definitely burn what remains of the bridge Ishbia is clinging to with the fans.

I don't think Booker can be the #1 on a contender.

CP3 was the real leader and voice of the locker room. Book is too emotional, too impulsive, gets in his own head when things start to fail. We've seen him take stupid fouls when he's gotten flustered in the past. He needs that alpha #1 beside him. He may be the homegrown face but he needs someone to control the room and I don't think that's worthy of a supermax.

[Split T]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

[Charlie Smithy!]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

Holy shit...

[TOO]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

Holy shit...

Big if true.

[Charlie Smithy!]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

Holy shit...

Big if true.

Love, hurts.

[Charlie Smithy!]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

Lord, I hope not

[Split T]

Ayton with no motor/love of the game issues…or aversion to contact.

[Mori Chu]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

I think this post is a good illustration of why we will be really bad, likely one of the worst teams in the league next year. You're taking the bubble Suns, who did not make the playoffs, and replacing essentially every listed rotation player with a likely worse, much younger and more inexperienced and unproven, replacement. Some of our current guys may turn out to be stars, but if you look at the lineup as a whole, there are a lot of guys there who are huge question marks or probably not ready to contribute in the ways that the right-side players did.

It would be a miracle if half these guys panned were as good this coming season as their listed bubble counterparts. Maluach as good as Ayton? Dunn becoming as good as Mikal? Fleming as good as CamJ? Etc. This is a very-best-case scenario and unlikely. If it happened, it'd be a miracle. Nobody would be happier than me. But even if it did happen, that would be a team that missed the playoffs. That's the strength of the league and the kind of challenges we'll be up against for the next few years.

[TOO]

We’re a long way off from being a contender anyways, so I don’t think it matters. The move is to try and turn this into a good team again and then strike if someone who can make us a contender becomes available again. We are the bubble suns again…

Booker is our Booker
Ott is our Monty
Maluach is our Ayton
Dunn is our Mikal
Fleming/Brea are our CamJ
Brooks is our Oubre
Green is a wildcard.

Guess we need our Rubio still.

But point is, we just need to have fun, play hard, and exceed expectations…the current roster won’t grow into a contender, but maybe it can grow into a good team and we can find our CP3 to turn us into a contender again.

I think this post is a good illustration of why we will be really bad, likely one of the worst teams in the league next year. You're taking the bubble Suns, who did not make the playoffs, and replacing essentially every listed rotation player with a likely worse, much younger and more inexperienced and unproven, replacement. Some of our current guys may turn out to be stars, but if you look at the lineup as a whole, there are a lot of guys there who are huge question marks or probably not ready to contribute in the ways that the right-side players did.

It would be a miracle if half these guys panned were as good this coming season as their listed bubble counterparts. Maluach as good as Ayton? Dunn becoming as good as Mikal? Fleming as good as CamJ? Etc. This is a very-best-case scenario and unlikely. If it happened, it'd be a miracle. Nobody would be happier than me. But even if it did happen, that would be a team that missed the playoffs. That's the strength of the league and the kind of challenges we'll be up against for the next few years.

[Split T]

Well I also left off Mark Williams who is certainly comparable to year 2 Ayton…probably better. I also left off Grayson Allen who was better than rookie CamJ. I left off Royce. Jalen Green didn’t have a counterpart. Dillon Brooks is better than Kelly Oubre(in fact that’s who we really wanted anyways).

I agree that we likely won’t be that good next year, but I don’t agree with how far away you think we are. 2nd year Ayton, 2nd year Mikal, rookie CamJ…these guys weren’t that good. I don’t think it’s crazy at all for our current guys to be as good.

Mikal averaged 9/4/2 and shot 36% from 3
Cam averaged 9/3/1…he did shoot 39% from 3
Ayton was 18/12, but only played 38 games and lowest fg% of his career.
Oubre did give us 19/6, but didn’t even play in the bubble.


If Booker bounces back, Mark Williams gives us what 15/10, and Brooks/Allen/Royce and whoever else we add are solid vets, all it really takes is one of those other guys hitting(Green, Dunn, NHD, Fleming, Maluach) and we have a feisty team that can push for the play in…not unlike the bubble suns.

Then who knows, maybe in a year or 2 we trade Green/Brooks and a 1st for a slightly over the hill star with a few good years left who wants to join in on the fun.

It’s not a super promising future, but if you want to build around Booker, it’s probably your best shot.

[TOO]

It's a pretty promising future tbh, Williams, Green, Dunn, Oso, Maluach, Fleming are all 23 or younger, that's a whole lot better than the future we need last season with

[JeremyG]

Remember all those years when Charles Barkley would say about the Thunder: “They have a bright future. Unfortunately, we live in the present.”

[Split T]

It's a pretty promising future tbh, Williams, Green, Dunn, Oso, Maluach, Fleming are all 23 or younger, that's a whole lot better than the future we need last season with

Better than last season for sure…but there’s still a lot of question marks there…I think this year will tell us a lot on where this team is going.

[Split T]

Remember all those years when Charles Barkley would say about the Thunder: “They have a bright future. Unfortunately, we live in the present.”

Well the Thunder did win a title